Y2Jimmy0

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 09:17 AM) You are essentially trading two quality major leaguers for one good prospect and two fringe guys. I think there is a better deal to be had splitting the two up. Kingham is not a fringe guy. Probably the 3rd best pitching prospect in that system. He's a good get. I'd rather have position players though. It's a moot point because neither Rios or Ramirez is netting the White Sox someone like Polanco.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 10:08 AM) Because of Dayan's age and potential, he'll be around next season...they would be pretty crazy to give up on him right now...and they'd be selling way too low. Also, if Conor can hit 15 homers per season, that's enough to be an adequate or average MLB 3B, along with Keppinger (if he's not dealt) in a platoon, that should be good for 725-750 overall OPS. So while that's not exactly a position of strength, but it's not the biggest weakness right now, either. And then the ongoing Phegley/Flowers situation. Yeah I forgot about Viciedo. Obviously, he will be here because he is only 24. However, he needs to be a lot better. Even with the HR #'s last year he had a horrible offensive season. I am not trying to pick a fight with you but I asked for the Sox position players that will matter on the next good team. If those guys are Beckham, Phegley, Gillaspie, and Viciedo the White Sox are in a world of trouble.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 11, 2013 -> 10:02 AM) His whole approach at the plate, his K rate, his walk rate, the fact that he seems more concerned with lifting the ball into the air and pulling now instead of accepting the pitch where it is thrown....his total inability to make good decisions on the basepaths, etc. He's just not a leadoff hitter anymore, and he shouldn't be playing CF, either....so he's a defensive liability and his enigmatic mental game has offset anything he's contributed offensively. He's the perfect 4th outfielder on a great team...or a playoff team, even. De Aza could be a LF on a team though. For example, let's say a team has a good leadoff hitter that plays 2B/SS. The team also has a CF that hits in the middle of the lineup. De Aza could be really good as a #8 or #9 hitter. His offensive numbers are not that different than Alex Rios' offensive numbers honestly. De Aza annoys me too but if he wasn't leading off and playing CF he actually brings something to the table. I think De Aza could hit you 15-18 homers in the 9 spot and get on base at a .330 clip.

Lots of good discussion on this thread. Many people on the compete next year side. Many people on the true rebuild side. I think it will be somewhere in the middle. I don't think this is a good baseball team. However, the White Sox have good young starting pitching. Most teams with pitching don't have to truly rebuild. The problem is, who are the position players on this team the next time the Sox are good? Gordon Beckham? While he is having a good year, he is a #8 hitter probably. Hopefully Phegley is the catcher but there is an equal chance that he's bad. That is it. They have some intriguing options on the farm but none that will be ready to go soon. I also don't think going into the free agent market next year is the right move or the move that this team will make. I don't think keeping what the Sox currently have and adding a FA Of and 1B automatically puts this team into contention. They have to get younger. That won't happen with just Lindstrom, Crain, and Thornton getting moved though. This is the opportune time to move Rios, Peavy, De Aza, Ramirez, Dunn and whoever else you can. Obviosuly, you don't have to trade any of them though. The relief pitchers are the only guys that are essential to trade but those guys just aren't going to bring back a monster haul. This is a tough rebuilding process. I have seen Santiago mentioned a lot. Ideally, they could move Danks and keep Sale, Quintana, and Santiago. Probably can't happen though. What would it take for you to trade a Santiago? Unlikely but would you trade Santiago to LAA for Trumbo? Do you the Sox need more than that? I feel like they need to get 2 position players that will be starters and a young live arm in return. Santiago is a valuable piece that I hope they don't just dump.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 05:17 PM) Honestly, if that's all we can get for Rios AND Alexei then count me out. You know once it gets closer to the trade deadline, teams will get desperate. Only reason I say this is because if this whole Biogenesis operation is true and players to get suspended. The Rangers are a team that takes a hit and would be very desperate for a right fielder, and Rios is the best available. Wait for that and make a team overpay. As for trading Sale, for me it has to be an absolutely ridiculous deal with my 2 teams I would trade him to are the Cardinals and DBacks. Sale & Alexei to Cardinals for Adams, Wacha, Wong, Martiniez, Taverez, Tilson and Piscotty Sale & Rios to the DBacks for Skaggs, Bradley, Eaton, Davidson, Owings, Holmberg, Lamb and Chafin. It would take a lot, but teams would not deplete their systems for this. Polanco is a better prospect than anyone you are getting for Rios or Ramirez. The kid may end being better than McCutchen and Marte and moving McCutchen to a corner spot. I am pretty sure Pittsburgh would just acquire a Nate Schierholtz type if the Sox are asking for Polanco. Not going to happen.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 04:31 PM) if you do it, you send the message that you are rebuilding for the long term, and not the short term, and you have to live with those consequences as a White Sox organization that is still marred by the history of White Flag. It can send whatever message it wants. If it nets a team that wins the World Series then nobody will care. Win consistently. They are a Chicago team in a division full of teams that will have small payrolls (Minus Detroit). Make trades that get you closer to winning a world series. If trading Sale gets you closer to a World Series then you make the trade. You don't not make the trade because the fanbase might get upset. Initially, Sox fans might cry about dealing Sale. If the product nets you three position players under 6 years of control and 2 starting pitchers that help the Sox go on a 5-7 year run of sustained success, I am pretty sure nobody will care that they traded one of the best pitchers in baseball to do it.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 04:26 PM) Wacha, Taveras Maybe to start with. Then add: Matt Adams, Carlos Martinez, and Kolten Wong.

QUOTE (Baron @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 04:11 PM) I would want to decimate Texas's farm for Sale...thats what it would take for me. Exactly. Look at these deals. Two years ago: Cincinnati received RHP Mat Latos from San Diego. They gave up: 1B Yonder Alonso, C Yasmani Grandal, RHP Edinson Volquez, and RHP Brad Boxburger. Also: Arizona received RHP Dan Haren. Oakland receives: Pitchers Brett Anderson, Dana Eveland, Greg Smith, 1B Chris Carter, and OF's Carlos Gonzalez and Aaron Cunningham. Haren had 2 years remaining on his deal at the time. Sale would command a package even bigger than either of those deals. Sale is under team control for the next 7 seasons. This is what a potential haul would have to look like from Texas in order to make it plausible SS Jurickson Profar 3B Mike Olt LHP Martin Perez RHP Justin Grimm 3B Joey Gallo That is a trade that Texas would never make. The White Sox on the other hand would have to make that deal. There are maybe only 5 teams in baseball capable of giving up a haul like that. None of those teams would be willing to do so however.

Jeff Passan ‏@JeffPassan 9m While there is incentive to trade Chris Sale, as @Ken_Rosenthal suggested, two execs said White Sox have shown no indication he's available. Jeff Passan ‏@JeffPassan 9m That said, there is enough chatter among scouts that White Sox would deal Sale for right package that Sox GM Rick Hahn will get calls on it. Do you think this information is out there because the White Sox want it out there? Not that they want to trade him but I think it doesn't hurt to listen to all offers. Ken Rosenthal has always been a White Sox guy. Kenny Williams likes Rosenthal and has given him information in the past. Probably far-fetched but it made me wonder.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 12:01 PM) I still can't believe the Sox were dumb enough to have this discussion. As fathom put it the other day, "the worst personnel decision made all year". Thankfully, he got his chance anysays. Well, im not actually thankful considering why You can't believe it? These are the same guys that made the decision to put Chris Sale in the bullpen last year.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 03:29 PM) team option, i think he will get a 500K buyout....he's GONE But he won't be here. How much is the option for? A team trading him could look at him as a guy that they also get next year.

QUOTE (Paulstar @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 03:14 PM) Risking 15 mil a year on Ellsbury for 5 years wouldn't be the worse move. Sure would be a hell of a whole lot better than spending that type of money on B.J. Upton. However, I do agree that some team is gonna spend stupid money on him. As another poster put it, he likely get paid more than what he can earn. I think Ellsbury ends up in Seattle. 6 years $100 million.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 03:16 PM) Fine, the simplest argument of all. Is there ANYONE besides Braves' fans and Greg Walker who are going to tune in specifically to watch Freddie Freeman get one AB and maybe 2-3 innings on the field? This I actually agree with. It's an exhibition game. Puig should be there. Maybe if every team did not get a damn representative then they'd both go. Either way it's not the end of the world. It's a dumbass All Star Game that in my opinion was made irrelevant as soon as interleague play started.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 02:56 PM) Bryce Brentz please. Probably a lot more realistic than Bradley. He's got big time power and can take over for Rios if he's traded. Brentz would be a nice get. QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 02:57 PM) I could see the Sox interested in Brandon Workman. He was someone they were linked with when he was available in the draft. I believe Workman was just called up to big leagues. Showcasing?

QUOTE (flavum @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 03:12 PM) https://twitter.com/DanHayesCSN/status/355055545486544896 "price for Thornton is steep". Um, ok. I tweeted him and asked about that. Hayes responded to me that Thornton has an option for next year. I thought he was free at year's end.

Nick Cafardo ‏@nickcafardo 10m The Red Sox are looking everywhere for relief. Interested in White Sox trio Addison Reed, Matt Thornton and Matt Lindstrom.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 01:39 PM) I still hate Buddy Bell, and listening to that interview of 22 minutes made it even worse. I also hate Braves and Blue Jays fans, for all the collusion going on with All-Star votes this week. Didn't the Sox team up with LA or SF one year to get one of their guys in the game? I think they did.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 01:16 PM) Buster Olney ‏@Buster_ESPN 3m The White Sox have been asking for major-league ready or near-ready prospects in their trade talks. They may not get a very good deal then. This is disappointing in my opinion. It also says that they are going to be trying to compete pretty close to immediately. If the best package offered is based around guys from A ball that project as better players than the near ready players you are asking for, I hope they will accept the better deal rather than getting close to the majors guys. If they hope to accomplish things this way then Jerry better be ready to up the player to about $130 million next year.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jul 9, 2013 -> 04:29 PM) Trading Santiago would be just awful. I like Santiago quite a bit. However, if they got a cost controlled offensive player/offensive players that would be starters for years to come, you'd have to consider it.

Mark Gonzalez just tweeted that Hahn and Ventura were in a closed door meeting. I posted this here because there is no catch all thread haha. Obviously, they could be meeting for any reason but this time of year it could be for many different reasons.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jul 9, 2013 -> 03:11 PM) I realize we aren't competing this year. But Rios still has another year. Even if I wish they would, the Sox arent going into complete firesale mode. I am not so sure anymore. Obviously, the Sox have pitching and that is different than most teams that have to blow it up. I think Hahn has complete autonomy in this and knows that he cannot continue to patch it together. Crain and Thornton will definitely go. Anyone else that he can get value for I believe will be gone as well. He is not going to trade players under contract for a bad deal because that would be stupid but i do believe that everyone is truly available.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 9, 2013 -> 02:51 PM) I see the Pirates organization as one trying to emulate the Rays. When have the Rays, since 2008, made a big midseason move? This is somewhat true. They want to keep their monster prospects which is smart. However, their system is so good that they could afford to give lower tiered guys in their system that would really help the White Sox. I was just in Pittsburgh for a week and the city is buzzing. They need to make the playoffs. Should they mortgage their long term future to do so? Absolutely not. But for an Alex Rios, who would be a huge upgrade for them, they would not have to mortgage their future.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jul 9, 2013 -> 01:45 PM) True, although all reports have pointed to Stanton not being moved until the offseason. You never know, of course, but it seems that will most likely be the case. Also, they could get Rios without giving up Taillon/Cole, which I think they will be very inclined to do. I don't think they want to pay up for Stanton. Pirates do have the lowest RF .ops in the National League though. There system is very deep. I don't think that they want to deal their top guys. Cole, Taillon, OF Gregory Polanco, and probably not even Luis Heredia RHP. I really like SS Alen Hanson. He's a top 50 prospect in baseball. They also have Josh Bell. Bell was highly regarded and a very tough sign out of HS. With a future OF of Polanco, McCutchen, and Marte, Bell is expendable but I am not sure if they'd give him for Rios. Sox were also supposedly high on Texas Tech OF Barrett Barnes last year in the draft and Pirates have him as well. If the Sox could get Jose Tabata and Hanson I would make the trade in a second. I am just not sure how much Pittsburgh wants to deal.

Not sure if anyone saw this tweet from Scot Gregor last night but it mentions that Pirates scout was in the house. He was speculating that it could be for Rios but I think it could also be for bullpen help or Ramirez. Scot Gregor ‏@scotgregor 17h Pirates have a scout here tonight, and don't think he's looking for pitching. #rios

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 8, 2013 -> 11:28 AM) Jobs should be on the line tonight. If you go 0-4 against the Cubs and swept at home, I'm sorry, but in this day and age Robin and his whole staff except Baines should be fired. If I was Reinsdorf and the owners I would take it as a personal slap in the face. I know sports are different, but these guys are getting paid good money and to lose 4 to the Cubs w/out one win is the Sox players laughing at the bosses and stealing money. I know a lot of you don't care about the Cub series but some innocent fans, the little kids who fight over Sox/Cubs at school, do care. Some people do care and the Sox owe it to everybody to win one fricking game against one of the worst teams in baseball. Really? I'll paint you a scenario here. Santiago and Garza both pitch 8 shutout innings. 3 hits scattered for each team. Jones/Thornton/Whoever enters game in the 9th inning. Cubs hit a HR. So unless the Sox score 2 in the 9th all of the coaches except Harold Baines should be fired? You are a special man.