BrandoFan Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Honestly guys, you raelly can't compare Harris' output in MLB to Robbies output, and say who is better. How much playing time has Willie had as a starting second baseman? About 1.5-2 months MAYBE? Of course the comparison has no grounds for basis IMO. But hopefully Willie will grow into a 2Ber who will stay around for a while. He has the speed, ability to bunt, and has shown at times to be able to put the ball in play. Robbie is, no doubt, one of the best second basemen in the history of the game. But Robbie is also not 25 years old anymore, and his skills are fading as an everyday player. He can still play the filed better than 70% of the stiffs in MLB, but I can't justify paying 3 or more million per year for 2 years to a guy who has diminished skills at the plate. 1. Robbie should be hitting LH exclusively. He can post a 730 OPS that way with his eyes closed. That's why he probably wasn't worth more than 3 Mill a year- because you are basically getting a 425 at-bat player.....if you're smart enough to NOT let him hurt you by not allowing him to start against lefties, that is. 2. It's true Robbie is no longer a GG'er, but he is still ABOVE average overall. Willie? As physically gifted and agile as he is, where is the GUARANTEE that he doesn't go on an error spree once things don't go his way and he is in a mental funk which every young player goes through? All young players, from A-Rod to Garciappara and Chavez STRUGGLED defensively in their first couple of years....What makes Willie so special? Wait until he has to take the daily beating and psychological grind of having to perform as a leadoff hitter on a playoff-caliber team......If they could be Thomas, they could boo him.......So I wouldn't give the dge defensively to Willie just yet. 3. It's true Willie is super-fast, but his Robbie instincts still make him a very good overall baserunner and what's good is Willie speed if his OBP is 250? 4. Bunting? I saw Willie blow TWO crucial bunts with trying run on base against either Padres or Red Sox......while Robbie is one of game's best bunters, period. Again, with Burhle signed and no longer a bargain, any hope that we had money to get Robbie back should be buried. Maybe it's for the best and Willie as a chance ot succeed, but let's not get ahead of ourselves and gloat about Cards making a stupid move just YET. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 As of this very moment, Robbie is twice the fielder Willie is. Robbie is twice the hitter Willie is. Robbie is twice the baserunner Harris is. Not to mention, Alomar has World Series rings, Gold Gloves, All-Star appearances, a few high finishes in the MVP balloting, and will be a first-ballot Hall Of Famer. I seriously doubt that Willie Harris will ever have ANY of that. I hope he does, but I wouldn't bet the ranch on it. The only thing Willie Harris is better at than Robbie Alomar is running speed. He could beat him in a foot race. There ya go!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 As of this very moment, Robbie is twice the fielder Willie is. Robbie is twice the hitter Willie is. Robbie is twice the baserunner Harris is. Not to mention, Alomar has World Series rings, Gold Gloves, All-Star appearances, a few high finishes in the MVP balloting, and will be a first-ballot Hall Of Famer. I seriously doubt that Willie Harris will ever have ANY of that. I hope he does, but I wouldn't bet the ranch on it. The only thing Willie Harris is better at than Robbie Alomar is running speed. He could beat him in a foot race. There ya go!! Willie beats Robbie where it matters most to JR and crew: Roberto Alomar 2B NYM Signed Nov 1998 - 5 years/$38M 1999: $6.5M (+$1.0M signing bonus) 2000: $7.0M 2001: $7.5M 2002: $8.0M 2003: $8.0M option exercised 2004: Free Agent Willie Harris 2B CWS 2003: $300K Need anything else be said? Besides, it isn't financially responsible to pay an aging Robbie not only 3+ mill, but have to for 2 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Capn, No arguments about the salaries. But Hex Rudler (nice original username, dork) tried to say that Harris was a better player than Robbie. No way in hell - even NOW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Where talkinmg better player not salary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 When it comes to Jerry Reinsdorf, the only talent he looks at is your ability to fit in his joke of a payroll. Thanks, Jerry. :fyou Happy Holidays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Where talkinmg better player not salary I'm speaking in terms of the better fit for THIS team, and its no question, Willie Harris. Is he ready to play everyday? Well, we'll find out in 2004. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 For the record, I like Willie Harris, and I actually think that under Ozzie's guidance, he can be a really good player. However, he has to listen and put in a lot of hard work. I just hope he's not one of those "AAAA" players - too good for AAA, but not good enough for the Majors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 I'm speaking in terms of the better fit for THIS team, and its no question, Willie Harris. Is he ready to play everyday? Well, we'll find out in 2004. I know what ya Mean. But still Robbie is a better player by a landslide. I wish Wilie Could play in the Majors like he did down here last year in Winter.. Ohh and I like Willie, But still he can't carry robbie's jock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Willie Harris vs. Roberto Alomar. Wow. An incredible discussion, but it does have its merits. Roberto Alomar rates right up there with Joe Morgan and Ryne Sandberg as the greatest 2nd baseman I have seen in my lifetime. No doubt about it. He may have been better than both. But, Robbie is a shell of his former self, or at least he has shown that the past two seasons. Willie Harries will never be a Robbie Alomar. However, today, right now, I'd rather have Willie Harris on my roster than Alomar. Robbie is going downhill and Willie does have an opportunity to improve. Yes, Alomar is still a better player, but that may change before the All-Star break. And to Hex Rudler: Dude, Rex is one of the most respected members of Soxtalk, and I'm sure that you will find that your bastardization of his good name will be found offensive to many of us that post in here. I politely suggest that you may want to consider something different. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwsox Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Sorry if my pseudonym offends you. If Jason or Rex wants me to change it, I will. It doesn't "offend." It is needlessly too cute and confusing. When I see such unoriginality in a name, or an attempt to play games with the other posters by being confusing about being a separate poster, then that suggest everythings that gets posted under that name should be discounted. I really think a name of your own would be best - it has been suggested enough and it has not been the practice here to comment on other poster's name so may I take back that it doesn't offend, because it seem to do so for enough people to have made a suggestion that I'd strongly consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 When I see such unoriginality in a name, or an attempt to play games with the other posters by being confusing about being a separate poster, then that suggest everythings that gets posted under that name should be discounted. What it suggest to me is that a pathetic (and probably malicious) troll has infiltrated the premises and should be terminated with extreme prejudice. Looking the other way and trying to bend backwards for assorted inconsiderate cocksuckers has been a HUGE, um, problem (you asked me not to dig up the past) at Soxtalk, and is the reason number ONE why it can't compete with WSI. Our best posters easily rival theirs. Our worst....well, you know. I admit I've been as guilty as anyone in over-praising the "freedom" aspect of this site in the past. At some point, diminishing returns is all one gets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 What it suggest to me is that a pathetic (and probably malicious) troll has infiltrated the premises and should be terminated with extreme prejudice. Looking the other way and trying to bend backwards for assorted inconsiderate cocksuckers has been a HUGE, um, problem (you asked me not to dig up the past) at Soxtalk, and is the reason number ONE why it can't compete with WSI. Our best posters easily rival theirs. Our worst....well, you know. I admit I've been as guilty as anyone in over-praising the "freedom" aspect of this site in the past. At some point, diminishing returns is all one gets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Looking the other way and trying to bend backwards for assorted inconsiderate cocksuckers has been a HUGE, um, problem (you asked me not to dig up the past) at Soxtalk, and is the reason number ONE why it can't compete with WSI. Our best posters easily rival theirs. Many of our best posters.. are also their best posters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Many of our best posters.. are also their best posters. I don't post there I do troll, I mean check it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winninguglyin83 Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Back to Robbie v. Willie. It's very simply a matter of value. Alomar is a player whose skills have eroded dramatically the last three years (do you think Mets' officials were making it up when they talked about how poorlly he played in New York?). His ego is going to make it tough for him to play for the contract he deserves which would be less than $2 million guaranteed and sprinkled with incentives. For the record, this is what Alomar did in September, when the division title was on the line BA = .228 OBP: .308 Runs = 11 Double = 3 Triples = 0 Home runs+ 1 RBI = 2 Strikeoiuts = 10 Walks: 8 Stolen bases 0 in 0 attempts. No stroke, no pop, no speed, no factor. Bottom line: the guy is running on fumes. It's time to find out if Willie Harris can play. Is he the next Robbie Alomar? Nope. There's nobody in baseball as good as Alomar in his prime. But those days are long gone and forgotten. Willie Harris can be better than Alomar in 2004 -- and that's all that matters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phiaps6 Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Josh Pr- you are a dumbass if you think alomar is going to be good this year. He can't run, can't hit, doesn't care about anything but himself. Willie has 10 times the upside than alomar does. I want to watch you eat that crow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Josh Pr- you are a dumbass if you think alomar is going to be good this year. He can't run, can't hit, doesn't care about anything but himself. Willie has 10 times the upside than alomar does. I want to watch you eat that crow Hey pot.. come on over and meet my friend.. the kettle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Josh Pr- you are a dumbass if you think alomar is going to be good this year. He can't run, can't hit, doesn't care about anything but himself. Willie has 10 times the upside than alomar does. I want to watch you eat that crow Duh Willie has 10x more upside. He is 25 years old. I am all for Willie having the job, but Robbie is still the better of the two until Willie shows us what he can do (and I don't mean in AAA). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Josh Pr- you are a dumbass if you think alomar is going to be good this year. He can't run, can't hit, doesn't care about anything but himself. Willie has 10 times the upside than alomar does. I want to watch you eat that crow Awww a post directed to me... I'm flattered.. Thanks Hex, I just noticed that you've changed your ignorant name but haven't changed your ignorant ways.. If you would read (Something I doubt you can do) I said Willie Ain't better than Robbie period. Maybe Willie will have better Numbers than Alomar from now on but at Willie's age Alomar was a star... I don't even know why i discuss this with you cause you probably not old Enough to remember Robbie with the Jays Come back when you watch some baseball, Thanks :fyou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Josh Pr- you are a dumbass if you think alomar is going to be good this year. He can't run, can't hit, doesn't care about anything but himself. Willie has 10 times the upside than alomar does. I want to watch you eat that crow I have 10 times the upside Alomar does. In fact, with me only being 16, I probably have more upside then that even. Doesn't mean I'll amount to anything in the major leagues, does it? :dips*** And just for the record, Alomar apparently can run, because he was one of the best baserunners on the team last year. He can hit, because we wouldn't have had a chance in hell in the second half if he couldn't hit, and he apparently cares about more then just himself, since he is more then willing to lay down sacrifices if needed. Dumbass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchetman Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 Arguing about Alomar and Harris is stupid. They both suck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KipWellsFan Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 Arguing about Alomar and Harris is stupid. They both suck. If that's what you think then you're wrong. Welcome to the Boards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 Arguing about Alomar and Harris is stupid. They both suck. Now that's a hell of an Arguement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 Wow. What insight. Now I know why you are called "poorme." Yes, poor you. And "poor us" if that's all you bring to the table. Suggestion - read Dr. Seuss books, talk to 20 kindergarten kids, and then buy some crayons and a small coloring book. Maybe after that mental stimulation, you can actually post something worthy of being pissed on by my cat. But anyways, Welcome!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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