lasttriptotulsa

QUOTE (oneofthemikes @ Nov 19, 2015 -> 09:55 AM) But part of the problem is that they are so poor as talent evaluators that even in "an offer they like" they will likely end up with sub par pieces coming back. In what world are they poor talent evaluators? Was it when they gave Abreu the largest contract in team history? Or when they traded for Eaton? Or when they drafted Sale? Or when they pulled Quintana off the scrap heap? Or do you want to go back further in KW's tenure like when he acquire Contreras for a broken down Loaiza? Or when he acquired Thornton for Borchard?

QUOTE (bmags @ Nov 19, 2015 -> 09:53 AM) Who on earth would be interested in this? I wonder if he'll be DFA candidate and if this means they are interested in Upton. He has an option left. Zero chance they DFA him.

QUOTE (bruni @ Nov 19, 2015 -> 09:45 AM) The White Sox demonstrate yet again their inability to judge talent and/or develop positional talent when in house. And now they will "sell low" on Garcia, since they have effectively turned him into Viciedo Part 2. The biggest reason why the White Sox, under its current Kenny/Rick structure should avoid trading away Sale, Q, Abreu, Garcia et al is not because it is not the right move to make (I believe it is), but rather because their collective inability to assess MLB talent is so below par that we would end up getting fleeced in any deal we make. If ever a franchise has grown stale in management, direction and approach, it is our Chicago White Sox. And yet, ticket prices for season ticket holders are up again. Priceless! Who says they are going to sell low on him. Being open to trading him and trading him for peanuts are two completely different things. If they don't get an offer they like, they keep him.

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 19, 2015 -> 09:14 AM) in your post, i can agree with some of your point. however at this time of the yr, the nature of the would be or so call baseball experts have a tendency to bring other idea into an equation. in other words, i was reading something about the pirates and their off season plans, whether it was mlb trade rumors or something. in that article they mention that his versatility can move him to 1b / 2b / and 3b .... b/c of the value of his bat. it also stated that he may need to move from 2b b/c of age and defense in the coming yrs. so that was why i mention he can be a nice substitute if the sox were to trade with pitt. it also brought up Cervelli and Marte for trade piece if pitt were to make a bigger deal.... getting prospect now instead of getting comp picks. that is me just thinking outside the box. Where is this idea of him being versatile coming from? He has played a grand total of 109 innings away from 2B in his entire career. If he has to move from 2B as he gets older because he can't handle the defense he is certainly not going to be playing 3B which is a far tougher position. Forget 1B, there is no way his bat can play at 1st.

When comparing Walker vs Sanchez let's just throw their WAR from last year out. Sanchez was a rookie who had a lot of growing pains and started off the season very poorly. From July 1 on, Sanchez had a .675 OPS. Combine that with his stellar defense and he has a chance to be a pretty acceptable starting 2B next year. Hell, if he can progress a little more and get his OPS up to the .700 range he will probably be more valuable than Walker next year for 5% of the cost. If Walker could play an acceptable third (I don't think he can) I wouldn't mind acquiring him for the right price. There is just no way I would give up a guy like Johnson or Montas to acquire a one year rental in Walker when we have a cheap alternative in house with a chance to put up similar numbers.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Nov 18, 2015 -> 12:16 PM) The NHL All-Star Game Is Moving To 3-On-3 Should be interesting. I've never really watched the NHL All-Star game (or really any sports All Star game) very often but I might have to check it out this year. Should be pretty fast paced and high scoring. The goalies don't stand a chance.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Nov 18, 2015 -> 07:08 AM) I don't see them giving up the chips it would take to get Sale, but I definitely see them trading for a starter. I don't see why Boston would want to give up a bunch of prospects to acquire a starter. Money is not an issue for them and there are plenty of good free agent starters available. Why give up the talent when you can just go out and buy one and lose nothing more than a draft pick?

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 17, 2015 -> 01:33 PM) In all seriousness, if we get to the point where Sale is on the free agent market, at the prices that top pitchers are going for, I am plenty OK with letting someone else take a $250 or $300 million risk on him. Hard to look 4 years down the road and see where Sale, the franchise and the market would be but I basically agree with you. If the franchise is in roughly the same position financially that they are now there is no way they can commit $30 million per year to a single player.

QUOTE (shysocks @ Nov 17, 2015 -> 12:01 PM) What if the Sox went to Sale after next season and told him they'll rip up the team options for 2018-19 if he signs a 5-year/$100 million contract for 2018-22. Sale gets a nice raise on those option years, $100M of guaranteed money where he had $0 before, and the chance for another contract at age 33. The Sox get three additional seasons from him at below market value. $100M seems low and I have a feeling it wouldn't be enough to get him to sign, but keep in mind that the Sox are taking on a lot more risk from Sale in this scenario; in his current deal, they hold all the cards. A number exists where he'd accept and it'd still be worth it for the Sox. $125? I don't see either side pursuing that type of extension at this point but I wouldn't be surprised if they explored they idea after 2017 before they pick up his option. I think it would take something like adding another 5 years and a big pay increase in 2018 and 2019. Hard to say what the market will look like then but using today's market I would say adding $10 million each in 2018 and 2019 and then something like a 5 year, $125 million extension. Sale would effectively get $145 million in new money for the additional 5 year commitment. That would be close to the $31 million Kershaw is getting per year, but the Sox would 'only' effectively be paying him $171 million over 7 years. (~$24.4 million per year)

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Nov 17, 2015 -> 12:27 PM) I hope Sale gives the Sox a 'Hometown Discount' after his current deal is up, but I don't see that as being realistic. I'd love it though if he was on the Sox for his entire career. Prepare to be disappointed.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 17, 2015 -> 09:44 AM) I think he would get a billion to a billion and and a half for 7 years with an opt out after 4, so he could make $2 billion. Well assuming roughly $7 million per WAR, Sale would only need to be a 20-30 WAR player each year for the next 7 to justify that contract. I think he can do it.

QUOTE (VAfan @ Nov 17, 2015 -> 09:12 AM) I've called for this for a while. Trading Robertson allows Montas to step into a closer role and build his value. Jones can be the bridge if necessary, and that would also build his value. It also saves money better spent elsewhere. Let's see if Montas actually fails as a starter before we relegate him to closer. Even a solid fourth starter has more value than a closer.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Nov 17, 2015 -> 08:24 AM) I'd be willing to bet that Sale would get $400+ million if he was on the open market this offseason. Lol. You can't be serious right? The richest contract for a pitcher in baseball history belongs to Clayton Kershaw at 7 years, $215 million. Before signing that contract Kershaw had already won 2 Cy Youngs, 3 ERA titles, and a triple crown. You really think that Sale would get nearly double the guaranteed money when he has not accomplished what Kershaw has and has lingering durability concerns? Even if it were a 10 year deal it would have to be $40+ million per year which is roughly 33% more per year than Kershaw makes.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Nov 15, 2015 -> 11:50 AM) Anyone else find it a little odd he didn't receive a QO? He's on the fence about playing and seems like he would have been a guy that would have declined (don't think its all about the money at this point for him). Kind of reminds me of A.J. Burnett a few years ago when he was on the fence of retiring and Pirates thought he would retire and they didn't offer a QO and then signed a deal with Philadelphia. If they offered Buehrle a QO he would either accept or be forced to retire. No team would be willing to give up a first rounder to sign Buehrle to a one year deal so the Jays wouldn't get a comp pick anyway. They probably respected Buehrle enough to not diminish his value to other teams by making him a QO.

QUOTE (oldsox @ Nov 14, 2015 -> 08:46 AM) So do the Pirates. Wells and Fogg for some "#2 starter" whose name I can't remember and who couldn't get anybody out. Not one of KW's finest moves. But, it was a long time ago. Todd Ritchie. Man was he garbage.

For what it's worth, I hate catch alls as well. Back when the catch all thread existed on the main Sox board I rarely, if ever checked it.

QUOTE (Whitey @ Nov 13, 2015 -> 02:31 AM) If there was ever a time to rebuild, it is now... The casual (fair weather) fans are all focused on the north side, and the Royals are going to control the division for the next couple years anyways. The team is going to have poor attendance no matter what. Plus, the assets we have at the MLB level could immediately give the Sox one of the top farm systems in baseball. As a fan, I would rather watch a rebuild than last years group with a little lipstick slapped on it. There is zero reason for them to do a complete rebuild. They have Sale, Quintana, Rodon, Abreu and Eaton all locked up through 2019. That is one hell of a strong core and they should be able to fill in enough pieces to make a contender out of it.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Nov 12, 2015 -> 03:41 PM) They have to win though. They loaded up last year and sucked and nobody went. The moves they made did translate somewhat to the gate numbers though. They drew 100,000 more than they did in 2014. While that might not seem like a lot, it was the first year since 2006 that they actually had an increase in attendance. They had dropped an average of 167,000 per year since the peak in 2006. The fans want to come and making moves help, but bottom line like you said, they have to win.

QUOTE (spiderman @ Nov 12, 2015 -> 02:45 PM) Wouldn't he be the type (amongst the available talent) of impact player that the lineup needs? They have holes in the lineup at C, 2B, SS, DH and 3B with some questions in the OF, but this lineup is missing run producers outside of Abreu (and possibly Cabrera). But which Cespedes are you going to get? The one that put up .861 and .870 OPSs in 2012 and 2015 or the one that put up .737 and .751 in 2012 and 2013. The one that put up a 1.048 OPS in his first 41 games with the Mets or the one that put up a sub .600 OPS the remainder of the season including the playoffs? He is wildly inconsistent and that is the main reason I wouldn't even entertain the idea a paying him the close to $25 million per year he's looking for.

The fact that signing Cespedes does not have draft pick compensation attached is going to drive his price through the roof.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Nov 12, 2015 -> 01:43 AM) I'd be all for trading 2-3 of our lefties and bringing Mark back. Or like I said make Danks a lefty reliever. Teams with four lefty starters DO NOT win pennants. Quintana has pretty even lefty/righty splits for his career and a couple years he's even had reverse splits where he was better against righties. Who cares what arm you throw with if you can get both lefties and righties out evenly?

QUOTE (fathom @ Nov 11, 2015 -> 11:00 AM) Buehrle to the Cardinals makes so much more sense QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 11, 2015 -> 12:43 PM) With Lynn out for 16, totally. I think there is at least a semi-realistic chance that Lackey accepts his qualifying offer. If he does they already have 5 starters under contract.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 10, 2015 -> 06:14 PM) bWAR is supposed to judge based on ERA and defense. Apparently, whatever metric they used thought Sale didn't pitch in front of a bad defense...that's laughable. bWAR is based on runs allowed regardless of whether they were earned or not. If your defense is bad you give up more runs lowering your bWAR. That's the huge difference in his fWAR and bWAR is that fWAR doesn't ding the pitcher for poor defense.

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 9, 2015 -> 01:40 PM) i just got back so if your idea of the trade is wrong, that team put in a bid, what are they going to do with rizzo, again if they had won the bidding process, so this is a NL team with no DH and now they have 2 1b man in rizzo and parks. what to do??? Who cares? They didn't win the bid. Why even talk about it?

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 9, 2015 -> 10:28 AM) this has nothing to do with Sano, he made a statement and i asked a counter question, he never responded. it is just he makes statements with out ever explaining why it is wrong, or his reasoning. the other part is me, i was in a great mood until i had my meeting. now everything went to the s***ter. so i am in a pissy mood now.... i am leaving today, b/c of it. i will be back when the s*** is off the stove. Do you need an aspirin or something?