GreatScott82 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/artic...sp&c_id=cws And that conundrum brings the White Sox back to the pursuit of a veteran outfielder. The free agent avenue appears to have been exhausted, with the pursuit of Coco Crisp or Willy Taveras via trade as possibilities. What would it take for the Rockies to trade their leadoff man? I know they want starting pitching... He would be a much better addition than Crisp... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 what has taveras done besides hit some triples against us to warrant us always trying to trade for this kid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 QUOTE(GreatScott82 @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 10:43 AM) http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/artic...sp&c_id=cws What would it take for the Rockies to trade their leadoff man? I know they want starting pitching... He would be a much better addition than Crisp... I'm not sure Taveras is a "much better addition than Crisp". Looking at his career numbers, minors and majors, through 2006, he looks no better than what Owens will give you offensively. 2007 was a big year for him though - was it a fluke, or is that the real deal? If he hits like he did in 2005-2006, or like most of his minor league numbers indicate, then offensively he's no better than Owens. Defensively, look at Taveras' 2007 CF stats compared to Owens (they played an almost identical number of games)... On FPct, Owens is .991 and Taveras .982... On range (RF), Taveras has an edge: 2.76 to 2.65... on ZR Owens is well ahead at .896 over .823. The arm thing though... Owens' 1 assist to Taveras' 7 seems to make Willy's arm a lot better. But I haven't seem Taveras play except a handful of times - anyone have any comments on his arm? It looks to me like Taveras is probably slightly better than Owens defensively, mostly due to his arm. Basically, its a question of career trend, just like with Crisp. With Taveras, is 2007 the real player he has matured into? Or is 2005-2006 what we'd get? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 75 wins here we come.....Not much is different than last year - we traded our #3 starter for a SS....the offense will be helped, the pitching staff won't be. Linebrink may help, but middle relievers have a funny way of being up and down, and he's changing leagues, so we shall find out on him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 What frightens me is the thought of getting Jay Payton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg The Bull Luzinski Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I don't understand the philosophy of trading our already anemic minor league system for essentially the same player we already have in CF except older and and more experienced. Not only does this seem like shuffling deck chairs in the Titanic, but it seems to be getting the same chair at a more expensive price. Adding somebody just for the illusion of progress/movement is just plain stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 12:12 PM) I don't understand the philosophy of trading our already anemic minor league system for essentially the same player we already have in CF except older and and more experienced. Not only does this seem like shuffling deck chairs in the Titanic, but it seems to be getting the same chair at a more expensive price. Adding somebody just for the illusion of progress/movement is just plain stupid. Crisp, I like, but Taveras benefited from Coors and is not much better than Owens... he'll hit for a higher average but at this point does the difference from Owens to Taveras make us better? That'd be a no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg The Bull Luzinski Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I have a suspicion that KW has another signing planned right around Soxfest to give some of the sheep a warm fuzzy feeling that we have a chance of finishing out of 4th place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 10:24 AM) I have a suspicion that KW has another signing planned right around Soxfest to give some of the sheep a warm fuzzy feeling that we have a chance of finishing out of 4th place. Who else is left? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg The Bull Luzinski Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 12:34 PM) Who else is left? The return of Pods? ... Where is that vomiting smiley when I need him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Pratt Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I hate Willy T. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatScott82 Posted January 2, 2008 Author Share Posted January 2, 2008 I think Boston is in a position where Crisp has to be moved to make room for Elsbury. By the looks of things, Santana will at least pitch the first half of the season with Minnesota. WIth that being said i think Crisp can be had for the right price. I see that most of you guys are not big Taveras fans but i think he's a good player and a better defensive CF than OWens. Owens on the other hand has the potential to have 50 SBs and a decent average if given the chance. As of right now i would like it if KW can bring in Crisp or Taveras for CF and have Owens as our security 4th OF. We just don't know what to expect out of Quentin, he is coming off an injury so its good to have depth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I don't see the difference in us winning or losing being whether we make a marginal upgrade in CF with Crisp or Tavares. It seems to me the most prudent course of action would be to wait and see how competitive we are, and if an upgrade such as Crisp or Tavares would be something that could get us over the hump, than make that move then. Making it now seems somewhat foolish to me unless the cost is almost nothing. And it won't be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 (edited) The idea is to improve yourself and not break even. What do we really gain from adding a Taveras or a Crisp? My guess is we end up dumping one of our good players the Sox won't try and sign and pick up someone elses castoff. Crisp loses his starting spot to a rookie and we seem to be falling all over ourselves to pick him up!? Taveras is not much better, but we need to make a splash and make it seem we are really doing something to improve on a 4th place finish. Edited January 2, 2008 by elrockinMT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 It's saying a lot when I say I'd just rather roll with Jerry Owens than get Willy Taveras... I hate Taveras. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 QUOTE(Steve9347 @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 01:54 PM) It's saying a lot when I say I'd just rather roll with Jerry Owens than get Willy Taveras... I hate Taveras. Actually, looking at his stats, at worst he'll put up Pods numbers but stay healthy and hit better vs. lefties, and he's just entering his prime. I am going to completely 100% change my stance and say I'd be very happy with Taveras on this roster... that's of course depending on the price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 (edited) I have liked Taveras since he came up w/ the Astro's and would not mind having him on our team one bit... pending on how much it would take to get him of course. I would be able to live with a Owens/Taveras combo in CF, with Taveras getting most of the PT. Actually, I wouldn't have a problem with either Crisp of Taveras, both are very similar except that Taveras is 2 years younger and faster, but Crisp is the better hitter and a switch hitter. Edited January 2, 2008 by BearSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 10:59 AM) I'm not sure Taveras is a "much better addition than Crisp". Looking at his career numbers, minors and majors, through 2006, he looks no better than what Owens will give you offensively. 2007 was a big year for him though - was it a fluke, or is that the real deal? If he hits like he did in 2005-2006, or like most of his minor league numbers indicate, then offensively he's no better than Owens. Defensively, look at Taveras' 2007 CF stats compared to Owens (they played an almost identical number of games)... On FPct, Owens is .991 and Taveras .982... On range (RF), Taveras has an edge: 2.76 to 2.65... on ZR Owens is well ahead at .896 over .823. The arm thing though... Owens' 1 assist to Taveras' 7 seems to make Willy's arm a lot better. But I haven't seem Taveras play except a handful of times - anyone have any comments on his arm? It looks to me like Taveras is probably slightly better than Owens defensively, mostly due to his arm. Basically, its a question of career trend, just like with Crisp. With Taveras, is 2007 the real player he has matured into? Or is 2005-2006 what we'd get? Willy T has a real good arm from what I remember. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 They are just throwing speedy cf names out there at this point, because they know that's what ozzie likes, there is no validity to this rumor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 QUOTE(RockRaines @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 03:10 PM) They are just throwing speedy cf names out there at this point, because they know that's what ozzie likes, there is no validity to this rumor. They also bring it up probably because KW was close to picking up him last offseason. By and large, I don't understand why Colorado would just up and move him, but if they did, it would be OK so long as it doesn't come at a high price; never buy high on a player from Colorado. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I see that Kenny Lofton is still out there too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 12:34 PM) Who else is left? Well, there's Patterson and Lofton available. I think Fogg, Garcia, and Colon are still out there, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilJester99 Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 I wonder if the Giants would be interested in trading Randy Winn....or maybe look into Preston Wilson. IIRC he had season ending knee surgery though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 QUOTE(The Beast @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 06:01 PM) Well, there's Patterson and Lofton available. I think Fogg, Garcia, and Colon are still out there, too. I'd like Patterson for a 1 year deal, but I doubt Boras would go for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klaus kinski Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 QUOTE(iamshack @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 11:45 AM) What frightens me is the thought of getting Jay Payton. When the big fish get away, you are left with minnows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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