I can't take it anymore...

[greg775]

Exactly fathom.

I was thinking about this yesterday ... if we had the lead the Tigers had right now

would we think the division title was ours?

No way.

It's all up to the Sox. They have the team capable of building on the current

record and making the playoffs and making a splash.

But will the team do it?

If I had to bet I'd say no, but it's still out there for the sox if they get their heads

out of their collective ass and start pitching, playing defense and running the

bases with some brains.

[mr_genius]

Exactly fathom.

I was thinking about this yesterday ... if we had the lead the Tigers had right now

would we think the division title was ours?

No way.

It's all up to the Sox. They have the team capable of building on the current

record and making the playoffs and making a splash.

But will the team do it?

If I had to bet I'd say no, but it's still out there for the sox if they get their heads

out of their collective ass and start pitching, playing defense and running the

bases with some brains.

 

your post structure is very unusual

[Soxbadger]

Fathom,

 

I disagree.

 

Last years "team" had more luck. They were almost unbeatable in 1 run games.

 

But if you look at the players this year versus last year, this years team is better. Now there are many reasons why they have lost more games, a major one being they are the defending champs. Any team that wins, becomes a target and every team is getting ready to play them. As compared to last year where even in the playoffs many "experts" were calling it a fluke.

 

Not to mention the team last year really struggled at this point of the season, but then really came up big in the playoffs. If this team does the same thing, it will be hard to say that last years team was better.

[fathom]

Fathom,

 

I disagree.

 

Last years "team" had more luck. They were almost unbeatable in 1 run games.

 

But if you look at the players this year versus last year, this years team is better. Now there are many reasons why they have lost more games, a major one being they are the defending champs. Any team that wins, becomes a target and every team is getting ready to play them. As compared to last year where even in the playoffs many "experts" were calling it a fluke.

 

Not to mention the team last year really struggled at this point of the season, but then really came up big in the playoffs. If this team does the same thing, it will be hard to say that last years team was better.

 

Last year's team had great starting pitching, and they had 3 relievers that were basically unhittable. We RARELY win games this year where we don't score at least 4 runs. Last year, if we got a 2 run lead early in the game, you could send it to Cooperstown.

[Soxbadger]

You must have watched a different team last year then me, according to what I saw and the stats, the White Sox never have won many games when only scoring 2 runs.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/CHW/2005_sched.shtml

 

I counted fast but it only happened like 12-13 times, the other 70+ wins occurred when atleast 3 runs were scored.

 

Not really "sending it to cooperstown" when 2 runs are scored.

[fathom]

You must have watched a different team last year then me, according to what I saw and the stats, the White Sox never have won many games when only scoring 2 runs.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/CHW/2005_sched.shtml

 

I counted fast but it only happened like 12-13 times, the other 70+ wins occurred when atleast 3 runs were scored.

 

Not really "sending it to cooperstown" when 2 runs are scored.

 

I said a 2 run lead, and not 2 runs for the entire game. If you read my post, I said we rarely win this year if we don't score at least 4 runs.

[Soxbadger]

The same thing could be said for last years team, they only had 12-13 wins when scoring 2, and only 6-7 more when scoring 3, where as the majority are won when they scored 4+.

 

Meaning last year they won 20 games when they scored 3 runs or less, and approximately 79 games when they scored 4 runs or more.

 

Thus the team last year barely won when they scored less than 4 runs as well. Not many teams in the modern era are going to win games with regularity scoring less than 4 runs.

[whitesoxfan101]

To be honest, I think last year's team overacheived pitching, and this years has hitting. That is what is driving most fans *raises hand* so nuts, the fact that you don't have any consistency. If the pitching just pitched like people thinks it should (better), and the hitting did it's job like it should (worse), I think even though our record would be about the same, people would be a lot less crazy. It's just seeing the offense get so much better and the pitching get so much worse is confusing and drives most people insane.

[fathom]

The same thing could be said for last years team, they only had 12-13 wins when scoring 2, and only 6-7 more when scoring 3, where as the majority are won when they scored 4+.

 

Meaning last year they won 20 games when they scored 3 runs or less, and approximately 79 games when they scored 4 runs or more.

 

Thus the team last year barely won when they scored less than 4 runs as well. Not many teams in the modern era are going to win games with regularity scoring less than 4 runs.

 

As of a few weeks ago, we only had like 5 wins this year when scoring 4 runs or less (Dick Allen references this stat often). Going from 20 wins one year to about 10 wins this year is a pretty significant decrease.

Edited August 21, 2006 by fathom

[Jordan4life_2007]

If you cant take it anymore there are 20+ teams that need more fans.

 

Good luck.

 

Wow, now I see what guys like Fathom and Milk go through (although I'm not even in the same galaxy as them when it comes to being pessimistic). So I guess if you as a fan display anything short of blind homerism and complete butt-kissing you're not really a fan. I'm not whitesoxfan101. I don't create threads like these after every loss. This is the first one I've made all year long. I've sat back just like everybody and said to myself "It's all good. This team is too talented. We're gonna get going at some point." It's August 21 now. How much longer do we have to wait? How much longer are we gonna have to wait for atleast 3 of our starters to get goin' at the same time? I'm not even gonna get greedy. I've given up hope on the rotation as a whole getting hot. Just 3 guys would satisfy me. When is this team gonna play baseball like we all know they're capable? I think Kenny Williams said it best: at some point, you might have to accept the fact that you are what you are. After a certain point, it becomes a trend, not a fluke.

 

Now, of course, I'm not giving up on the season. That would be pretty stupid and foolish. And, yes, I still think we're capable of playing much better baseball. But time is running out. It's not May or June anymore. The Tigers are struggling, yet we haven't gained a single game on them since we swept them. The Twins are showing no signs of slowing down. The Yankees are looking stronger and stronger everyday. The A's are something like 25-11 since the break. What about us? What's to really like about this team at the moment? Other than the offense, of course.

Edited August 21, 2006 by Jordan4life_2006

[Soxbadger]

That stat is inaccurate, maybe you mean when scoring atleast 3 runs or less.

 

But the Sox have won around 17 games when scoring 4 runs or less.

[fathom]

That stat is inaccurate, maybe you mean when scoring atleast 3 runs or less.

 

But the Sox have won around 17 games when scoring 4 runs or less.

 

Maybe Dick Allen can clarify what the stat is that he always states.

[Soxbadger]

My comment was posted in general to anyone that posted in this thread and felt that they "no longer could take the pain of being a supporter of a team with the 3rd best AL record and in the lead for the WC."

 

If my comment does not apply to you, then you dont have to worry about it.

 

My problem is that people believe that last year was the norm, not an exception. Last years team happens to a city maybe once, a team that outside of a core of people no one thought would do anything, becomes the best team and basically dominates the playoffs.

 

That is not normal.

 

I just cant stand that people act like they are entitled to be given a winner.

 

I was a Sox fan when they were in 2nd, when they were under .500, no matter what.

 

Your a fan, not because the team owes you anything, but because you want to be.

[Milkman delivers]

My comment was posted in general to anyone that posted in this thread and felt that they "no longer could take the pain of being a supporter of a team with the 3rd best AL record and in the lead for the WC."

 

If my comment does not apply to you, then you dont have to worry about it.

 

My problem is that people believe that last year was the norm, not an exception. Last years team happens to a city maybe once, a team that outside of a core of people no one thought would do anything, becomes the best team and basically dominates the playoffs.

 

That is not normal.

 

I just cant stand that people act like they are entitled to be given a winner.

 

I was a Sox fan when they were in 2nd, when they were under .500, no matter what.

 

Your a fan, not because the team owes you anything, but because you want to be.

 

We pay for it. We should get it.

 

It's not like we walk away when they're not winners. We're just upset that we didn't get what we expected.

[fathom]

I just cant stand that people act like they are entitled to be given a winner.

 

We won the World Series last year, we raised our payroll to 100 million, and we've been healthier than any team this season. Did you really expect fans to not expect us to repeat this year? We live in a town where the Bulls would win the NBA championship at will basically. I'm one of the most pessimistic people on this site, but even I expected us to have better pitching this season. I feel like you're jumping the gun a little though, as I don't see anyone on this site jumping completely off the bandwagon. As you've said, we're still in the playoffs if the season ended today.

[Jordan4life_2007]

My comment was posted in general to anyone that posted in this thread and felt that they "no longer could take the pain of being a supporter of a team with the 3rd best AL record and in the lead for the WC."

 

If my comment does not apply to you, then you dont have to worry about it.

 

My problem is that people believe that last year was the norm, not an exception. Last years team happens to a city maybe once, a team that outside of a core of people no one thought would do anything, becomes the best team and basically dominates the playoffs.

 

That is not normal.

 

I just cant stand that people act like they are entitled to be given a winner.

 

I was a Sox fan when they were in 2nd, when they were under .500, no matter what.

 

Your a fan, not because the team owes you anything, but because you want to be.

 

I see what you're saying. I agree with most of it. I, for one, don't think I'm entitled to anything. I've been a Sox fan for 15 years. I've had my fair share of dissapointments with this team (save last year). However, as a fan, I won't accept anything less than a return to the playoffs. It would be a complete disaster if a team with this level of talent didn't atleast get to the playoffs. Does that mean I'm gonna jump on the Yankees bandwagon if they don't make it? I could've done that years ago if I was that kinda fan. I bleed White Sox. I'll support them 'til the day I'm 6-feet under.

[fathom]

It would be a complete disaster if a team with this level of talent didn't atleast get to the playoffs.

 

This is the most accurate comment of the day, and it might as well be JR and KW making this comment.

[Soxbadger]

Fathom,

 

I dont know, I never have seen Dick Allen post it and I am not in the business of piggybacking on other peoples arguments.

 

All I can tell you is that last years team had trouble winning when they scored less than 4 runs, and this years team has the same problem. You do not have good odds when scoring that little, even the best pitchers in the game have around 3 era, which means on an average day they give up 3 runs per game.

 

So at 3 runs the best teams should be around .500, as they move towards 4 runs their record should improve drastically.

 

Milkman,

 

You pay for X hours of entertainment.

 

You dont pay for a win.

 

If the White Sox dont make the playoffs this year it wont have anything to do with their record.

 

It will just be one of those years where 3 teams in one division would have been atleast 1st or 2nd in the other 2 divisions.

 

That happens in other sports as well, it sucks but thats the nature of the division system.

[Milkman delivers]

Fathom,

 

I dont know, I never have seen Dick Allen post it and I am not in the business of piggybacking on other peoples arguments.

 

All I can tell you is that last years team had trouble winning when they scored less than 4 runs, and this years team has the same problem. You do not have good odds when scoring that little, even the best pitchers in the game have around 3 era, which means on an average day they give up 3 runs per game.

 

So at 3 runs the best teams should be around .500, as they move towards 4 runs their record should improve drastically.

 

Milkman,

 

You pay for X hours of entertainment.

 

You dont pay for a win.

 

You might. When I go to a game, I go there expecting a win. I pay for X hours of entertainment when I go to Snakes on a Plane. I pay for wins when I go to baseball games.

[Soxbadger]

Then you need to find the Globetrotters of Baseball.

 

Because even the best team in any given season will only gaurantee you a 60% chance of seeing a win.

 

The best GM of the best team can only put the best players on the field, and hope for a win.

 

You never know what will happen, that is why they play the game, and that is why people attend.

 

Not because of the 100% gaurantee of what will happen, but because of the unknown.

[cgaudin]

You're right. I guess I do forget sometimes that the other contenders in the AL are far from perfect. Do I expect too much? Maybe. But why not? For years I've been content with the Sox just being competitive and having a chance to get to the playoffs. Is it wrong for me to want more now? I don't think so. Like I said earlier, it just bothers me that we've been so bad in so many different aspects this year. Thank god for the offense.

 

Funny how everyone last year said Thank God for the pitching, cause the offense sucked.

[Milkman delivers]

Im with Milkman here, and thats uncommon. I guess it's because im at the Cell all the time, but im paying to see a win. When the Sox are not playing good baseball, I dont want to go to the park. Its not "entertaining" to watch my team lose.

 

[LVSoxFan]

You might. When I go to a game, I go there expecting a win. I pay for X hours of entertainment when I go to Snakes on a Plane. I pay for wins when I go to baseball games.

 

Don't you mean about 20 minutes of entertainment when you pay to see SOAP? Meaning: after the premise, which is thin to begin with, has worn itself out?

 

 

Anyhoo, I agree with the argument that there is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't expect at least the playoffs this year based on the payroll and the acquisitions AND the management from last year being intact.

 

The one thing everybody, however, I think has lost sight of is the bizareness of this year: we are more than 20 games over .500 and yet firmly in second place. In any other year, people would be doing cartwheels over a team with that record--especially the Sox. Yet as this year turned out Detroit apparently is out of their heads and even that 20 games over for us isn't enough to win a division.

 

Sometimes I have to remind myself of that when we talk about what a "failure" this club has been thus far. In any other year we'd be giddy with playoff anticipation with this record but damn if that ain't just the rub this year.

 

But yes, we also expect a lot because of last year. Nothing wrong with that.

 

Hell, Boston fans must be out of their minds right now--being swept five games in a row by the Yanks? Ouch. And they are definitely no slouch of a team, talent or payroll-wise.

[Hangar18]

Fathom,

 

I dont know, I never have seen Dick Allen post it and I am not in the business of piggybacking on other peoples arguments.

 

All I can tell

 

If the White Sox dont make the playoffs this year it wont have anything to do with their record.

 

It will just be one of those years where 3 teams in one division would have been atleast 1st or 2nd in the other 2 divisions.

 

during the first weeks of the season, you could tell it was going to be a different year. Every team stepped up in the league. The SOX could ill afford to give as many games away as they did last year, and it has come back to HAUNT them now. Hope they learn the lesson.

[J-MAN]

My comment was posted in general to anyone that posted in this thread and felt that they "no longer could take the pain of being a supporter of a team with the 3rd best AL record and in the lead for the WC."

 

If my comment does not apply to you, then you dont have to worry about it.

 

My problem is that people believe that last year was the norm, not an exception. Last years team happens to a city maybe once, a team that outside of a core of people no one thought would do anything, becomes the best team and basically dominates the playoffs.

 

That is not normal.

 

I just cant stand that people act like they are entitled to be given a winner.

 

I was a Sox fan when they were in 2nd, when they were under .500, no matter what.

 

Your a fan, not because the team owes you anything, but because you want to be.

 

AMEN!!!!

 

My son taught me that lesson last year! When the lead dwindled he never wavered in his support of the Sox.

I will be a Sox fan forever - have followed the team from the 59 Hitless Wonders through the South Side Hit Men to this team and hope to support them for a long time to come through thick and thin.