OmarComing25

QUOTE (Frank_Thomas35 @ Jan 6, 2016 -> 12:35 AM) Itll definitely be interesting what Gordon signing first tomorrow would do to the rest of the market. Not sure it would do as much as you think, since for the most part it seems like different teams are in on Gordon and Cespedes/Upton with the exception of us.

I bet Colby Rasmus is even more happy that he took the QO now.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 06:32 PM) I thought the Giants were out after they signed Leake. The Giants traded for Leake at the deadline, but the Cardinals signed Leake in the offseason.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 03:35 PM) I'd argue differently when one of the two finished 5th, 4th, 3rd, 2nd, 4th in MVP voting during a 5-year stretch. You can argue about PED speculation if you'd like, and that's probably fair, but the original comment was if PEDs were a non-issue QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 03:46 PM) Oh I wasn't talking about PEDs at all. I think I'd agree that peak Ortiz was a bit better in relation to his peers than Martinez was, but Martinez's peers were so much better at the time that it feels like splitting hairs. I'm not willing to think of Edgar as a lesser player simply because he peaked in the same years as Frank Thomas. Is it even true that Ortiz was better in relation to his peers? Whether you go by fWAR or bWAR Martinez has a substantial advantage by WAR, and when it comes to hitting the only thing Ortiz has on Edgar is HR (granted by a big margin), while Edgar is better at everything else, especially in OBP. Though Ortiz did lead the AL in wRC+ (157) during his offensive peak ('03-'07), during Edgar's offensive peak ('95-'00), he also led the AL in wRC+ (163) if you don't count McGwire's two and a half seasons in the AL during that time (and you shouldn't). If you go by full career instead of offensive peak Edgar looks better than Ortiz compared to his peers by wRC+. Yes Ortiz has more top 5 MVP finishes, but that assumes the voting in those isn't flawed, and he for sure didn't deserve to be top 5 in '03 or '04.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 02:26 PM) Billy Koch. If they kept Foulke, I wonder what happens. Of course Cotts helped in 2005. Dan Wright didn't help much either.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 02:17 PM) PEDs or not, there's little justification for Ortiz in the Hall and E Martinez not, not to mention not being able to garner even 50%. Agreed, if Ortiz gets in and Edgar doesn't, I will be sharpening my pitchfork.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 01:44 PM) It says total GB % 47.6%. Where do you see 31% and 40.5% http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playe...&position=P Look at the batted ball section.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 01:27 PM) 52.4%, however, is. http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playe...&position=P Not seeing where this figure is, I still see 31% for his career, and even this year where he only pitched 19 innings his FB% was 40.5%, nowhere close to 52.4%.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 01:06 PM) That puts him at the bottom of the top 1/4 of SS. That's what an org is looking for out of their top prospect? I'm looking for an all star, frankly. And if 3 WAR is what his is, that's certainly not worth the combined value of Montas, Thompson and Micah who will assuredly exceed that. (they'll likely exceed Frazier's WAR as well). I think your expectations are too high, even among the best prospects half of them will fail to stick at the ML level, and among those that do a great portion of them won't be All Star quality. A consistent 3 WAR player would be a great get for your top prospect, over the past 5 seasons there's only been 4 SS in the MLB who have averaged at least 3 WAR per season (Tulo, Peralta, Desmond, and Reyes). One 3 WAR player is also much more valuable than 3 1 WAR players.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 12:58 PM) I really don't see the Giants being big threats. The Orioles if they loose out on davis have supposedly are more interested in upton. Tho the Orioles owner like davis so much he's willing to give him every opportunity to come back. That supposed offer they withdrew is still kinda there. Angels don't want to hit the luxury tax and they are so right handed that might take them away from Cespedes. Only real team I see could be threats on Cespedes is tigers. To me Baltimore and LA are the two biggest threats, and then SF and Detroit are 2nd tier threats. Don't really see the Tigers being big threats because it would put them over the luxury tax limit for several seasons in a row, and I doubt they want to do that.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 01:00 PM) That's a big concern about EJ (everyone's fav Nate Jones too). Probably would have been a good guy to trade (coupled with what I infer is the org's lack of trust in him). Carroll has a great gb%. He may be more effective with this revitalized infield D. (although the D was fine last year after May and he still had a high WHIP). Petricka has the same game, but is more effective. Samardzija had a low gb%, which is another reason why that acquisition was curious. Jones' career FB% is 31%, that's not very concerning.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 12:44 PM) The Sox gave Paulino $2 million. He made 4 starts for them and 5 in Charlotte. I also don't think his contract is fully guaranteed until some time in spring training. It still seems hard to believe that in 2014 we gave 71 starts to Hector Noesi, Felipe Paulino, Scott Carroll, Andre Rienzo, Chris Bassitt and Erik Johnson. That is truly frightening.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 12:39 PM) This is why I like Cespedes more cause he hasn't fully been in a homerun park. Playing at the Cell could easily see him maintain 30+ homers. Maybe even more. That's why I don't think the Giants are the biggest threat to sign him, he's a much bigger risk in that park.

Johnson is better than Carroll, but the point in Carroll's favor is that strong groundball rate the last two years, while Johnson's 52% FB% last year is very concerning. He got a bit lucky that most of the HR he gave up were just solo HR, so his ERA ended up looking OK.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 12:02 PM) Why would the Reds/Dodgers have had any interest in Alexei? We also didn't have him on the roster, so I'm not sure how we could have traded him.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 11:43 AM) One more reason to like Cespedes is that his ceiling is much higher than Gordon's. If he repeats last year's break out season, or exceeds it, which he has the talent to do, he would be a Super Star. It's very unlikely that Gordon's production would be anywhere near that level. Cespedes was worth 6.7 WAR in 2015. Gordon was worth 6.6 WAR in 2011 and 6.6 WAR in 2014.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 5, 2016 -> 09:53 AM) Speaking of "dismissive"... In the MLB of the '10's what is wrong with "another Alexei"? Up until 2015, he was one of the better SS's in the game. Without steroids, guys like that don't grow on trees anymore. From 2009-2014 Alexei averaged 3 WAR per season, if Anderson is able to put up a stretch like that I think we'd all be very happy.

At first, Gordon was my least preferred of the 3 by a decent margin, but as this has dragged on I've been liking the idea of him more and more. Despite his age, he seems like he has the highest floor of the three, which I really like given our recent bad luck with position player acquisitions.

QUOTE (The Ginger Kid @ Jan 4, 2016 -> 03:36 PM) A friend of mine who covers the Angels for FSW is also hearing Upton, fwiw. Hearing what about Upton?

Regardless of the true size of the gap between Happ and Danks from 2013-2015, I'll be happy when Danks' contract is no longer on the books. I say he signs a 3yr/$25-27M deal after this season with somebody.

Agree that there's a big drop off after the top 3, hopefully the upcoming draft can make that list look better a year from now.

And if there's one area where Hahn/KW have proven to be adept in the last few years, it's contract negotiations. I trust them to play this right, assuming the money is there.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 01:05 PM) Davis is knocked for his poor base running and defense at 1B so is he really an outfield option? But the team that signs Davis was not really in the market for an outfielder in the first place considering Davis is a 1B/DH which correlates with my response above. But if Baltimore signs Davis, then they're likely out of the running for the Big 3, and they're one of the few teams that seem to actually have the money available to offer a big contract to them.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Jan 2, 2016 -> 11:39 AM) Ilitch is old and the Tigers are built to win now. Their farm system is f***ed anyway, so I wouldn't be surprised to see them try to get one of the big 3 even if it put them over the luxury tax. I wouldn't be surprised either, but it's not like he has a history of willing to go over the tax limit.

Anyone think Davis might be the one holding up the market? If he signs with Baltimore that takes out one of the big players. As for the other teams, it sounds like St. Louis will trade for a Colorado OF, the Tigers would be over the Luxury Tax penalty for the next several seasons if they made a big offer, and I think Ilitch has only gone over once in the past decade (2008). The Angels also seem afraid to go over the tax limit, and the Giants are currently being linked to Desmond, and if they sign him I don't think they'd also commit big money to Cespedes. There really might be a smaller market for Cespedes than we think, which makes the 3-year demands seem not so unreasonable from our side, though I still think it's just posturing. We might be able to sign him for 4 years.