TRADE THREAD II ~ July 2 - July 8

[JUGGERNAUT]

Thanks Jason.  Personally he is the type of guy I see KW going after.  Arizona is in the thick of things I suppose, 4.5 games out, but 3 games under .500 and further back in the wild card.

 

If Vazquez can demand a trade, AZ might be willing to part with him now.  Purely speculation on my part but the AZ scouts have been tailing the White Sox.  Jenks is up now and if he can perform, a bullpen guy may be a trade bullet.  AZ would love to get ahold of Brian Anderson too.  Lots of potential matches between the D-Backs and the White Sox.

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I do NOT want Vazquez. He has proven nothing in being able to win a big game against an AL opponent. I would rather have Lilly that pitched 7ip, surrendering just 1R in a 2003 playoff game against BOS. He won that game by a score of 3-1. That's a much better option than Vazquez. Much cheaper too. I just don't think Toronto will deal him as long as they are in the WC hunt (5 gb of Min).

[quickman]

What leads me to believe the Schmidt deal is not dead is that the parties protested too much when the story broke.  I think both sides are still in evaluation mode.  The Giants want to keep shopping for a better offer while the Sox still aren't sure Schmidt isn't damaged goods.

 

 

Vfan, I actually agree with you that the deal is not dead, I think its tabled. My speculation is /was that a deal was almost there until BMAC crapped on himself. If he would have had a half way decent outing I think it would be done. Right after Bmac stunk everyone came out and said there was no deal. I do think that things are still on the table unless each can find a better deal. Maybe they are taking the next week to figure that out.

 

As for Jim wanted Vasquez, KW always wanted him, but I don't think they would trade there number 2 pitcher if they think they are in it. Now a bullpen arm like Viscaino and maybe Willie harris for cintron maybe more like it!

[Guest JimH]

Vfan, I actually agree with you that the deal is not dead, I think its tabled. My speculation is /was that a deal was almost there until BMAC crapped on himself. If he would have had a half way decent outing I think it would be done. Right after Bmac stunk everyone came out and said there was no deal. I do think that things are still on the table unless each can find a better deal. Maybe they are taking the next week to figure that out.

 

As for Jim wanted Vasquez, KW always wanted him, but I don't think they would trade there number 2 pitcher if they think they are in it. Now a bullpen arm like Viscaino and maybe Willie harris for cintron maybe more like it!

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I don't think they'll trade bullpen depth for a position player, although I would do a Viz and Harris for Cintron swap right now. But I think KW's primary and perhaps only focus is pitching. Pitching pitching pitching. A starter.

[Dick Allen]

I don't think they'll trade bullpen depth for a position player, although I would do a Viz and Harris for Cintron swap right now.  But I think KW's primary and perhaps only focus is pitching.  Pitching pitching pitching.  A starter.

If KW can't land a Schmidt,Clemens, or Burnett type, I would look for him to add a starter and reliever. Billy Wagner may be available. Kip Wells could probably be had a reasonable price.

[quickman]

If KW can't land a Schmidt,Clemens, or Burnett type, I would look for him to add a starter and reliever. Billy Wagner may be available. Kip Wells could probably be had a reasonable price.

 

 

Well, Dick I would welcome Billy wagner and keep the starters we have. It really moves everyone up a notch. It would be a 5 or 6 inning game and really a shutdown bullpen. We would really be untouchable, although I do not think Wagner will be coming here.

 

In talking with Jim today, I just feel our roster moves lately are strange. basically unless there is a trade soon, Jenks is here for 7 days, and its not really a full seven day schedule. Then you have gload tearing the cover off the ball, and not being activated, Konerko to me needs time off or else he will take a 230 batting average to the allstar game but Gload still is not activated even thoughTimo is rarely used. Its just a strange and tells me something has to happen soon. I hope jenks succeeds because then we could trade viscaino.

[beck72]

Thanks Jason.  Personally he is the type of guy I see KW going after.  Arizona is in the thick of things I suppose, 4.5 games out, but 3 games under .500 and further back in the wild card.

 

If Vazquez can demand a trade, AZ might be willing to part with him now.  Purely speculation on my part but the AZ scouts have been tailing the White Sox.  Jenks is up now and if he can perform, a bullpen guy may be a trade bullet.  AZ would love to get ahold of Brian Anderson too.  Lots of potential matches between the D-Backs and the White Sox.

you read my mind. For Vazquez, a current bullpen guy [like Vizcaino] Bmac and Anderson would seem the kind of price AZ would want. That way at least 2 of the guys, maybe all 3 could help them this yr

[Dick Allen]

Well, Dick I would welcome Billy wagner and keep the starters we have. It really moves everyone up a notch. It would be a 5 or 6 inning game and really a shutdown bullpen. We would really be untouchable, although I do not think Wagner will be coming here.

 

In talking with Jim today, I just feel our roster moves lately are strange. basically unless there is a trade soon, Jenks is here for 7 days, and its not really a full seven day schedule. Then you have gload tearing the cover off the ball, and not being activated, Konerko to me needs time off or else he will take a 230 batting average to the allstar game but Gload still is not activated even thoughTimo is rarely used. Its just a strange and tells me something has to happen soon. I hope jenks succeeds because then we could trade viscaino.

I still think a starter is needed. There is no guarantee El Duque will be healthy the second half, and his reputation as a big game pitcher while well deserved is from several years and a shoulder surgery ago. Contreras is Contreras. Who knows what kind of performance he'll turn in on a given night. I could live with 1 question mark, not 2.

[Guest JimH]

you read my mind. For Vazquez, a current bullpen guy [like Vizcaino] Bmac and Anderson would seem the kind of price AZ would want. That way at least 2 of the guys, maybe all 3 could help them this yr

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It seems to fit. Not saying those three guys specifically for Vazquez but I don't think this is beyond the realm of possibility. The Sox have always wanted Vazquez, no doubt about that. I would not be surprised.

 

Unless Jenks falls flat on his face, my guess is this a guy Guillen and KW want on the team for more than just 7 days. He is a huge power arm, completely different than anyone else on the staff. But if he stays and Marte comes back, someone has to go besides Kevin Walker.

 

I think Vizcaino is coming around and is better than he's shown, but if he is a key bullet to get a starter, so be it.

 

Something is up.

[quickman]

I still think a starter is needed. There is no guarantee El Duque will be healthy the second half, and his reputation as a big game pitcher while well deserved is from several years and a shoulder surgery ago. Contreras is Contreras. Who knows what kind of performance he'll turn in on a given night. I could live with 1 question mark, not 2.

 

 

Dick, I won't disagree with you but I can live with wagner and what we have even if its bmac pitchign like s***, because our pen would be lights out. I fully expect KW to try for a starter.

[Guest JimH]

Dick, I won't disagree with you but I can live with wagner and what we have even if its bmac pitchign like s***, because our pen would be lights out. I fully expect KW to try for a starter.

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I think you have seen the last of Brandon McCarthy this year with two exceptions:

 

Dire emergency or a Sept. start after a clinch.

[quickman]

It seems to fit.  Not saying those three guys specifically for Vazquez but I don't think this is beyond the realm of possibility.  The Sox have always wanted Vazquez, no doubt about that.  I would not be surprised.

 

Unless Jenks falls flat on his face, my guess is this a guy Guillen and KW want on the team for more than just 7 days.  He is a huge power arm, completely different than anyone else on the staff.  But if he stays and Marte comes back, someone has to go besides Kevin Walker.

 

I think Vizcaino is coming around and is better than he's shown, but if he is a key bullet to get a starter, so be it.

 

Something is up.

 

 

Jim again, why would AZ give up there number 2 starter if they think they are in it? The dodgers are free falling and the Padres are catchable although I personally don't think anyone in that division will catch them.

[quickman]

I think you have seen the last of Brandon McCarthy this year with two exceptions:

 

Dire emergency or a Sept. start after a clinch.

 

 

Not disagreeing, never thought he was ready anyway.

[Guest JimH]

Jim again, why would AZ give up there number 2 starter if they think they are in it? The dodgers are free falling and the Padres are catchable although I personally don't think anyone in that division will catch them.

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Two reasons.

 

One, they may not feel they are in it "enough" to hold onto a guy who can demand a trade. Risk/reward. Remember Vazquez balked big time about going to AZ. It's not as if they are nip and tuck, 4 1/2 back and 6 1/2 back in the wild card.

 

Two, if Vazquez stays and does not demand a trade, he is making big coin. It's possible they might want to get cheaper pitching talent.

 

Vazquez gives them innings but he's not having a great year. They may be sour on him, who knows? Remember they did not have to call up Jenks, it could just as easily been Gload. It makes sense as you said to try Jenks out before parting with a bullpen guy. But I do not think they'll part with a bullpen guy to get a position player, I do believe if they must part with a bullpen guy, it will be for a significant upgrade. And I believe that significant upgrade to be a starter.

[Guest JimH]

I will also add, no one knows the White Sox talent like the D-Backs.

[quickman]

Two reasons.

 

One, they may not feel they are in it "enough" to hold onto a guy who can demand a trade.  Risk/reward.  Remember Vazquez balked big time about going to AZ.  It's not as if they are nip and tuck, 4 1/2 back and 6 1/2 back in the wild card.

 

Two, if Vazquez stays and does not demand a trade, he is making big coin.  It's possible they might want to get cheaper pitching talent.

 

Vazquez gives them innings but he's not having a great year.  They may be sour on him, who knows?  Remember they did not have to call up Jenks, it could just as easily been Gload.  It makes sense as you said to try Jenks out before parting with a bullpen guy.  But I do not think they'll part with a bullpen guy to get a position player, I do believe if they must part with a bullpen guy, it will be for a significant upgrade.  And I believe that significant upgrade to be a starter.

 

 

I am not against giving up bullpen help to get a starter and I hope your right about vasquez but being 4.5 out in that s***ty division is not much to overcome. i think it is telling that AZ had scouts at the game again, but they may have been scouting tampa not the whitesox.

[Milkman delivers]

You know what. I totally agree with you.

This is one of the reasons I can't get people slobbing all over "has been" Schmidt. He's worse with no hope of getting better and people are willing to give up top prospects for him because he was an ace 2 years ago.

No Moyer doesn't get me excited either. There is no way in heck that Schmidt is worth more then Moyer considering Moyer is the better pitcher and healthier at this point.

 

Honestly I wouldn't package more then Joe Borchard and a couple of low level prospects for either one of them but thats just me.

 

STFU, you don't know that and all you do is preach it like it's fact.

[Guest JimH]

i think it is telling that AZ had scouts at the game again, but they may have been scouting tampa not the whitesox.

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Entirely possible they were scouting Tampa, the only bullpen guy they have worth anything is Baez though and their GM said both he and Huff fit for 2006. AZ scouts were watching the Sox in Detroit too.

[quickman]

Entirely possible they were scouting Tampa, the only bullpen guy they have worth anything is Baez though and their GM said both he and Huff fit for 2006.  AZ scouts were watching the Sox in Detroit too.

 

 

Well they better come back tonight then because nobody that played yesterday is going anywhere.

[Guest JimH]

Well they better come back tonight then because nobody that played yesterday is going anywhere.

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What would Cliff Politte's reaction be if he got traded?

 

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[VAfan]

Lilly has good numbers against the Angels, Red Sox, NYY, Bal, & Cle.  He's suspect against Min & Oak but the past two yr's his 2nd half ERA has been mid-high 3's.  Like Radke he's a slow starter but really turns it on in the 2nd half.

 

If I had to choose between Lilly and Moyer, I'd pick Moyer at this point. He'd be cheaper to pick up (as you note, Toronto isn't in sell mode), and even though he's well off his 2001-03 levels, he's pitching better than Lilly.

 

But I'd rather the Sox add a starter they could have more confidence would win them a game in the ALDS and another in the ALCS.

[quickman]

What would Cliff Politte's reaction be if he got traded?

 

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Politte isn't going anywhere. Are you crazy.

[Guest JimH]

Politte isn't going anywhere. Are you crazy.

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I'll take Angry Politte for 200 Alex.

[Bubba Philips]

What would Cliff Politte's reaction be if he got traded?

 

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[/quote we can't win without politte

[quickman]

I'll take Angry Politte for 200 Alex.

 

 

what does quickman look like while making young women cry at baseball games.

[Guest JimH]

What would Cliff Politte's reaction be if he got traded?

 

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[/quote we can't win without politte

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Life is like a box of chocolates, Forrest. You never know what you're gonna get.