In my opinion it's the owners. 100% their fault. In March both sides agreed on what they would do and with it the players agreed to take a pay cut. Now the owners want them to take a larger one because they may lose more money......And now the players made an excellent suggestion of an 114 game regular season. That would make the season somewhat real. But no. The owners want a 50 game regular season. That would be a pathetic joke. The owners are wrong and at fault. 100%. 

I agree that the owners should be the target, those greedy sons of b****es.

But the players are not angels here either.

A lot of this is all a fight prior to the 2021 CBA. It's all positioning. And that's pretty pathetic on both sides.

 

8 minutes ago, iWiN4PreP said:

I agree that the owners should be the target, those greedy sons of b****es.

But the players are not angels here either.

A lot of this is all a fight prior to the 2021 CBA. It's all positioning. And that's pretty pathetic on both sides.

 

The last line is a really good thought.  Surrendering on pay now opens the door to salary caps and floors down the road.  That might be a part of the reason they push into 100% or nothing territory.

Owners. Play ball. Show some leadership. Take a hit for one season. If it's like this next season, then be hardline.

On 6/12/2020 at 12:37 PM, southsider2k5 said:

The last line is a really good thought.  Surrendering on pay now opens the door to salary caps and floors down the road.  That might be a part of the reason they push into 100% or nothing territory.

I'm sure it is.  Either side wants to set a precedent for the CBA negotiations. 

Owners agreed to pay in March.  To renege is disgraceful.  Pay the players what you agreed already.  

Situations change. They couldn't start in March, so a new decision had to be made. 

It's billionaires fighting with millionaires over the money they receive from fans who can barely afford going to a game. And the thousandaires will pick sides? They both are to blame. Remember whose money it begins with that they are fighting over. Both sides are screwing over the fans. 

Owners. They signed a contract with the players and are now renegging on it after the players already agreed to concession. They want to spread their losses with the players but wont spread their gains. They come out with these completely unbelievable/incomplete financial figures to try and garner public support and shift blame onto the players.

You are.

( not really - it’s a joke. )

In a sense, it doesn't matter. When baseball resumed in 1995, fans were pissed. Did it matter who they were pissed at? The result was many didn't want to return to the ballpark. The White Sox, along with the Expos, were hurt the most.

Both sides need to think about this. If this dispute goes on for a long time, MLB will take a big hit, and it won't matter who is more in the right. It takes two sides to make a strike. It takes two sides to made an agreement. TIme to get serious about this.

The owners.  It's clear that the owners think they are above downside risk.  That's horse shit.

Actually, its manfrauds fault. God i hate that utter buffoon 

Ray Finkle

2 minutes ago, hi8is said:

Ray Finkle

Football players dont count.

5 minutes ago, ptatc said:

Football players dont count.

She’s retired.

On 6/14/2020 at 11:53 AM, Texsox said:

Situations change. They couldn't start in March, so a new decision had to be made. 

It's billionaires fighting with millionaires over the money they receive from fans who can barely afford going to a game. And the thousandaires will pick sides? They both are to blame. Remember whose money it begins with that they are fighting over. Both sides are screwing over the fans. 

Yep its both sides.

Just look at Blake Snell:

Quote

 

“Y’all gotta understand, man, for me to go, for me to take a pay cut is not happening, because the risk is through the roof,’’ said Snell, who was scheduled to make $7 million this season. “It’s a shorter season, less pay. I gotta get my money. I’m not playing unless I get mine, OK? And that’s just the way it is for me.

”Like, I’m sorry you guys think differently, but the risk is way the hell higher and the amount of money I’m making is way lower. Why would I think about doing that? Like, you know, I’m just, I’m sorry

 

 

There are people making less than $15 an hour stocking groceries and risking being exposed, but a guy making more than a million is just going to sit because the risk is way higher.

/shrug

 

The uniqueness of this argument is that all of us know what the players make. None of us know what the owners make. 

You've also got hundreds of players, on social media pleading their case to the public day in and day out. The owners constant secretive nature hurts them in the world of public opinion. Maybe they dont care about being perceived as the "bad guys"?

I suspect neither side is negotiating in good faith.  And the entire Sport will suffer in the long run. 

I'm more curious on what this will mean for baseball in the long-term. Can a game that was already being perceived as slow and dying, with waning interest from the younger fanbase, really afford to not play for an entire season? 

They would basically be going 18 months between Post Season 2019 and Opening Day 2021!!! That’s insane.

4 hours ago, mbwhitesox said:

I'm more curious on what this will mean for baseball in the long-term. Can a game that was already being perceived as slow and dying, with waning interest from the younger fanbase, really afford to not play for an entire season? 

Steroids would have to save the game again.

100% owners and there's not really any argument against that IMO.  They own teams that print money - but are still technically a 'business' and sometimes businesses lose money.  Eat the lost, start the game back up, and get on with life.  

Instead they've been spoiled for decades with a 0 risk investment they feel entitled to never lose a dime.  Fuck em

I haven't seen anything from the players where they are willing to budge even one inch. Out in the real world where people need their paychecks to pay their rent or mortgage, people everywhere are getting laid off, getting furloghed, reduced hours, reduced pay, sometimes both, etc.

That said, I also understand the thought process that owners should largely eat this and let their be baseball. We don't know how much this hurts them since they won't open up their books.

In an ideal world, they meet in the middle somewhere. Probably with the owners giving up more than the players. But neither side is willing to move.

And now with COVID starting to spike in a lot of places. It makes me wonder if just shutting this down and saying let's come back in 2021 isn't the best answer? Uggh.

8 hours ago, jenksycat said:

100% owners and there's not really any argument against that IMO.  They own teams that print money - but are still technically a 'business' and sometimes businesses lose money.  Eat the lost, start the game back up, and get on with life.  

Instead they've been spoiled for decades with a 0 risk investment they feel entitled to never lose a dime.  Fuck em

Read the Passan article on ESPN. The only team the have financials on is the Braves as the are owned by a publically traded company. They had a net loss of 32 million last year.

In 2018, the Braves reported an operating profit before depreciation and amortization of $94M. Last year, it was $54M--though after depreciation and amortization, plus stock compensation, the team showed a paper loss of $32M. 

11 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

In 2018, the Braves reported an operating profit before depreciation and amortization of $94M. Last year, it was $54M--though after depreciation and amortization, plus stock compensation, the team showed a paper loss of $32M. 

Yes. After normal business operations it is a loss. As was said previously it would do no good to open books because those with a bias against the owners wont believe it anyway.

Even if you do take the wrong way to look at and say they made 54 million last year, they owners made about 40% of what the players did. I would hardly call that the owners being greedy.