Flash Tizzle

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Oct 25, 2015 -> 12:50 PM) Here's the thing: White Sox fans are so fickle that they wouldn't put up with the losing seasons the Cubs, Astros and Royals needed to get to where they are. Need proof? We're currently getting our highest picks in years, the system is improving and fans calling for rebuilds are pissed that they aren't winning right now because they didn't rebuild earlier. Royals fans didn't put up with losing, they avoided the ballpark as their attendance prior to the recent playoff years showed. Then, miraculously, when the team improved....so did their attendance. We're scared of the boogeyman -- the "rebuild" word that we've never actually fully taken on. It comes down to this, what we've done these last 7 years hasn't worked. We're watching the Royals, Pirates, Twins, Cubs, Astros have success with full rebuilds. How many of these fanbases aside from the Cubs just filled the park with a losing team? We're not fickle, we've naive. Wise up people and accept alternatives exist

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 25, 2015 -> 10:22 AM) The Red Sox won't have to give up that talent for Quintana when they can buy it on the FA market without wiping out 1/3rd or 1/4th of their top prospects. Fortunately for us, not every team can buy a frontline starter.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 24, 2015 -> 04:21 PM) I'm starting to wish the Cubs had actually made it just to see the existential angst around here with two teams who did rebuilds correctly putting the microscope to what we've so glaringly failed to do. Would you really root for the Cubs over a team from the AL and your own division? I believe KC winning the World Series accomplishes that feat on its own. I have no rooting interest for or against them, but it removes excuses that we've often seen that are rooted in jealousy -- "Royals are just a flash in the pan," "Years of losing to assemble their team....yet no World Series." What does it say that in the regime of Moore that he has assembled a perrenial playoff team and (hopefully after winning 4 more games) a WS champion.......while we contimue spinning our wheels in mediocrity? I would want Hahn to answer this question -- are the moves you're anticipating putting us in a better position to compete against the World Series champion Royals? And i dont think second tier FA pickups brings us there

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Oct 23, 2015 -> 11:24 AM) If they do that, then they will be worse than last year. You mentioned Freese and Asdrubal Cabrera, I'd rather have Saladino/Olt and Alexei than them. I assume you're signing Zobrist or Wieters in this scenario then, right? It's not going to matter how they patch up next season anyway. The legitimate FA options are out of our price range, and even those below cannot all be signed with our limited payroll flexibility. Anything short of an incredibly lopsided, franchise changing trade immediately benefitting us, a career resurgence from nearly the entire lineup, AND our pitching staff staying healthy, we're not going to compete in 2016. Yes it could happen and this offseason could be Hahn's miracle that goes down in lore as the period we began our resurgence; but the White Sox haven't earned that optimism from me. I'll expect failure until proven otherwise

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 23, 2015 -> 10:54 AM) Those two alone are not enough. We need to add at least one impact bat. 2B: I'm fine with Sanchez. C: I want Wieters. It's absolutely not enough, but they're not going to sign all three. I think realistically they'll sign two players for IF spots and maintain the rest of the roster.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 23, 2015 -> 09:55 AM) We could always sign a guy like Asdrubal Cabrera for like 2 years. Stop gap to Anderson. I'd understand Cabrera instead of Ramirez, but that's one slight upgrade at SS. What about 2B, 3B, C, RF? Even say we sign Freese for 3B and stand pat otherwise, how much better is this team? We're still peppering the Sox with replacement level production when we know damn well what we need is several power hitting, on base players aside from Abreu

QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Oct 23, 2015 -> 09:08 AM) We still aren't sure Thompson can hit on a full time basis yet. He could be like Brian Anderson or Jordan Danks... nice in the outfield but can't hit his way out of a wet paper bag. True, but it's an accepted risk (for me atleast) because if Eaton brings back a SS, suddenly we're not having to pay Ramirez and someone such as Zobrist can be signed. So you've effectively filled two positions by trading Eaton, and anything positive/negative from Thompson is just what we'll have to deal with.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Oct 23, 2015 -> 09:05 AM) I think you'd get more in separate deals. Why don't people understand how much Quintana is actually worth? I'm not undervaluing Quintana. Of course they'd probably receive more in overall number of players returning to the SOX, but with the right team it could be the concept of, "Both our needs are met so we'll give up the higher valued positional player"

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Oct 23, 2015 -> 08:39 AM) It's an excellent idea to sell high on Eaton, especially with Trayce, the superior defender, in tow. I agree, and if packaged with Quintana you'll have some damn nice options in return. We'll easily upgrade two positions. Even assuming regression for Thompson, and having a slot in the rotation to fill, I'd jump all over the right deal. No one is untouchable. If our management is capable of looking past the NOW (ie, how can a struggling offense trade their second best player) they can really have a lot to work with

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Oct 23, 2015 -> 04:50 AM) Now why would the sox help the Cubs like that? Because they're helping us acquire a cheap, young shortstop and slugging/patient DH; in addition to several of their top prospects. It's inevitable Quintana is going to have to be traded. We can't seriously be considering contention with the FA options being thrown around here. If we look at 2016 as another wash season (which it likely will be regardless), 2017 could be our big atep forward. Also without Ramirez' salary, there's more money available to get someone like Zobrist. Russell/Cabrera/Schwarber/Abreu/Zobrist/Thompson/Sanchez/Garcia/Flowers is a step forward. Use whatever money is available to sign some stop-gap #5 starter. If atleast one of Montas or Fulmer is ready midseason you're ahead of schedule. If not, let them develop for '17. Yeah yeah I know people like tearing down trade proposals as much as others like creating them. My concern is how we're presently constructed, with as much money tied up into tge current roster, we're very limited with offensive upgrades on the market. Is slotting Freese and A. Cabrera (if we even have the money) into this lineup enough? I'd much rather have everyone in the rotation remain, but the inept management put themselves in this position by assembling a cellar dwelling offense. How they fix it is anyones guess, but they'll have to be creative.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 22, 2015 -> 12:12 PM) I'd rather sign a few second tier FAs than give up Sanchez, Micah, Trey and Adams. I'd rather lose with some dignity and more money available for next offseason than go through another offseason of singing second tier FAs.....only to lose a little less. Maybe with Asdrubal Cabrera and Freese we'll have 81 wins. While many may claim that's successful it doesn't prove to me we're in any better position to compete come 2017 or beyond. We need impact bats, players with the ability to get on base and threaten to hit 30+ HRs. If it means unload Quintana, Sale, or any of the names above so be it. Tired of signing these replacement level bums. And yes, I'd rather lose and sign no one, collect a Top Ten draft pic, then come 2017 use available money to sign a legitimate FA.... than look at second and third tier options. We'll also have a better idea of the future of Anderson, Fulmer, Montas

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 22, 2015 -> 09:01 AM) If they're gonna sign Heyward, they should move the outfield walls back to the old dimensions so we actually get more benefit from his defensive ability. Odds of it actually happening? One in 250-300. I was referencing the Cubs signing him, I'll clarify that in my post

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Oct 22, 2015 -> 07:31 AM) Yesterday on the Boers and Bernstein Show, they briefly talked about the White Sox. Terry Boers said something to the effect of " The one guy that I know is available is Eaton". Bernstein was then excited and thought that was a good idea to free up CF for Trayce. This seems like an awful idea. Eaton has 6.6 fWAR over the last 2 seasons, is fairly cheap, and 26 years old. Unless he's a locker room problem, that's not a guy that a team in the White Sox position should move. Thoughts? It's interesting to me because if such an idea was true, suddenly we'd be an even better trade partner for the Cubs. Now, let's speculate Quintana and Eaton are traded -- with the money freed up for the Cubs moving Eaton in LF and Quintana in their rotation (avoiding a costly SP like Price), they'd probably have enough to sign Heyward to a massive deal. Now, what would we want in return to justify helping the Cubs? I'd say Schwarber, Addison Russell, Top two Prospects in Cubs system. Now 2016 we'd definitely take our lumps, (No Q, absence of legitimate leadoff hitter) but think come 2017 the money we'd have available to sign someone via FA. Also you're considering the progression of Anderson (if he isn't included in any proposed Cubs trade...) as a 2B replacement. Perhaps by then we're ready for Fulmer, Montas, Adams. I never considered dealing Eaton, but it's damn interesting to think aboyt

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Oct 21, 2015 -> 11:38 PM) You know you can rebuild without doing a complete teardown right? Rebuild on the fly hasn't worked out too well for us. Mostly becauae we haven't dealt anyone worth a damn. We have to trade players of value to receive value. Sale, Quintana.....those are your rebuild pieces. Now while I'm not advocating a complete tear down, the point was KC winning proves it can effectively be done

QUOTE (pettie4sox @ Oct 21, 2015 -> 11:05 PM) Between the Mets, Royals, and Blue Jays, who do you guys want to see win it all? I wouldn't mind any of them winning, honestly. The Royals winning to me just removes the excuse of, "well they sucked for a long time and havent won anything" argument that so many fall upon to justify us avoiding a rebuild. I like their team alot. It also places atleast added pressure when asked the question of, what will you do Hahn for the White Sox to compete against the World Series champion? I think any question that is answered with, "well we believe this team has what it takes to compete" is especially embarrassing. Now it probably won't alter their decision making, but it atleast makes our woes more pronounced.

Yesss!!!!!! That last strike was the correct call too.

WHY!? Dont f***ing walk people. It's simple, have them hit their way on

QUOTE (Middle Buffalo @ Oct 21, 2015 -> 10:18 PM) Assuming this holds up, Sox fans should make it a point to NOT gloat. That's what Cubs fans want and expect. Say nothing. It will bother them more. I've been jumping up and down gloating all game to my family, but aside from that I wouldn't act the same in public. Oh and on this forum I'll post my happiness. We're miserable as Sox fans, may as well have their fans join us too for a little while

QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 21, 2015 -> 10:17 PM) Familia gets the 9th Absolutely, and he better be pounding the zone from the first pitch. No nibbling, no wasting offspeed pitches down. Your team has a 5 run lead, dont be cute trying to have the Cubs players swing out of the zone. Especially with how walks demoralize a team. Have them hit their way on

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 21, 2015 -> 09:14 PM) Schwarber is almost forcing the Cubs to catch or trade him. I have a feeling they'll try catching first before selling him low mostly based on the fact that his defense in the OF has been so overexposed this post-season. Knowing/fearing it was a problem and actually seeing it rear its ugly head on the big stage are two different things for Cubs' fans. He definitely will not be an option as a catcher. I'd say they should keep him at LF, give some more time to learn. Otherwise yeah, may as well trade him to the White Sox

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 21, 2015 -> 08:33 PM) And so are LaRoche, Cabrera, Abreu and Avi Garcia. The problem is we have no lefty power threat (see Melky Cabrera, who's now more of a 2 hitter) and haven't since 2009 in Thome (unless you count Dunn from 2012-2014). Compare that to the Royals, with Hosmer, Moustakas, Morales and Zobrist (switch-hitters), Gordon (although he might be gone). On the other hand, multi-dimensional players like Alex Gordon, Cespedes and Heyward will cost you a mint. Justin Upton and Chris Davis also will, although they're flawed players, too. Even second and third tier guys like Parra or Dexter Fowler aren't cheap. Does anyone believe spending X amount of money on Parra or Fowler will get us close to .500? Let's say Cabrera moves to DH, LaRoche is dumped and Parra, Eaton and Fowler was your new OF. Still not seeing that team anywhere close to .500 with 3b, SS, 2B and catching issues. Maybe with nearly 100% health again. Even two reasonable upgrades at any of those positions will bring us close to .500, I believe. However, that isn't an accomplishment unless we build off of that onto 2017 with several FA pickups or additional trades. I understand record improvements from year to year don't always mimmick the Cubs, but with the right upgrades I'd expect a 80-85 win team

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Oct 21, 2015 -> 07:57 PM) Pass I'd consider it if we were able to add another piece. Cheap, power hitting LH bat with plate discipline is what we need. His splits against LH's are worrisome, but overall he's an immediate DH upgrade over Laroche. The problem is, we need more than a one for one deals to improve this team. ANY deal for our pitchers should bring atleast two ML players back in return, or several good prospects close to the majors

QUOTE (Tony82087 @ Oct 21, 2015 -> 07:35 PM) Everyone in baseball is very high on the Cubs future, as they absolutely should be. However, Cubs are no longer going to be looked at the same way after this game is over tonight. Going into next season, there is going to be a ton of optimism, but the regular season isn't going to mean that much, especially to fans. It's going to be prove it time after an awful showing in the NLCS. Pitching is primarily what accounted for their resurgence. One of the best in the majors behind their NL opponents Pirates and St Louis. I'd expect nowhere near the same production across their retread bullpen or Arrieta, primarily. Now, that's not to say they're out of it; with the extra Wild Card spot and the NL being its bad self they'll be around, even with 90-93 wins.

QUOTE (Baron @ Oct 21, 2015 -> 07:33 PM) So much money in that rotation Good! Let them tie themselves to expensive starters. It's going to get awfully expensive with such a young team in five years or so

QUOTE (whitesoxfan99 @ Oct 21, 2015 -> 07:25 PM) Schwarber is not a major league outfielder. Cubs need to hope he can make it as a catcher or that the NL adds the DH. I would expect Theo to b**** about it, since Schwarber's defense has been embarrasing and he's hoping the position is added for his benefit. f*** him, keep the DH in the AL