caulfield12 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 33 minutes ago, Timmy U said: Nope. Just went through a Top 30 prospect list from back then and the only starters listed other than Kopech, Cease et al are Alec Hansen and Konnor Pilkington. I'll admit there was 1 year of Hansen hype, but Pilkington didn't rise to the level of even a Gowens, let alone Iriarte, Nastrini, Bush, Batista, etc etc etc. Sox development may still suck, but they've got more depth than they did back then. Cease's prospect profile was still quite strong...it just wasn't up there with Jimenez, quite. He (Dylan) already had the reputation for great stuff but not going deep (enough) in games. Giolito at different points was perceived to be the best RH pitching prospect in baseball...just like Kopech, but the bloom was off the roster for both Lucas and Reynaldo after their initial struggles in Washington at the major league level. Reynaldo ALWAYS HAD THE RAW STUFF, but tons of concern about his durability/frame and secondary stuff developing enough for him to be a consistent starter. But all these guys were clear top 100 prospects, whereas the White Sox still basically have just their Top 2. A number of people are salivating at Grant Taylor's potential, but he might as well be Alec Hansen or Erik Johnson as far as penciling him into a future rotation at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 19 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: You can look at all of the lists you want in hindsight, but I am here to tell you plenty of people at the time thought we had surplus pitching. I would also bet money that five years from now we laugh at some of the names being included on these lists today Sure, but it's probably more indicative of the resources available now that nobody was speaking about Jordan Stephens, Spencer Adams or Jordan Guerrero the way we talk about Mason Adams, Tyler Schweitzer or even Yhoiker Fajardo today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 The fun thing when people list out the Gio-Kopech-Cease-ReyLo-Dunning group (note: only Gio's stock was down when they acquired him, everyone else was trending up) is that it doesn't even include Rodon, since he was just kinda there on the Sox staff. If you include Rodon, that's 4 guys who have been All-Stars / gotten Cy Young votes + Dunning/Kopech - just never at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy U Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 5 minutes ago, WestEddy said: Sure, but it's probably more indicative of the resources available now that nobody was speaking about Jordan Stephens, Spencer Adams or Jordan Guerrero the way we talk about Mason Adams, Tyler Schweitzer or even Yhoiker Fajardo today. Nice pull on the two Jordans! Sadly, Spencer Adams had hype when drafted, but never had plus stuff. The other two names from back then were Jimmy Lambert and future big leaguer (briefly) Bernardo Flores. A lot of those guys (esp. Stephen’s, Flores and Lambert) were seen as relievers. Low draft picks who struggled some in college that the Sox were trying to reclaim. I seem to remember Stephen’s was overused in college and never did much after being drafted. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 7 minutes ago, Timmy U said: Nice pull on the two Jordans! Sadly, Spencer Adams had hype when drafted, but never had plus stuff. The other two names from back then were Jimmy Lambert and future big leaguer (briefly) Bernardo Flores. A lot of those guys (esp. Stephen’s, Flores and Lambert) were seen as relievers. Low draft picks who struggled some in college that the Sox were trying to reclaim. I seem to remember Stephen’s was overused in college and never did much after being drafted. I looked on B-R to make sure I had the names right, but I remember the hub-bub at Jim Margalus' SouthSideSox when they didn't add Jordan Guerrero to the 40-man to "protect" him from the Rule 5 draft. Like, he was a soft-tossing lefty reliever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 Fulmer was another guy who was cracking top 100 lists early on. Honestly, it’s impossible for me to say that Schultz/Smith/Thorpe/Taylor/Iriarte/Cannon is a better group than Rodon/Giolito/Cease/Kopech/Lopez/Dunning/Fulmer were at the time. However, I think the next few tiers of pitchers in the system today blows the old rebuild group out of the water. The pitching depth is the best I can remember since the 2000 system under Kenny as Farm Director. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 19 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Fulmer was another guy who was cracking top 100 lists early on. Honestly, it’s impossible for me to say that Schultz/Smith/Thorpe/Taylor/Iriarte/Cannon is a better group than Rodon/Giolito/Cease/Kopech/Lopez/Dunning/Fulmer were at the time. However, I think the next few tiers of pitchers in the system today blows the old rebuild group out of the water. The pitching depth is the best I can remember since the 2000 system under Kenny as Farm Director. https://www.thebaseballcube.com/content/prospects_team_year/2000~7~BA/ Kip Wells, Jon Garland, Aaron Myette, Jason Stumm, Matt Ginter, Danny Wright, Lorenzo Barcelo, Mark Buehrle Also Jon Rauch...Baldwin, Jim Parque, Rocky Biddle, Kevin Beirne, Jon Snyder (LHP), Brian West Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sambuca Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 12 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Fulmer was another guy who was cracking top 100 lists early on. Honestly, it’s impossible for me to say that Schultz/Smith/Thorpe/Taylor/Iriarte/Cannon is a better group than Rodon/Giolito/Cease/Kopech/Lopez/Dunning/Fulmer were at the time. However, I think the next few tiers of pitchers in the system today blows the old rebuild group out of the water. The pitching depth is the best I can remember since the 2000 system under Kenny as Farm Director. Man... Mark Buehrle Kip Wells (my boy) Jon Garland Danny Wright Jon Rauch (ugh) Lorenzo Barcelo Aaron Myette Matt Ginter Brian West Rocky Biddle Jason Stumm Gary Majewski Some names I remember. I was 100% convinced Jon Rauch was going to rule the world. I had very high hopes for Danny Wright as well. Then both guys appeared to be damaged goods by the time they made to the majors. Kip was already a favorite of mine after his call-up in '99. Rocky Biddle had cool sideburns, and I remember Big Hurt being a big fan of his after his first few stats. Crazy our system was actually producing major league hitters around this time as well. Now we get Lenyn Sosa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sambuca Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 19 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: https://www.thebaseballcube.com/content/prospects_team_year/2000~7~BA/ Kip Wells, Jon Garland, Aaron Myette, Jason Stumm, Matt Ginter, Danny Wright, Lorenzo Barcelo, Mark Buehrle Also Jon Rauch...Baldwin, Jim Parque, Rocky Biddle, Kevin Beirne, Jon Snyder (LHP), Brian West Looks like you beat me to a trip down memory lane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 7 minutes ago, Sambuca said: Man... Mark Buehrle Kip Wells (my boy) Jon Garland Danny Wright Jon Rauch (ugh) Lorenzo Barcelo Aaron Myette Matt Ginter Brian West Rocky Biddle Jason Stumm Gary Majewski Some names I remember. I was 100% convinced Jon Rauch was going to rule the world. I had very high hopes for Danny Wright as well. Then both guys appeared to be damaged goods by the time they made to the majors. Kip was already a favorite of mine after his call-up in '99. Rocky Biddle had cool sideburns, and I remember Big Hurt being a big fan of his after his first few stats. Crazy our system was actually producing major league hitters around this time as well. Now we get Lenyn Sosa. Plus you had Rowand and Crede...those were the big two of that time. Forgot Majewski, he had quite a long big league career as a reliever, just like Biddle and Rauch. James Baldwin flamed out pretty quickly but there's always the first half of that memorable 2000 season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sambuca Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 23 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: Plus you had Rowand and Crede...those were the big two of that time. Forgot Majewski, he had quite a long big league career as a reliever, just like Biddle and Rauch. James Baldwin flamed out pretty quickly but there's always the first half of that memorable 2000 season. Keith Foulke was a complete stud in the bullpen. Modeled my pitching after him as a teenager, only pitching out of the stretch with mostly a fastball/changeup combo. Carlos Lee had just started a very productive major league career as well. Miguel Olivo and Jeremy Reed brought us Sweaty Freddy a few years later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 1 hour ago, Sambuca said: Keith Foulke was a complete stud in the bullpen. Modeled my pitching after him as a teenager, only pitching out of the stretch with mostly a fastball/changeup combo. Carlos Lee had just started a very productive major league career as well. Miguel Olivo and Jeremy Reed brought us Sweaty Freddy a few years later. Don't forget Michael Morse the one time 6'5-6'6" SS... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 7 hours ago, Sambuca said: Man... Mark Buehrle Kip Wells (my boy) Jon Garland Danny Wright Jon Rauch (ugh) Lorenzo Barcelo Aaron Myette Matt Ginter Brian West Rocky Biddle Jason Stumm Gary Majewski Some names I remember. I was 100% convinced Jon Rauch was going to rule the world. I had very high hopes for Danny Wright as well. Then both guys appeared to be damaged goods by the time they made to the majors. Kip was already a favorite of mine after his call-up in '99. Rocky Biddle had cool sideburns, and I remember Big Hurt being a big fan of his after his first few stats. Crazy our system was actually producing major league hitters around this time as well. Now we get Lenyn Sosa. There were others too. Kyle Kane (1st round flop), Josh Fogg (part of Todd Ritchie trade), Rob Purvis (1st round flop), Josh Stewart (made starts with the Sox), Matt Guerrier (part of Damaso Marte trade), Corwin Malone (eventual #3 prospect in the system), etc. So many of these games ended up flopping, but at the time it was the most insane amount of pitching depth in all of baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 So many lists. It like Caulfield died and went to heaven. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 24 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: So many lists. It like Caulfield died and went to heaven. This is his Super Bowl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 11 hours ago, WestEddy said: Sure, but it's probably more indicative of the resources available now that nobody was speaking about Jordan Stephens, Spencer Adams or Jordan Guerrero the way we talk about Mason Adams, Tyler Schweitzer or even Yhoiker Fajardo today. That's what I am saying though... HERE they were talking about them like that, as it was others who haven't been mentioned yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 Story today at CBS Sportsline says Crochet and the red Sox are talking extension. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 28 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said: Story today at CBS Sportsline says Crochet and the red Sox are talking extension. Sale...Gio...Crochet. All the Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sambuca Posted January 10 Share Posted January 10 On 1/8/2025 at 8:22 AM, southsider2k5 said: So many lists. It like Caulfield died and went to heaven. Sometimes you just gotta sit down with Caulfield and make some damn lists. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 https://www.mlb.com/news/garrett-crochet-introduced-to-fans-at-fenway-fest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 On 1/9/2025 at 12:30 PM, caulfield12 said: Sale...Gio...Crochet. All the Sox. Like I said, the White Sox are the trading post/whore house for the Red Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 The Chicago White Sox came to the winter meetings believing they would trade left-handed starter Garrett Crochet by the end of the week. Time is running out. The Sox have stuck by their high asking price ever since they put him on the market at the trade deadline. Said one high-ranking source of a team that was interested in Crochet, “We’re out. They wanted three of our top prospects. Three. We can’t do that.” Crochet has top of the rotation stuff. There is disagreement on his value because Crochet, 25, has just two years of control and threw a career high 146 innings after throwing an average of 36 innings over the previous six years, including college. He is something of a comp to Glasnow—a guy with ace stuff without the ace track record. The Los Angeles Dodgers gave Tampa Bay two major league ready prospects, Jonny DeLuca and Ryan Pepiot, to get Glasnow, who had one year of control before Los Angeles then signed him to an extension. sportsillustrated.com Well, it clearly wasn't BOS, because they maintained all three of their top prospects (Antony, Mayer, Campbell) in the Crochet trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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