Adam Engel

[chitownsportsfan]

they both have about as much chance of posting a positive WAR next year as I do. CF is Leury's for now.

Edited January 19, 2018 by chitownsportsfan

[Balta1701]

That's why I think he can. he played 6 years in the minors with decent stats (bad, really). Suddenly, in 2016 he sports a .793 OPS in Charlotte - he had never been close to that before at any level of the minor leagues. Then last year, he does a decent job in the majors, taking another step up. I think there's a decent chance he takes a third step up this year.

Don't forget with Leury - he's also a guy that was pushed very aggressively through the minors. He was in AA at age 21, and then spent only a few weeks at AAA before he was called up. Both the Rangers and the White Sox needed a utility guy role filled and it was more important to have that role filled on the big league squad than to see if the player could develop into anything. Some of his minor league performances likely reflect those decisions.

[ptatc]

That's why I think he can. he played 6 years in the minors with decent stats (bad, really). Suddenly, in 2016 he sports a .793 OPS in Charlotte - he had never been close to that before at any level of the minor leagues. Then last year, he does a decent job in the majors, taking another step up. I think there's a decent chance he takes a third step up this year.

It's possible. However, I think he is more likely a guy who will have his weaknesses exposed with extended playing time.

[Lillian]

I think that you will all enjoy listening to the latest Sox Podcast, on CSN. Nicky Delmonico is very impressed with the strides made by Engel, during the offseason.

He believes that we will all be pleasantly surprised by how he is going to hit. Very encouraging:

 

https://art19.com/shows/white-sox-podcast/e...2b-0e26a9a8fa0f

 

[Thad Bosley]

[/b]

It's possible. However, I think he is more likely a guy who will have his weaknesses exposed with extended playing time.

The only “weakness” Leury exhibited up until last year was being overwhelmed by MLB pitching. There’s never been anything “weak” about his defensive game or his speed. And last year he did not even remotely look like he was being overwhelmed at the plate. Quite the contrary, actually. He was quite effective getting on base while displaying some surprising power until he got hurt. So not quite sure what you think will be “exposed” with continued playing time for him this coming season.

 

Meanwhile, putting Tilson in some proper context: he was a #12 ranked prospect in the game’s 18th ranked farm system at the time of acquisition a year and a half ago, and he hasn’t played a full game since that acquisition. Hard to see the promise in his return given how much development time the poor guy has missed.

[CWSpalehoseCWS]

Personally, I think Tilson is a DFA candidate for when the Sox need a roster spot. I bet you they could easily get him through waivers. With missing the entire season last year, they guy needs to be in the minors trying to get back into the rhythm of playing every day. But having said that, the Sox absolutely should allow him to complete in the spring. If he manages to out hit Engel and Garcia then he deserves first shot.

Edited January 19, 2018 by CWSpalehoseCWS

[ptatc]

The only “weakness” Leury exhibited up until last year was being overwhelmed by MLB pitching. There’s never been anything “weak” about his defensive game or his speed. And last year he did not even remotely look like he was being overwhelmed at the plate. Quite the contrary, actually. He was quite effective getting on base while displaying some surprising power until he got hurt. So not quite sure what you think will be “exposed” with continued playing time for him this coming season.

 

Meanwhile, putting Tilson in some proper context: he was a #12 ranked prospect in the game’s 18th ranked farm system at the time of acquisition a year and a half ago, and he hasn’t played a full game since that acquisition. Hard to see the promise in his return given how much development time the poor guy has missed.

I would call a .316 OBP effective.

 

I think he will be exposed as many utility players are. He does well with limited time and proper playing situations and will probably revert closer to his career OBP of .270 than his performance last year. Don't get me wrong, i think he has a place it's just not as a dependable starter.

 

 

This may be the case with Tilson. But for everything you've said his MiLB stats are better than Garcia's and the fact still remains that they have no idea what he will do in the MLB. I just think that ina developing year why see more of Garcia when they can see what they have in Tilson. Garcia will be around as a utility guy at worst, why not see how others do, they aren't trying to win this year.

 

Play Tilson in CF and let Garcia develop in his role as the utility guy because that's where he will be in a couple of years when the Sox are competing.

 

 

[Lillian]

I'm still hoping and rooting for Engel. His upside is much higher than the other candidates. I understand that he needs to make more contact, but he has the best tools.

That Podcast, for which I provided the link, sounds very encouraging. Delmonico made a special point of mentioning how much he has improved, over the winter and how great he looks, in the batting cage. I'm really looking forward to seeing what adjustments he has made.

 

[Chicago White Sox]

I would call a .316 OBP effective.

 

I think he will be exposed as many utility players are. He does well with limited time and proper playing situations and will probably revert closer to his career OBP of .270 than his performance last year. Don't get me wrong, i think he has a place it's just not as a dependable starter.

 

 

This may be the case with Tilson. But for everything you've said his MiLB stats are better than Garcia's and the fact still remains that they have no idea what he will do in the MLB. I just think that ina developing year why see more of Garcia when they can see what they have in Tilson. Garcia will be around as a utility guy at worst, why not see how others do, they aren't trying to win this year.

 

Play Tilson in CF and let Garcia develop in his role as the utility guy because that's where he will be in a couple of years when the Sox are competing.

Limited playing time? From April 6th to June 15th he got 200 plate appearances. He was practically an everyday starter before he got hurt. During that period he put an .804 OPS & wRC+ of 115. It honestly doesn’t seem like you followed him very closely last year.

 

And again, you continue to ignore Leury’s AAA stats in 2015 & 2016, which were better than Tilson’s AAA numbers. Furthermore, Leury has much better physical tools than Tilson and offers much more versatility. If Leury can come anywhere close to the numbers I mentioned above, he could be a poor man’s Ben Zobrist and that would be incredibly valuable. There are legit reasons to believe Leury is finally tapping into his potential and he deserves everyday at-bats to see what he really is. I don’t need to give 600 at-bats to Charlie Tilson to know he won’t play a significant role on our next playoff team or become a valuable trade chip.

[Chicago White Sox]

I'm still hoping and rooting for Engel. His upside is much higher than the other candidates. I understand that he needs to make more contact, but he has the best tools.

That Podcast, for which I provided the link, sounds very encouraging. Delmonico made a special point of mentioning how much he has improved, over the winter and how great he looks, in the batting cage. I'm really looking forward to seeing what adjustments he has made.

I’m probably Nicky Delmonico’s biggest fan on this site, but I could give two s***s what he say about a teammate. I think you’re setting yourself up for disappointment Lillian, but hopefully Engel can prove me wrong.

[ptatc]

Limited playing time? From April 6th to June 15th he got 200 plate appearances. He was practically an everyday starter before he got hurt. During that period he put an .804 OPS & wRC+ of 115. It honestly doesn’t seem like you followed him very closely last year.

 

And again, you continue to ignore Leury’s AAA stats in 2015 & 2016, which were better than Tilson’s AAA numbers. Furthermore, Leury has much better physical tools than Tilson and offers much more versatility. If Leury can come anywhere close to the numbers I mentioned above, he could be a poor man’s Ben Zobrist and that would be incredibly valuable. There are legit reasons to believe Leury is finally tapping into his potential and he deserves everyday at-bats to see what he really is. I don’t need to give 600 at-bats to Charlie Tilson to know he won’t play a significant role on our next playoff team or become a valuable trade chip.

Your comment about his good 200 at bats is exactly the limited time I was talking about. He will have good stats in limited time but over the course of a season the stats will even out and show exactly what he is. You described him perfectly with your comment on versatility. This is why he will be around as a versatile utility guy, so why not develop him in that role. I don't think he is finally tapping into his potential. I think he will be exactly what he is.

 

I feel much better that you don't need to give 600 at bats to Tilson. He probably won't be any better than Garcia and probably won't be around on your next playoff team. However, Garcia probably won't be anything more than a utility guy on those teams either. So why not see what the Sox have in Tilson because neither are going to be much, it's just that Garcia can play the infield and OF so they'll keep him around.

 

Edit: Actually, I can believe I've spent this much time on this subject. Neither player will be of any significance on a good team. If either are prominent players in 2019, the Sox will be awful. I'm going to leave it at neither are very good, neither will be most than extra pieces and neither are relevant to the success of the Sox future.

Edited January 19, 2018 by ptatc

[southsider2k5]

Personally, I think Tilson is a DFA candidate for when the Sox need a roster spot. I bet you they could easily get him through waivers. With missing the entire season last year, they guy needs to be in the minors trying to get back into the rhythm of playing every day. But having said that, the Sox absolutely should allow him to complete in the spring. If he manages to out hit Engel and Garcia then he deserves first shot.

 

DFA? Nah, they were ready to hand the guy the starting job a year ago. It will take some time, and there are more guys ahead of him to go first.

[Jose Abreu]

Scott Merkin‏Verified account

@scottmerkin

 

How does Engel feel approaching the '18 season? "This is the most excited I've been from an offensive standpoint in my entire career. If Spring Training started today, I would feel like I'm in a better spot than I've ever been, and I just believe in what I'm doing."

[Chicago White Sox]

Scott Merkin‏Verified account

@scottmerkin

 

How does Engel feel approaching the '18 season? "This is the most excited I've been from an offensive standpoint in my entire career. If Spring Training started today, I would feel like I'm in a better spot than I've ever been, and I just believe in what I'm doing."

This comes across as a Gordon Beckham quote.

Edited January 19, 2018 by Chicago White Sox

[bmags]

This comes across as a Gordon Beckham quote.

 

Ha, too on the nose.

[fathom]

Leury is so underrated on this site. He was on his way to a huge WAR prior to the injury.