Paulstar

Looking at some of the names in the Pirates system, RHRP Victor Black seems like someone who might be a guy the Sox look at as part of a package. Had some arm problems as a starter but has remained healthy since being moved to the bullpen, and also struggles with control at times, but has a power arm and is close to MLB ready. Since a lot of the guys in this bullpen seem to be on their way out, it might not be a bad idea to bring in some young, cost controlled replacements. Andrew Oliver also seems like someone the Sox could possibly want as a throw in. He seems like a classic Coop project who has good stuff but struggles with control.

Polanco please.

When Hawk does retire, I hope for a real play by play guy to be hired with Stone. Some one who actually does their job and not just ramble on and try and make jokes with the color guy. Basically the exact opposite of Joe Buck, who I have no idea how is still the top announcer for football and baseball on FOX. Just because his dad was a good announcer doesn't mean people enjoy the garbage that comes out of the booth when Buck and McCarver are announcing.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jul 18, 2013 -> 02:42 PM) I don't know how to answer this. You have an agenda. You always have. Someone a long time ago poisoned you that strikeouts are bad. Dunn has value. Even when Adam Dunn was a monster there were many people who didn't like the way he played baseball. Dunn was always paid to hit 40 bombs, walk 100 times, score a bunch of runs, and have an .ops near .900. He did that job consistently for many many years. Teams were willing to live with the batting average under .230 and 120+ strikeouts a season. Dunn's .obp with the Sox has not been good enough. However, I believe he does have the 2nd highest .obp on the team and made like the 3rd fewest outs on the team last season. Every season there is a chance that Dunn will lead the league in homers, walks, and strikeouts. I would take that every time from him. If Dunn finishes his deal with the Sox the overall 4 year product will still be characterized as a disappointment. Even after probably 125+ homers in a Sox uniform all because of that 1st season. Is he overpaid? Yes. As a free agent though I still think Dunn gets a 2 year deal at $10 per season. What he offers a team is very valuable. He just should not be expected to be a team's best player. Maybe someone poisoned you into thinking that strikeouts are no different than any other out. I'm not here to defend Greg but the arrogance you have for traditional stats is mind boggling. If you think strikeouts are no big deal, thats fine. But people who think they are bad aren't idiots either. Its a different school of thought, and there are arguments on both sides. But I guess only the almighty saber gods like you know how to correctly evaluate the production of players.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jul 18, 2013 -> 02:58 PM) Most General Managers do not agree with you though. I could care less who disagrees violently. I understand Dunn's flaws. But what you are failing to grasp is the positives that he provides. Guys that take walks and hit a s***load of homers don't grown on trees. If Dunn were not on this baseball team this season they would be a lot closer to the worst record in baseball. What Dunn provides is important. The team is just so bad that what he provides doesn't really make much of a difference. There are many players on the White Sox that are a lot worse than Dunn but you insist on beating this dead horse and I don't really understand why. I'm glad to see you know what most GM's think. Since you somehow have a source to all these GM's, any news on when the next trade is going to take place?

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jul 17, 2013 -> 12:48 PM) Can we stop quoting the average? Please? Go dit drives me crazy on this board. Now, his .obp isn't great either but we need to reference the .obp with Dunn. The batting average is irrelevant. Not everyone believes that AVG is an outdated and irrelevant stat. Sure, it varies for the type of player and production you want, but when there is a good chance someone bats below .250 and hovers around that .200 mark, there is no reason BA shouldn't be taken into consideration.

I wonder if you could see a team take a shot at Dunn after the trade deadline and claim him off of waivers, similar to how the Sox claimed Rios.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 16, 2013 -> 11:12 PM) Eaton, Holmberg, and Owings for Peavy? Done. Want some De Aza too? Fine, take him. Agreed. Imagine if Hahn pulled off that trade and was able to put together a package that got Polanco in return from Pittsburgh. Eaton and Polanco would be two big time pieces to build that OF around. Probably would keep Eaton in CF in the scenario and groom Polanco for LF since I think Polanco has the weaker arm but more power potential to translate to LF. Either way, it would be nice to get a couple of young, speedy lefties who have shown really good feels for hitting on this team. Depending on who the RF is in this hypothetical scenario, it could become one of the best defensive outfields the White Sox have ever had.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jul 16, 2013 -> 03:08 PM) He's hitting 217 and strikes out around 40% of the time. I would go after Kyle Parker. I agree, a Crain for Parker trade would be awesome. Parker can be a young guy to build the team around and play RF next year if Rios is traded. I don't think he is a stud prospect, but a guy who can possibly put up a .250 BA and .350 OBP, knock out 20-25 homers, and drive in 75 plus every year while playing above average D (although he might wind up in LF if he gets any slower). Worst case scenario, we would at least have a QB to throw the rock around to Mitchell, Hawkins, and Jacobs. I really think with the right QB (I'm not sure Dunn can cut it as a QB anymore), the White Sox would run away with the championship in a MLB 7 on 7 league.

QUOTE (PorkChopExpress @ Jul 16, 2013 -> 03:09 PM) Angels are probably sellers come this trade deadline, though. They're 11 games behind Oakland and 9 games out of wild card contention with every team in the East as well as Texas and Cleveland in front of them. If Peavy isn't dealt this July or August, maybe there could be something with the Angels in the off season, but for now, I don't see them looking to buy pitching any time soon. I agree. Even with him being blocked by Trumbo and Pujols for several years into the future, there is just no need for them to trade him now. But I fully expect Cron to be traded at some point in the next year or two.

QUOTE (thxfrthmmrs @ Jul 13, 2013 -> 12:31 PM) I think a lot of people are missing the point. Some of us are not complaining about the value of the prospect we are getting in return. I could care less if it's Red Sox's 11th, 12th, or 13th best prospect, I just want someone who has good baseball skills and is a good bet of making the majors, even if they don't have the ceiling as high as Jacobs. Our minor leaguers that has the best chance of making the majors are Semien and Sanchez, guys who might be role players or average players, but have better baseball instinct and are more likely to make the majors. We don't have enough of those guys in the minors. Getting a Marco Scutaro type of player as prospect in return is a lot more ideal for us at this point. We already have enough lottery tickets, raw athletes in the system with Mitchell, Thompson, Walker, Hawkins, Zapata, I would even throw in Barnum, and now Jacobs. We will be lucky if even one of them will make it to the majors, and it would be at least several years away. I am afraid it's going to be a long rebuild that keeps on coming up short. Exactly. We have a great football/track/basketball team going on in the minors, and it is fine taking a gamble on players like that here and there. But the Sox need more people who are baseball players first who show that natural baseball instinct. Look at the Cardinals and their drafting process, they are all over "safe" college bats who show great baseball instinct. Well, they have a great team and a great farm system to back up that type of scouting and drafting.

QUOTE (hi8is @ Jul 13, 2013 -> 03:29 AM) Claiming to know all of these prospects to bust is unreasonable. Two of them are in their first full year, one in his second, and the other two have had injury based setbacks. Sorry Paulstar - but your post was very biased in my opinion. At least we both agree the hope is for your sentiment to be off the mark. Cheers to that. Just judging by stats and the WHite Sox lack of ability to develop position players, I don't see a reason to be optimistic. It seems to me Thompson has the best shot at becoming a solid major league player, but he needs to find consistency. Walker might make eventually get a call up/make a squad just based on how fast he is. Hated both the Mitchell and Hawkins picks when they happened, and I think you can pretty much call Mitchell a bust by now. I almost think Hawkins has a better shot at becoming a major league pitcher than outfielder unless the White Sox have some coach somewhere in the system that is the swing whisper and can fix Hawkins approach and mechanics at bat. He does have big time power though, so that is exciting.

With the White Sox lack of ability to effectively scout and develop OF's of the athletic variety the past four years or so (actually more than that), I fully expect Brandon Jacobs to fall into the same mold of Jared Mitchell, Tryace Thompson, Keynan Walker, and Courtney Hawkins as someone with all the talent in the world, but is just not a good baseball player. However, I was not expecting anything of great return for Matt Thornton, so we shall see. Maybe Jacobs will turn out not to suck, but it would be nice to see a true baseball player brought in here for once.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 12, 2013 -> 04:13 PM) Gillaspie at 2B? REALLY? I have a feeling they keep Beckham at 2B as long as he's hitting this well. He moves to SS, starts making some errors, his confidence is going to fall apart again. If that is truly an issue, than good riddance. This team has too many mental midgets as it is, and if Beckham proved to be that mentally week and unable to handle any failure or adversity and go directly in a tailspin again, he don't belong in the majors.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 12, 2013 -> 04:44 PM) I have no idea where this came from. I'm saying I think Beckham will be Michael Young bad at SS. He has good instincts, but he lacks quickness and arm strength. He is ideally suited for 2B. I don't think you can be further from the truth there. Beckham has shown above average quickness and arm strength. I think people on here are comparing him athletically to Alexei and the way he plays SS, and that is just an unrealistic. Ramirez is able to do things at SS many people in the league can't with his quickness and arm strength. However, if Beckham can play average defense at SS (which is not a stretch at all considering many of us on here have seen how well he can play 2B), that is where he is most valuable. With his bat being a question mark and not being a power hitter like many on here hoped he would, I think it absolutely makes sense to give him a chance there. If he fails he fails, but you could be looking at someone who can play average to above average D at SS, make all the routine plays, and hopefully turn into a Michael Young-lite type hitter as long as he doesn't get HR happy. If it wasn't for Alexei, you can bet any amount of money that Beckham would have never moved from SS, at least not until he showed he couldn't play it well enough at the MLB level.

QUOTE (The Ultimate Champion @ Jun 29, 2013 -> 02:43 PM) The Mariners have so many busts in need of a change of scenery, and we have so many holes, that there just has to be a fit somewhere. Could they/would they use DeAza anywhere? The only guy I can think of Viciedo. Maybe Flowers. Maybe also Nate Jones. Otherwise I don't see a match. It would be nice to get either Ackley or Smoak from them and hope to strike lightning in a bottle.

You have to assume that the player that probably fell out of favor moreso than anyone else has to be De Aza. He has been brutal this year, which is saying something considering he has been one of the most productive offensive players on an offensively challenged team.

The traditional DH seems to be dying and more and more AL teams are using it as a hybrid. Use it for guys to get rest while keeping their bats in the lineup, play matchups with it, and mix and match. Honestly, if the Sox did a rotating DH, I would like to see McCann brought in. Let him catch 2 or 3 out of every 5 games, and DH the rest. McCann is destined for the AL because he needs to be plugged in at DH once in a while to keep him healthy and keep him productive offensively. There is no denying that when he is healthy, McCann is a very good hitter. However, he has been so beat up the past two years that his offensive production has dipped. This also allows you to develop Phegley with less pressure. He will get probably at least four games a week behind the plate, and if he turns out as good offensively as we hope, he can also get some AB's at DH. Than you finish off the DH rotation with Viciedo or someone like him. A right handed power bat that can DH vs. tough lefties, and also fill in at 1B or LF. I believe versatility in a team is a major tool for success, and it would be nice to see the Sox shift away from the traditional everyday same nine lineups to a living lineup that can be mixed and matched in different ways everyday to provide the best possible matchups. I believe the Rays in the AL are the best example of this.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 05:17 PM) Why? History shows Sox fans don't support anything less than playoff worthy teams. Let's say Puig, Harper, Trout or Machado (one of them, of course) were on the White Sox and the record was still the same, would there be a huge bump in attendance? Knowing Chicago fans, probably not. Did Beckham in 2009 bump up the attendance? Harper or Trout would undoubtedly draw fans. Beckham was never on the same level of phenom prospect that Harper and Trout were.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 03:39 PM) I still think Pence makes more sense for us, but there's some chance SF pays handsomely to keep him there. He'd be a nice, marketable face to have around here and he may be overlooked by some of the other people vying for OFers Trading Rios for hopefully one decent MLB ready prospect and using the money freed up on signing Pence would be an excellent move in the mold of retooling the team with youth while still trying to compete, in my opinion. Pence and Rios are virtually almost the same player, except Pence is a couple years younger, I think. I also believe Pence has that "grinder" attitude which would surely make him a fan favorite (as long as he doesn't disappear and wind up batting .210 with no power). If you could pull off an offseason with signing Pence, maybe Morneau on an incentive type deal for a couple years, and hell, even bring back AJ to split time with Phegley (assuming Phegley shows he potentially be a starting catcher for the Sox with his play for the rest of the year) while acquiring good, young talent for some of the guys that are traded off, it is not insane to think this team can compete in 2014, especially with the pitching this organization seems to develop every year.

Must be a slow day at the office for Ken. Since the Sox do not have to or want to get rid of Sale, a team actually coming in and offering the package of top, MLB ready prospects to get him are slim.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 10, 2013 -> 01:29 PM) I think a lot of teams will hesitate on him because of his injury history and that'll hurt the length a little bit. I'd probably be willing to push 5/$75, but I can't be sure someone won't gamble Jose Reyes money on him. Might well depend on whether there's an org doing anything deliberately stupid this offseason like the Marlins were then. Risking 15 mil a year on Ellsbury for 5 years wouldn't be the worse move. Sure would be a hell of a whole lot better than spending that type of money on B.J. Upton. However, I do agree that some team is gonna spend stupid money on him. As another poster put it, he likely get paid more than what he can earn.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 9, 2013 -> 02:18 PM) You are far likelier to make headache for headache trades (or whatever you will) in the offseason than you are in the regular season. You also still have to give up value to get them. To get Lawrie, you are likely going to have to give up someone like Hector Santiago still because they certainly aren't going to give him away. The players with less value you will acquire are those coming up on their arb eligible seasons. If Seattle is going to get rid of Smoak, and you want to assure yourselves of getting him, then you can trade for him then. I'd do Santiago for Lawrie any day of the week. However, I don't think the Blue Jays would.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 8, 2013 -> 10:41 AM) My feeling is that the less Dayan hits, the less they will consider a position change. Paulie will be gone at the end of the year and you have to wonder how many "injuries" he'll deal with this season. Then there is Dunn who is equally likely to be gone in just a couple of weeks as he is to stay the duration of his contract. It's hard to tell. Anyway, Andy's first ~15 games at AAA have been "meh." It did take him a season to adjust to AA, so he may need at least the rest of this season to adjust. Of course, I don't think anybody would foresee him coming up on a full-time basis before September rolls around anyway. Regardless, I don't see any way that they would let him have success in AAA and then never give him a shot with the big club. If he does get blocked, I have a strong inkling that it won't be Tyler Flowers or Dayan blocking him. Exactly, or Keppinger or Morel. Even if Dunn and Konerko are both playing and healthy in September, there is still no reason not to throw Wilkins in there for a couple games here and there late in the season (of course assuming if he plays well enough for the next couple of months at Charlotte to justify an addition to the 40 man and Sept. call up). The only way that it would make sense if he gets blocked is if the Sox acquire a reclamation project like Smoak or Wallace to play 1B, or acquire a better 1B prospect than him who is also more MLB ready than him (not sure who fits into this picture as it seems right now there are not a whole lot of MLB ready 1B prospects floating around right now). All of this discussion could be for nothing as well, for all we know he will struggle for the next two months at Charlotte and show that he isn't ready for an opportunity to get some major league PT this year. He is definitely an interesting guy to keep on eye on though.

Wow, looking at Kozma, it is surprising he has been as good as he has been in the majors. He was a career .230 hitter in the minors. He must be really good with the glove.