I get that the Bulls have been bad for most of Hoiberg's time here, but I never really felt like he was the problem.  This is the NBA though, the coach is usually the first one on the firing line.

Paxson made a lot of promises to ST holders this year. I know a few that got phone calls that bulls wouldn't tank this year.

So, I do not believe Bulls intend to take advantage of their bad start in order to land Zion or Barrett.

OTOH, I do think if Bulls cannot put a respectable end of year together Paxson could legitimately be out.

5 minutes ago, bmags said:

And Jabari Parker was also a SF. When I see stuff like that I see Fred trying to show the front office that the player they said is worth developing sucks, and once he proves it moves on to the next guy. He also had parker play SF for 3 preseason games before moving on, after all summer Forman and Paxson saying he could play SF. People not payed could see that was false, but Hoiberg had to play along for a bit.

Everything in your second paragraph is team construction. Fred likes pace, moving the ball, three pointers. He has no point guard that can play with pace, a bunch of ball dominant players that love mid range jumpers.

They actually have tried schemes on defense, Parker doesn't know them. Lavine gets lost too often. The only good player is WCJ.

You couldn't put a worse basketball iq team together than the 2018 bulls without lauri/dunn.

Part of being a good coach is that you coach to what talent you have. Its great that Hoiberg likes pace, moving the ball and three pointers. But if you dont have the players for "your" style, you dont just continue to run it. You actually look at the talent you have and you start running plays/systems to take advantage of their skill set.

Hoiberg isnt some HOF coach who the rest of the world needs to revolve around. 

Hoiberg was a nice guy and maybe on an ultra talented team would be a great coach. But he isnt the coach for the Bulls right now, and it was painfully evident. 

9 minutes ago, Soxbadger said:

Part of being a good coach is that you coach to what talent you have. Its great that Hoiberg likes pace, moving the ball and three pointers. But if you dont have the players for "your" style, you dont just continue to run it. You actually look at the talent you have and you start running plays/systems to take advantage of their skill set.

Hoiberg isnt some HOF coach who the rest of the world needs to revolve around. 

Hoiberg was a nice guy and maybe on an ultra talented team would be a great coach. But he isnt the coach for the Bulls right now, and it was painfully evident. 

Sure, but why hire hoiberg if you were never going to give him a team that suits his vision? You don't have to supply him with the perfect pieces, but they supplied him with players specifically incompatible with his playing style (and much of the nba trends!)

3 minutes ago, bmags said:

Sure, but why hire hoiberg if you were never going to give him a team that suits his vision? You don't have to supply him with the perfect pieces, but they supplied him with players specifically incompatible with his playing style (and much of the nba trends!)

I feel like Garpax felt like they gave him good teams that he should win with during the Jimmy years for sure, and I think this year they expected more.

 

im not saying that is right, but I think they felt like that. Pretty sure in his introductory press conference, Gar said they have a championship contender roster or something like that.

Jerry and Michael really need to whack GarPax. They've won nothing, and have been in charge for 15 fucking seasons. Enough already. 

At least KW and Hahn won a fucking championship. 

Edited December 3, 20187 yr by Jack Parkman

Just now, bmags said:

Sure, but why hire hoiberg if you were never going to give him a team that suits his vision? You don't have to supply him with the perfect pieces, but they supplied him with players specifically incompatible with his playing style (and much of the nba trends!)

Maybe they thought Hoiberg was a good enough coach that he would be able to modify his system to work with the players on his team. I dont care what his system was, he simply couldnt get control of the team. 

 

2 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

I feel like Garpax felt like they gave him good teams that he should win with during the Jimmy years for sure, and I think this year they expected more.

 

im not saying that is right, but I think they felt like that. Pretty sure in his introductory press conference, Gar said they have a championship contender roster or something like that.

Which is why I think the good news here is this may mean that the president and gm realized that it wasn't just Hoiberg who was under a microscope for this season.

22 minutes ago, lostfan said:

I get that the Bulls have been bad for most of Hoiberg's time here, but I never really felt like he was the problem.  This is the NBA though, the coach is usually the first one on the firing line.

Originally, I thought Hoiberg was awful. Last year he grew on me and I saw some development. I've said for a while, I had no idea whether he was good or a turd. I do think we saw enough to know he wasn't great/elite.  The roster design the past year and a half was not one where you could really state the Bulls should be winning games and I'm not putting that on the front office or the coach...its the nature of a rebuild.

I do think it is clear that from day 1, Paxson was skeptical of Hoiberg and the wording of the release made it very clear this was a Paxson move.  

So how many coaching hires does Paxson get to be involved in before he is moved out the door?

Just now, Chisoxfn said:

Originally, I thought Hoiberg was awful. Last year he grew on me and I saw some development. I've said for a while, I had no idea whether he was good or a turd. I do think we saw enough to know he wasn't great/elite.  The roster design the past year and a half was not one where you could really state the Bulls should be winning games and I'm not putting that on the front office or the coach...its the nature of a rebuild.

I do think it is clear that from day 1, Paxson was skeptical of Hoiberg and the wording of the release made it very clear this was a Paxson move.  

Yeah, I feel like had Hoiberg been hired under more favorable circumstances he'd have been more of a Scott Brooks type. The front office gave him some bizarre rosters his first couple of years here and he never really got off the ground as a professional coach.

On ‎12‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 10:16 AM, Kyyle23 said:

 

Yeah Rose here is trying to hand-wave over his role in how that relationship went south.

1 hour ago, Quinarvy said:

Fan base: Fire Hoiberg!

Fan base after Hoiberg is fired: This is bullshit!

 

I am fine with it.  Realistically the timing is odd, and I would much rather see the front office fired.

Fred was tuned out, and should not still be the coach, but he was set up to fail by 2 clowns who will continue to drive the Bulls towards Sacramento Kings status. 

If you hire a guy and want to play the system he likes,give him players who fit that system.  WTF difference is Boylan going to make? It is time the Reinsdorfs recognize where the problem lies.  GarPax has to go. The longer they hold off the more irrelevant the Bulls will become.

 

They thought it was a playoff team. Make them own it. Make Pax the coach and Gar his assistant. Then fire them when the sucking continues. 

Edited December 3, 20187 yr by Dick Allen

smh lol

 

10 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

Fred was tuned out, and should not still be the coach, but he was set up to fail by 2 clowns who will continue to drive the Bulls towards Sacramento Kings status. 

If you hire a guy and want to play the system he likes,give him players who fit that system.  WTF difference is Boylan going to make? It is time the Reinsdorfs recognize where the problem lies.  GarPax has to go. The longer they hold off the more irrelevant the Bulls will become.

 

They thought it was a playoff team. Make them own it. Make Pax the coach and Gar his assistant. Then fire them when the sucking continues. 

I would agree that tarring and feathering those 2 remains appropriate, but I also hate the concept of a person from the front office coming down to coach.

And just so it's done:

Jim Boylen: Current Bulls interim coach.

Jim Boylan: previous Bulls interim coach (after Skiles was fired). 

5 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

And just so it's done:

Jim Boylen: Current Bulls interim coach.

Jim Boylan: previous Bulls interim coach (after Skiles was fired). 

Shit I thought they were the same guy. Didn't know the difference in spelling. 

Just now, Jack Parkman said:

Shit I thought they were the same guy. Didn't know the difference in spelling. 

You're welcome

26 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

smh lol

 

I don't see why that's so bad. Would people rather have him be fired via text or phone call?

7 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

I don't see why that's so bad. Would people rather have him be fired via text or phone call?

They could have brought him in before practice.

2 minutes ago, BigHurt3515 said:

They could have brought him in before practice.

exactly.  Or yesterday on a team day off

11 minutes ago, BigHurt3515 said:

They could have brought him in before practice.

It sounds like that's exactly what happened

Also if Boylen 2.0 doesn't stick...Becky Hammon?

45 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

It sounds like that's exactly what happened

It sounded like he came in for practice then pulled him in to let him know