he gone.

All I know is this better be an exciting offseason. Meaning, we better tear down or continue on this God Forsaken 3 year plan. Standing put and having to read fluff pieces about how Garcia really mentally adjusted in the offseason, and how LaRoche is ready for a bounce back season after putting in more time than he ever has will make me vomit. Make sure the speed and efense is there. Rely on the pitching/defense. Let the offense and speed manufacture runs.

He has the talent, he has the work ethic (the man is built like a horse), he has the arm, he has decent speed. He doesn't have the mental aspect of the game down. Do I think in the right hands he can turn into a JD Martinez? I wouldn't be at all surprised. I look at it this way. If we are not contending next year, and we are cleaning house, maybe a managerial change can help. His whole time in the majors w/ the Sox has been with this staff. He showed signs of being a star in Detroit. Who knows? That being said he's Viciedo. So in recap. If we are going to suck next year, give him a shot with (hopefully) a new coaching staff If we are going to suck with Robin at the helm? 4OF/DH If we are somehow trying to contend? Off the team.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 24, 2015 -> 02:36 PM) Jeff Samardjiza made it very clear he wasn't interested in signing. I'd say the opposite. He may it about as clear as muddy water ..... the only thing he's made clear is that he wanted to test the FA market... “You go out and step in the outfield to shag, or pitching, or whatever you’re doing outside, you take a deep breath and it smells like I’m on the Valparaiso High School field playing. “There is just a comfort level to being in this area. I always have to show up well because I have a lot of people in the stands that are here expecting a lot of me. Yeah, that is absolutely something that is on my list; I love it here,” Samardzija said Even this quote.. he was talking about how he wanted to try free agency but basically wanted to stay on the Sox if they could match the numbers ... Sometimes you have to do that in a month. It's important for me to be able to be on this team all year and really get to know all the players and what the future holds is exciting. I've been pretty adamant about being a free agent. It's really something you shoot for. You are so close to it and you really want to experience it, but like I said before, when the situation is right, it's right. When the numbers are right, the numbers are right."

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Sep 24, 2015 -> 10:59 AM) According to Chris Sale: "There's something to be said for being with a team your whole career and going through the ups and downs," Sale said. "I've been up, I've been down, and I think for me, I would love to win. "I would love to be on a winning team, but I just want it to be here. I don't want to go anywhere else. I don't want to be in a different uniform just because they are good now." http://m.mlb.com/news/article/138478112/ch...-sox-resurgence What is a player supposed to say? Quotes to the media mean absolutely nothing to me? Is he supposed to say he wants to be on a winning team only? Then the media and fans would turn to him during times like this and say he doesn't want to be a good teammate. There's no winning saying anything other than what he has said. I could really care less what Sale wants. Not be armchair GM here, but I just think you trade from your excess to make up for your areas you are weak in. If it's Sale? Okay. If its Rodon, Okay. If its Quintana, okay. But you better fix more than one position with this trade. Trading and fixing just catcher when giving up your most prized possession doesnt work for me.

Shoot, I love Sale, but I'd do that first proposed trade in a second. Listen, Seager could fill the 3B hole, you'd have Tim Anderson filling the SS hole soon enough. Sanchez, Abreu. That's an awesome infield going forward 2017 on. By 2017 Urias would be up. You'd have him Rodon, Q, Fulmer and a ton of money to spend from the expiring contracts of Danks and LaRoche. You'd be able to slot Melky to DH for that final year, and then spend big on an OF. I'd do that trade 20 times over. However, I think even getting JUST those two, they'd laugh. I'm actually for an overhaul right now. If that means Sale, so be it. Not saying it'll happen, but people always talk about his mechanics. What if his arm goes out tomorrow? Then again what if it never does. Truth be told, we have more depth at pitching than anywhere else. Sale would net us more than anybody else. I'm for it. If we can improve 3B and C and OF all by just trading one player? See ya. Otherwise I don't see how this team improves to the point where we are competing year in and year out.

If we truly are entering year 2 of a 3 year window like management believes? Then I say we have to try and trade for an Arenado or someone damn good at some position by using our excess pitching assets in Montas, Fulmer, etc. I think we'd have a capable rotation with Sale, Q, Rodon, Johnson, Danks if you were to build around it by trading some of our young pitching arms. We will also need to add defense in the outfield. Best way to do that is to take one of the corners and stick them at DH. This leaves the problem of dead weight at a bench spot (LaRoche, though how nice of a surprise would it be if he did his career averages next year), but that dead spot should be fine with Saladino taking care of the whole infield as a backup. OF would have to be someone who could cover ground. With trading assets we could have a decent 3B or C. We could sign an OF who has the focus of Defense and covering ground. And we could sign a Zobrist. That is the band-aid. The other choice, and the more I think about it, is my choice. I really just don't have the faith that this team can turn it around. So instead of band-aid'ing the situation. I think you stay put this offseason. Pray for a LaRoche bounce back. Pray that Garcia finds it. Plug with a Catcher. Maybe move around a minor league prospect or two. And then put everybody on the market. Everybody. Sale, Abreu, Eaton, Melky, Roberston ... get prospects. Lick wounds. Build a team that makes sense and in 2-3 years hope that we have a team that is built around Rodon, Anderson, Fulmer, etc. My reason for this choice ... in all reality? Defense. It's just not there. No OF defense, No MI defense, No speed. I think the pitching is championship worthy.

How do you think I'm doing in the booth tonight?

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Sep 18, 2015 -> 08:35 AM) Sorry for the bump, but I think it's worth noting he ended up hitting .341 with 7 homers and 20 runs batted in in 36 games for AAA Charlotte. He's our new DH and 4 OF next year. Playoffs here we come!! I'm glad he did well, and was surprised he couldn't find major league work this year. But he's a .260BA, 20HR, terrible plate discipline and bad defense. Don't want him.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 17, 2015 -> 03:46 PM) I need to plan a trip to Chicago next September for that long homestand. If we are out of the race, would any Soxtalkers give me freebies? That would be cool. Free tickets; free parking. Sit anywhere you want in empty stadium. Nice. Just lurk around the gates on game day, I bet you could have gotten in for free with some effort over the past 2 months.

Phew! I thought Q would pick up his 10th victory for the first time in his career. Go Sox!!

QUOTE (bjm676 @ Sep 17, 2015 -> 03:20 PM) Sad tweet of the day: @SpaldingBalls 5h5 hours ago Wisconsin, USA if current standings hold, the only teams without playoff appearances, 2009-2015: Mariners Marlins Padres White Sox Woof. As a die hard, just like everybody else who is in here right now, that is badddddd. My overall excitement for next year is about as low as it can be too. I don't even know how you fix it.. In years past I had ideas. This year? I don't have any.

QUOTE (oldsox @ Sep 17, 2015 -> 11:03 AM) My Avisail Garcia glass is half full. This is his first complete season in the bigs. I say he will improve a lot in 2017. Mine is pretty much at a quarter full. I haven't really seen many improvements over this year. It'd be one thing if his splits were changing and he were adjusting, but I just don't see it. He's going the way of Viciedo to me. And hopefully the Sox part ways quicker than they did with him... I honestly think his ceiling and his basement are similar. He can hit .265, 15-20HR, play below average defense with an above average arm. That's him. Again, not the problem, but also not the solution.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan99 @ Sep 17, 2015 -> 10:49 AM) Yes, he really can. Abreu is a bad defensive 1b. He would likely be by far and away the worst defensive 3b in baseball if you played him there. Oh, I'm not saying I don't totally agree, but just throwing out options... I've seen him move at 1B, not very nimble. Then again, Miggy isn't very nimble either.

Remember when the Sox were talking earlier in the season of throwing Abreu over at 3B so that they could get both him and LaRoche (Yes, it was that early in the season when LaRoche wasn't considered an albatross) in the lineup at the same time. I'm not saying it's smart, but what if that's an option to move shell pieces around to make this team better? I don't think we're getting rid of LaRoche, and I don't see how to make this team better really with him on it, but let's say we're stuck with him. We instantly have Miggy at 3B (okay, a little less than Miggy), but good bat, probably below average defense. Put LaRoche at 1st and cross your fingers, toes, and eyes that he can bounce back at a year older and hit .250, 20HR, and 70RBI. Now you can shift Avi (although I don't really see him turning a corner, and if he turns a corner, it's a turn onto Viciedo St) or Melky out of the OF and into your DH spot. Upgrade OF with a Cespedes? Or maybe put Micah at DH if we are looking for a cheap option. That gives the team more speed, offense. I mean, Abreu can't be that bad at 3B if the Sox brought it up to the media earlier in the year. It would make this team more versatile for sure. Have him start 100 games at 3B, 30 at DH, 20 at 1B. Have Saladino start 60 at 3B. Eaton Melky Abreu Cespedes/Heyward LaRoche Alexei Avi/Micah (DH) Sanchez (Catcher)

Keeping him at the deadline was the right decision. Look at the Indians even today, 20 games left, sitting at one under .500, and like 5 games out. Still sadly doable. When I look back at this season, even with the poor defense, even with the poor offense early, I still peg this season on Shark. If he does his job like he did last year, there is no doubt in my mind we have 5-7 more victories. Let's call it 6 -- we'd be 74-69, 2 games out of the playoffs. Sale did his job, Danks did his job (I looked back at his stats, he realistically gave us a chance to win in 17 of 27 starts), Rodon exceeded expectations for me, and Q was solid as usual. The bullpen was what I expected, greatly improved. The offense, although it sputtered, ultimately didn't do entirely much worse than I figured (2B and 3B didn't meet my expectations), the defense was on par with what I thought, though a bit worse (beginning of the season hurt, also the OF is a problem now and going forward IMO). So in the end I blame it solely on two guys. LaRoche and Shark. I don't even call it worst case scenario, but I'd give QO to Shark, if he takes it, so be it. He should, in reality, be a very solid 4 on this team next year if he wants a re-do before another FA try. I'd do another year with this rotation. I don't think he takes it, and I think he winds up with a 4-5 yr deal similar to Ervin Santana. I'm calling a 4year, $56mm deal.

QUOTE (shysocks @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 03:56 PM) I've had exactly one exchange with you before this one. It ended with you calling me a dumbass. Not exactly indicative of me always disagreeing with you. Either way, if you don't like people disagreeing with you, don't post on a message board. There are a few problems with all of the above. One, you're citing a bunch of numbers that are either unimportant or dependent on playing time. You act like Alexei is twice as reliable. His ability to stay on the field is definitely an asset, but Freese didn't break into the majors and start right away. That's more responsible for the large gap than anything. Since Freese's first full year as a starter, he's played in 513 games to Alexei's 607. You act like Alexei's 108 homers to 65 are an advantage when they're mostly the result of that initial playing time gap. Batting average is overrated. You can talk about "spreadsheets blah blah blah" all you want, but an offense with a good OBP and slugging - areas where Freese is decidedly better than Alexei - is more likely to score runs than one with a good batting average. RBI's are dumb and I'm sure you've heard the reasons why by now. Stolen bases and strikeouts just don't matter in today's baseball. Sort the teams by SB and K's and look at how randomly their runs scored jump around. Errors? Surely you know they're an inadequate way of measuring defense. Two, you're ignoring home parks. Ramirez has hit a homer once every 45.5 plate appearances to Freese's 40.7. Not that big a deal, but this difference is made more notable by the fact that Freese has played in stadiums that suppress home run power while Alexei has played in one that enhances it. Same goes for Freese's advantage in OPS, one that you glossed over up there but is easily the most important stat mentioned. Check out their home road splits. Three, you're citing career stats. I hardly care what somebody did five years ago. It's almost irrelevant. Freese hit like a bona fide stud for a little while, but that hitter is gone. In his place is a hitter who is still better than Alexei Ramirez. Last three years - that cutoff is a favor to you because it leaves out Freese's best season - Freese has hit .258/.326/.389 to Ramirez' .272/.302/.385. Alexei's key advantages are his offense relative to his position, an advantage you would be eliminating by pushing him to third, and his defensive ability, which is eroding. If I'm paying them the same amount to play third base next year, I am absolutely taking Freese. If you want to continue to argue and talk about RBI's, fine, but know that I don't care. I think the Royals would disagree with your speeds and strikeout stats. There is a reason the Sox, who needed a 3B this offseason, and all the other GM's took a pass on Freese this year and he had to settle for a one year, $6.5mm contract. There is also a reason why most likely he will have to settle for a similar one year pact this off season, and IMO will be out of th league in 2 years. He is exactly the list of 2 dozen names the Sox have had at 3B over the past decade. We're both passionate about the Sox (obvious to be posting on this board at this juncture of the season) I just think your views are completely wrong. Freese = bum with one good postseason.

QUOTE (shysocks @ Sep 9, 2015 -> 10:26 AM) That doesn't even mean anything. The argument is that he's not a good enough hitter to play third base. He is an okay hitter for a shortstop; he is a bad hitter for a third baseman. No spreadsheet necessary, it isn't that complicated. I've learned in my time posting on this board regardless of what I say ShySocks, you will always disagree with it. You want stats? I'll give you stats. I believe I've made my point clear, and I've explained it with stats and clear reasoning, but if you'd like more, I'll do it. This one is actually pretty easy to explain. They both started their MLB careers at 26 years old. In that time Freese has played 697 games, Alexei has played 1205. Why is this stat important? He is more reliable -- by almost double. Next year when Freese gets injured and a team has to go pick up a Connor Gilaspie or play a Matt Davidson or Mike Olt at 3B, that would hurt the overall stats and production of that position. For Production? They have struck out exactly the same amount times. Cant make that up. Stats dont lie. 578 times. Alexei in 4910 AB's. Freese in 2645 AB's. 221 Doubles for Alexei. 127 for Freese. 108HR to 65. 534 RBI to 338. 234 BB to 214BB. This is where playing more games helps! Backups are backups for a reason, when you are hurt you can't produce, and the player who does take your position generally can't put up the numbers like the starter. .274 BA for Alexei to .276 for Freese (Wooooo!!! A stat in your favor) OPS of .759 to .711 in favor of Freese. Freese is going to be 33, Alexei 34. Neither are young. 135 SB for Alexei, 8 for Freese. 121 Errors for Alexie at SS in 1081 games versus 63 errors in 638 games. Essentially 1 every 10 games for each, but Alexei playing a tougher position. What other stats do you want me to put out there? I'm taking Alexei for $10mm over Freese for $7mm plus $1mm buyout for Alexei.

If we are looking at his $10mm as too much then we have a whole other set of problems for this team going forward. Realistically, let's say we go with another option, say Freese or Uribe. We buy out Alexei for $1mm. Sign either of those guys for 2yr, $12-14mm contracts. Is having two years committed to either of those players AND at $7mm each + $1mm buyout (so $8mm next year) really worth it compared to keeping Alexei for a 1 year obligation at $10mm?? I also don't like this argument of "look at his first half stats he's declining" -- so he was so old that he was declining for the first 80 games, but the second half, after playing everyday all of a sudden he's fresh and playing well, but it should be discounted? Look at the season as a whole. Each of 162 games count just as much. Is he too much of a streaky player at times? Yes. But each game counts for the same. I don't think anybody here would be surprised if he finishes with a .265 BA. and very similar stats to his career. Just a tick below. If we are going with the his first half stats argument then we have to do the same for the whole Sox team. Eaton, Melky, etc. In terms of WAR or OPS, blah blah blah. His range is declining, his arm is still strong, he may make boneheaded plays at times ... but that is why 3rd base is perfect for him IMO. Again, the argument will be his WAR at SS compared to 3B, blah blah blah. Sorry, I don't play/armchair GM on an Excel spreadsheet. I am going by the eye test from what I see watching 140+ games a year and against what is realistically available in the FA market. I will take .270, a dozen homers, 65RBI, 35 doubles, and 25 SB, a good arm, and reliable health from my 3B for a 1 year, $10mm commitment over what is out there any day.

I won't have as much detail, I'll probably have more of a plan as I digest who the FA are, possibilities, etc. However: I'd be more than okay trading pitching depth for a 3B. I too, love Arenado, and think for the right price the Rockies who are just as awful, would trade him for a nice return. I'd love to give up someone like a Fulmer more than a proven commodity in Quintana, but I'd do what it takes. Other than that: Generally would like somehow to improve outfield speed/athleticism and improve DH. If there are open pocketbooks I think this has to be done by trading and eating LaRoches contract. I don't think we can survive with him filling the Paulie role of slow, trodding, old, bench player. Or even worse, as starting DH. He's a wasted space, and needs to be gone. With him gone --- maybe Micah DH, maybe someone new? Maybe a shiny new outfielder and Avi at DH. I just think it lends to more flexibility without LaRoche I hate myself for saying it, but, sign Soto/Flowers -- but flip flop them. More time for Soto, less for Flowers. Pitching, think will be fine. If you trade a Q or a Fulmer, etc. then I think you go out and sign a Kennedy, Buehrle, etc.

Meh. Overall. I mean 162 games of baseball with basically the same schedules give or take. Not like I end up going to any of the Sox/Cubs games, but it does lend itself to more excitement to have the games on the weekend. Also starting on the West Coast? I'd like to start in the division. 3 of the first 11 on the road ... But it is what it is. I'll still be there that Opening Day Friday cheering on the team with blinders on, thinking that is the year it turns around. Also will probably be Danks or 5th starter for Opening Day too .... 5th game, no off day before.

Exactly! There aren't many viable options out there, so barring a trade, what is the best for next year, along with looking towards the future? of what we hope is Anderson playing a viable roll at SS. I think as I proposed (unless Jerry is making a push next year) it allows us the best chance to compete while preparing for the future. (Determining Micah vs. Sanchez, who again we hope will fill our 2B roll for a long time too. Not ideal, but i'm looking at realistic options. I think Alexei either at $10mm or, $1mm buyout, 2 YR about $14mm deal makes sense. Hey in a perfect world? I honestly would trade whatever the Rockies want for Arenado. I'm not sure we'd have the pieces they want. But they want Rodon? Fulmer? Q? I'd listen and explore. Yes those guys are difference makers and stars or hopefully future stars. However look at the FA market for pitching. It's generally more expensive, BUT also deeper. Let's say we traded Quintana (or Rodon or Fulmer) + others for Arenado. I think we'd agree signing someone like a Buerhle, Iwukama, Kennedy, etc. to replace Q along with having Arenado on the roster is more valuable than having Quintana/Saladino combo. We've proven to develop pitchers, we haven't come close to proving we can develop bats.

QUOTE (shysocks @ Sep 8, 2015 -> 12:22 PM) I'll start by saying that Alexei is one of the last guys who comes to mind when I think of "smart" baseball players, but that's a discussion for another day. To the topic at hand: A big reason Alexei was valuable in his best years is that he was a capable hitter at a position with few of them. Shift him to third base, and not only are you putting him in a spot on the field you aren't sure he can handle, you're also diminishing any offensive value he might provide for his position. This for the purpose of shifting another guy, Sanchez, to a position he may not be as suited for. This for the purpose of making room for Micah Johnson, which is a noble goal but one I'm not sure we need to move Alexei to third base to achieve. I guess I'm just uncomfortable with all these guys moving out of position. Sometimes it's that easy, but often it's not. Putting Sanchez at short to add Micah to the lineup - there's a chance that makes the Sox better, and it has the benefit of evaluating them both for a year. Adding Micah makes Alexei's speed less essential, though, and the resulting infield is basically powerless. If we're talking stopgap third basemen, assuming the salaries are similar, I'd rather have David Freese, who has proven to be a decent hitter and plays the position already. Not saying it's ideal. But this team as currently constructed isn't ideal. So you play the hand dealt. There aren't really viable options out there in the FA market or in house. Sanchez has played more than a cup of coffee at SS. He basically split between SS and 2B from 2012-2014. I've never really understood the value of a player at one position vs. another. Alexei's value is the same at SS as it is at 3B when there are no other options at 3B -- the other options are Davidson in house, Saladino in house, and poor FA class that are similar to the 20 3B we've been through in the past decade. Just as a comparision here are 3 players: Player A: .225BA, 10HR, 23 2B, 52RBI, 6 SB, 108SO, 52BB --- 572 AB Player B: .245BA, 11HR, 20 2B, 45RBI, 1 SB, 84 SO, 26BB ----- 339AB Player C: .253BA, 9HR, 26 2B, 54 RBI, 17SB, 58 SO, 23 BB ----- 498 AB Player A are the Sox 3B combined this year, Player B is Freese, and Player C is Alexei (who I'm biased, but is having his worst year, but is still beating out the other options). I'll be honest, it was closer than I thought. But someone like Freese to me should not be the option ... he's just another guy on that long list. He's had 4 straight years of declining batting average, 4 straight years of declining OBP, 4 straight years of declining walks, 4 straight years of declining RBI .... I don't think you go out of house for that option.

I'll start with this caveat. I think that this off-season may be full of a bunch of moves. I don't see us staying put like we did a few years back with Dunn, AJ, Peavy, etc. and hoping for different results. So a lot of this is hypothetical -- the first domino will have to fall first to see the direction we're headed. However my thoughts ... Alexei since ASB? .301./.342/.473 -- 7 HR, 27RBI, 11 2B, 7 SB. His range is starting to fall off a bit, but I do think he has value on this team. Even at a $10mm option. Replacing 20-25 SB, 30 2B, a good arm, and a smart, reliable player is not that easy. Check out this stat of starting 3B since Crede for the Sox -- it reads like the Bears starting QB since Favre/Rodgers graphic they always show: Gordon Beckham Wilson Betemit Emilio Bonaficio Eduardo Escobar Josh Fields Leury Garcia Conor Gillaspie Orlando Hudson Jeff Keppinger Brent Lillibridge Jose Lopez Dallas McPherson Brent Morel Jayson Nix Mike Ott Ray Olmedo Tyler Saladino Marcus Semien Mark Teahen Dayan Viciedo Omar Vizquel Kevin Youkilis Also look at the 3B free agents ... nothing much prettier than the above. (Chris Davis/Uribe is about it) So with that being said ... (and I'd still love some kind of blockbuster trade where we trade pitching for Arenado, though I know that is dreaming) why not explore Alexei as a stop-gap at 3B? Declining range, still very strong arm, is better IMO than any in house option and most FA. Get to keep the speed he brings to the team, the consistency of him starting 150-160 games, the doubles, etc. This also allows the Sox to move Sanchez to SS, bring up the speed and bat of Micah (though the D comes with it). I do think he has an MLB bat though. It improves the overall team in my opinion. Also gives them a full year to determine who their starting 2B should be moving forward (Sanchez or Micah) when Anderson is finally up. I do think you have to bring in another Power Bat though to offset a weak infield/sunk coast of LaRoche. Ideally Cespedes, shift Garcia to DH. But don't think Uncle Jerry is opening the pocket book on this mess of a team.

Shoot, if it wasn't for fantasy baseball I would have checked out on this team months earlier. People who defend or get all riled up that "fantasy" is ruining the sport?? Get a grip. People can watch baseball for anything. Some people might go for fireworks, some might go for a bobblehead, others the smells of a polish and onion, the others a crack of the bat, others to fill a scorecard. I watch my Sox for the game, but fantasy doesn't hurt that. That being said. Shark ruined my season. Over and Over. Worst draft pick ever.

There was a note about giving the bobble head give away on days they were already expecting a big crowd. Wknd, Yankees, Frank Thomas retirement day. The reason for that is very very simple. It was to get 25,000 people in the door an hour and a half before the game. That way they are drinking $8 beers inside and $5 hot dogs rather than sitting in the parking lot or driving in right at game time. Sell 2 beers and the bobble is paid for already.