quickman Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 they are also talking about the flash gordon report out of Phili. Moral of the conversation seems to be KW going for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawnhillegas Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(redandwhite @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 10:27 AM) Thats why I think the Mets are in no position to not put him in the deal. The Mets have a chance at a World Series right now. They need pitching, the best pitchers available are on the White Sox. I feel like they are almost inclined to trade Milledge because they really have nothing else to offer. ok, heres how I see it. Last 4 good mets prospects 1. Wright 2. Kazmir 3. Reyes 4. Milledge Minaya gets s*** every 5th day for losing one of them...no way he parts with the other, especially with the success that Reyes and Wright are having. HE MADE THIS MISTAKE WITH KAZMIR!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(shawnhillegas @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 12:49 PM) ok, heres how I see it. Last 4 good mets prospects 1. Wright 2. Kazmir 3. Reyes 4. Milledge Minaya gets s*** every 5th day for losing one of them...no way he parts with the other, especially with the success that Reyes and Wright are having. HE MADE THIS MISTAKE WITH KAZMIR!!! It's a shame Dan Duquette traded Kazmir. Rendering your theory useless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawnhillegas Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 (edited) QUOTE(Kalapse @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 11:51 AM) It's a shame Dan Duquette traded Kazmir. Rendering your theory useless. No, it was Jim Duquette not Dan Duquette, and I think it was actually Steve Phillips who did the trade, you are in the wrong league. And the POINT IS, that you hear mets fans b****ing every day. Who the GM was is irrelevant. Edited July 14, 2006 by shawnhillegas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 I thought it was Steve Phillips who pulled the trigger on that deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LosMediasBlancas Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 Things are gonna be uncomfy at the annual Guillen/Garcia family picnic next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(shawnhillegas @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 12:54 PM) No, it was Jim Duquette, you are in the wrong league. And the POINT IS, that you hear mets fans b****ing every day. Who the GM was is irrelevant. Yeah, Jim/Dan same difference. Minaya is not catching s*** for the f***ups of the previous GM. QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 12:55 PM) I thought it was Steve Phillips who pulled the trigger on that deal. It was the awkward transition between Phillips and Minaya, when Jim Duquette ruled all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawnhillegas Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(Kalapse @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 11:57 AM) Yeah, Jim/Dan same difference. Minaya is not catching s*** for the f***ups of the previous GM. ok yes, but do you think he will trade milledge? i mean, kazmir has to come up in that conversation. i just dont see it happening (although I hope Im wrong) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 It was Duquette, not Phillips. Phillips was gone by then. Minyana does have a reputation of shredding farm systems though, as he did in Montreal before leaving there for NY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 score and Mike Murphy are talking about this now Just goes to show the media's ability to read other media reports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quickman Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(JimH @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 01:09 PM) Just goes to show the media's ability to read other media reports. so, whats the point? let them read. I like the talk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 (edited) so, whats the point? let them read. I like the talk. The point is simple, this stuff has spread like wildfire off of a NY Daily News report/story. Everyone is itchy for a trade, we are doomed if we don't make a big trade, etc. It is humorous to me, sometimes the best deals are the ones you don't make. Oh and PS, Mike Murphy isn't telling anyone anything they don't know, especially if they were paying attention. KW is going for it ... wow ... what a revelation Murph, what's new with the Cubbies? Edited July 14, 2006 by JimH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(JimH @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 11:16 AM) The point is simple, this stuff has spread like wildfire off of a NY Daily News report/story. Everyone is itchy for a trade, we are doomed if we don't make a big trade, etc. It is humorous to me, sometimes the best deals are the ones you don't make. And man, we have almost as long of a list of those as we have of deals we did make. Konerko/Garland for Johnson Garland for Erstad BMac for just about anyone in baseball last year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 And man, we have almost as long of a list of those as we have of deals we did make. Konerko/Garland for Johnson Garland for Erstad BMac for just about anyone in baseball last year Joe Randa, Tejada, Ryan Church, Jason Schmidt, Mike Myers, etc. I like the trade talk too, it's interesting to me, but the other side of the equation is KW and Guillen are known to have faith in their players. Garland and Crede being two good examples. Now things in baseball change and they change quickly. So their approaches may need to change. I can see them stretching McCarthy out and adding bullpen help for prospects. Why? They like their pitching depth (starters). They love that safety net, KW talked about it all last winter. Personally I don't believe they're thinking much past this year. Win now. There is nothing that says they can't have one of these other starters come up with sciatica or whatever Contreras had, they all have bumps and bruises. Give them a breather so to speak. If they are indeed gassed, it will help. Just another way of looking at what they might be trying to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 I'm going to defend Garcia for a second. First off, for as much as we like to bash Garcia, he is 10-5 with a 4.91 ERA. I'm not saying that's great or anything, but I'm sure there are still GMs out there that see the ten wins and have their eyes bulge up. Second, even with his junkballing, mysteriously losing 3 MPH off his fastball ways, Garcia is a #2-3 on most NL teams. There are a couple of exceptions (like Houston and maybe Florida), but for most NL teams, he's in the top part of the rotation. Third -- if he did go to the Mets -- he'd be leaving one of the best hitters parks in the AL and going to the one of the best pitcher's parks in the NL. Everybody here, everybody in baseball, everybody in the world knows how big the talent disparity is between the AL and the NL this year; you could probably shave at least a run off of Garcia's ERA if he were pitching in the NL this year. That said, I can see Omar getting a little ancy and realizing that, if the playoffs started today, Steve Trachsel (blah) would be his game three starter. I'd make a Heilman + Milledge move... This is also a little different than the Zito situation because Garcia is locked up for next year (and if the Sox eat, say, $2 million of Garcia's contract next year -- $8 million for Garcia in the NL would be a steal). As for a couple of other things... Garland, obviously not going anywhere, he's got that no-trade clause. Plus, he's been our second best starter the past month. Ditto Vazquez, he's staying, like it or not. It's not a Garcia situation where he's clearly lost stuff; he still has good movement on all his pitches. His peripherals (K/9, K/BB, HR/9) are all good. I think he's in for a better second half. Kenny, Ozzie, and Coop aren't going to give up on him after three months after wanting the guy for the past three years (not to mention trading Chris Young for him). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(shawnhillegas @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 12:54 PM) No, it was Jim Duquette not Dan Duquette, and I think it was actually Steve Phillips who did the trade, you are in the wrong league. And the POINT IS, that you hear mets fans b****ing every day. Who the GM was is irrelevant. I go to school with a bunch of Mets fans, I asked them what they thought of that trade, and they said they didn't like it at the time, but if the Mets won the series this year, they couldn't give two s***s about Kazmir in Tampa. That's what the mindset of Mets fans are now, and that's hopefully is Minaya's mindset. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan1 Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 I missed it and I don't feel like reading 12 pages of this thread... What is the actual rumor? Who would be involved? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 12:48 PM) I missed it and I don't feel like reading 12 pages of this thread... What is the actual rumor? Who would be involved? Vazquez or Garcia for fill in the blank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(CWSOX45 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 02:42 PM) I go to school with a bunch of Mets fans, I asked them what they thought of that trade, and they said they didn't like it at the time, but if the Mets won the series this year, they couldn't give two s***s about Kazmir in Tampa. That's what the mindset of Mets fans are now, and that's hopefully is Minaya's mindset. Ha, funny thing is that they actually would have a better chance to win the WS this year if they had Kazmir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggliopipe Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 I don't get the people saying 'but what if there's an injury? what then?'.... Come on, the plan all along for 2007 (as stated by KW) is that BMac WILL be in the rotation. That means whether it happens now or in the offseason, one of the other 5 will be gone and we're going to lose our 6th starter insurance. It's incomparable what you could get for Garcia now versus what you could get for him in the offseason, so you deal him now. Now. No, now. And f*** Lastings. Whoever said NYY, NYM, BOS prospects have a history of being overrated is spot on. Of course there are recent exceptions with the Mets, but they've had too many prospects pan out in a row. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(maggliopipe @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 03:08 PM) I don't get the people saying 'but what if there's an injury? what then?'.... Come on, the plan all along for 2007 (as stated by KW) is that BMac WILL be in the rotation. That means whether it happens now or in the offseason, one of the other 5 will be gone and we're going to lose our 6th starter insurance. It's incomparable what you could get for Garcia now versus what you could get for him in the offseason, so you deal him now. Now. No, now. And f*** Lastings. Whoever said NYY, NYM, BOS prospects have a history of being overrated is spot on. Of course there are recent exceptions with the Mets, but they've had too many prospects pan out in a row. The funny thing is is that Wright wasn't even that huge of a prospect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie hayes Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 03:08 PM) That said, I can see Omar getting a little ancy and realizing that, if the playoffs started today, Steve Trachsel (blah) would be his game three starter. I'd make a Heilman + Milledge move... This is also a little different than the Zito situation because Garcia is locked up for next year (and if the Sox eat, say, $2 million of Garcia's contract next year -- $8 million for Garcia in the NL would be a steal). I don't know if Trachsel is the big concern. Bannister's coming back, and they still have Heilman, Maine, and Pelfrey ready. I'd expect one of those 4 to step up (and over Trachsel) by playoff time. But Pedro's been hurting and the Glavine of June and July is not the Glavine of April and May, but he is closer to the Glavine I expected. Anyway, I just see a different reason for needing a pitcher, but whatever, it's a technicality. The thing I really disagree with is the Garcia/Zito thing. Garcia has value, yes, but if you had the choice between Zito and Garcia, you'd pick Garcia just for the contract? When Garcia has been fading over the 2nd half the last couple years? When Garcia's fastball is toast -- slow, slow toast? They need a pitcher because they want a WS this year (as you yourself point out, with the Trachsel in the playoffs part, the first concern is the 2006 playoffs), but they'd go Garcia over Zito just for the reasonably priced mediocrity? I just can't believe that. If Zito's there for a deal centered around Milledge, I think they may pull the trigger eventually on that one. But this Garcia-for-Milledge (let alone Milledge and Heilman) sounds pie-in-the-sky to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 QUOTE(jackie hayes @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 01:19 PM) If Zito's there for a deal centered around Milledge, I think they may pull the trigger eventually on that one. But this Garcia-for-Milledge (let alone Milledge and Heilman) sounds pie-in-the-sky to me. I would bet you that right now, if Zito for Milledge was available, the Mets would pull the trigger. I would also bet you that right now, that deal is no longer available, as the A's have dragged themselves back into first place, as they always do once it gets warm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbeFroman Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 (edited) QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jul 14, 2006 -> 03:21 PM) I would bet you that right now, if Zito for Milledge was available, the Mets would pull the trigger. I would also bet you that right now, that deal is no longer available, as the A's have dragged themselves back into first place, as they always do once it gets warm. They would only do it if Zito were tied up long-term (2-3 years). I don't think the mets would deal Milledge for a rental pitcher in Zito.... and since zito recently hired Mr. Scott "Test the Market" Boras, Zito is headed for free agency in the off-season. not to mention that the A's are still in it and won't be dealing Zito anyway. Personally, I think the mets are more likely to do the deal for Vazquez than Zito. And frankly its all irrelevant anyway cause I'm pretty sure they will keep Milledge no matter what... By the way, I wonder if Buster Olney knows how powerful he is: By merely mentioning a possible trade on tv today, he triggered a 175 post thread involving 44 separate posters in chicago... many of whom have been checking the tread all damn day... Edited July 14, 2006 by AbeFroman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2nd_city_saint787 Posted July 14, 2006 Share Posted July 14, 2006 if they didnt already have david wright would you have done Garcia/Fields for lastings and Hielman or sanchez and possibly some one else like a Jeff Keppinger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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