SoxAce Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 18, 2009 -> 05:00 PM) Here's my problem with his K's...I can't figure out how it'd be mathematically possible for him to continue hitting at a solid average while striking out 150+ times. In the minors, when he was on fire, and now in the AFL, he's been putting up BABIP values of >.400. Now, I know all the other caveats that go into that about how hard you're hitting the ball, how much bat control you have, etc., but bear with me here. Even the great players can't sustain those type of numbers once they get to the big leagues. Mauer pushed .373 this year with that stat, and his career mark is around .350. If you look at the guys in MLB who struck out 150 times+ last year, which is the pace D2 makes in the minors, you have 2 types of guys. You have Ryan Howard, Adam Dunn, Mark Reynolds...guys who don't give you a great batting average but you don't care because they're hitting 40 home runs. The other guys with 150 k's however, are guys like BJ Upton, Brandon Inge, Mike Cameron. These are guys who are playing because they give some performance with the bat, but they're out there either in the hopes that they'll develop (Upton) or because they have very good gloves. They wind up hitting below .250. Because they're not hitting the ball out of the ballpark, they're not putting the ball in play enough to put up a solid batting average with that number of strikeouts. If Danks stays on the 150k/year pace and is a 15-20 HR guy at best, then he's going to wind up hitting somewhere in the neighborhood of .250/.260 for his career. Against major league pitching, you just can't sustain that number of strikeouts and a really good batting average unless a lot of your hits are leaving the park. Good post and for the most part I agree. It will probably come down to pure potential with Jordan. Scouts have long said this guy has 30+ power potential but so far hasn't fulfilled it. Now I'm sure hitting in the cell will greatly help him (or even the bandbox in AAA like it did Chris Getz) and we all know that he is a very good defensive OF already. We can only hope that he can be a Granderson/Sizemore lite type player that will K 150 times, but still average a good walk rate and good power potential. Who knows though.. he could be traded before ST hits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/artic...sp&c_id=cws Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 http://www.mlb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?si...scowin_perwin_1 Danks single. Morel 2-RBI double. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Morel is looking like he likes the competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Brandon Allen has had an awful AFL. Batting .164. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 QUOTE (flavum @ Nov 19, 2009 -> 12:15 PM) Brandon Allen has had an awful AFL. Batting .164. KW knew. That's why he traded him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox_Sonix Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Jordan Danks hit a 3-run HR; Morel also 2-2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Danks now 2-2 with 3 RBI, and a walk Morel is 3-3 with a 2B, 3 RBI And its only the 4th inning..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Morel now hitting .443 in the AFL, with an OPS north of 1.000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 C.J. Retherford is 4 for his last 36. (for anyone who sucks in math, that pencils out to a .111 average) OT: But Jose Tabata.. I love that kid. Very good discipline hitter (comming out of the Yankees org) for his age and a good lookin spect. Nice future over there for the Bucos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 QUOTE (SoxAce @ Nov 19, 2009 -> 04:21 PM) C.J. Retherford is 4 for his last 36. (for anyone who sucks in math, that pencils out to a .111 average) OT: But Jose Tabata.. I love that kid. Very good discipline hitter (comming out of the Yankees org) for his age and a good lookin spect. Nice future over there for the Bucos. So does he play for the Yankees or Pirate org? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Nov 19, 2009 -> 04:23 PM) So does he play for the Yankees or Pirate org? He plays for the Bucos after being traded from the Yankees in the Karstens deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted November 20, 2009 Author Share Posted November 20, 2009 (edited) Jordan Danks finished the AFL season leading the league with 31 runs scored and was in the top 10 in hits, doubles, RBIs, total bases and walks. He struck out 26 times (9th in the league), but walked 20 times (2nd in the league). Over 26 games (99 at-bats), he batted .343 with a .458 OBP and a .963 OPS. Edited November 20, 2009 by scenario Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 That's just an incredible line by Danksy. Certainly proving he's a bit more refined then the majority of us thought he was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerksticks Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Well let's bump him up to AAA to start the year. Tell me, do I understand this correctly? Will he find more polished curveballs coming his way there? As I understand it, the better raw stuff is in AA, but more pitchers in AAA have been up to the show. So would we get a better idea of his strikeout/discipline projections if he were exposed to more polished repertoires? I guess that's my question; are pitchers in AAA tougher pitchers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 This is the lines for the rest of the White Sox prospects: Brent Morel: .435/.456/.565/1.020 with 4 BBs / 7 Ks in 62 ABs (4 XBHs: 2 2B, 2 HR) C.J. Retherford: .246/.333/.348/.681 with 7 BBs and 9 Ks in 69 ABs (4 XBHs: 2 3B, 1 HR) Dayan Viciedo: .333/.350/.556/.906 with 1 BB and 6 Ks in 18 ABs (2 XBHs: 1 2B, 1 HR) With a phenomenal closing rush, White Sox prospect Brent Morel ran away with the Arizona Fall League batting championship. The third baseman went 19-for-33 over his final eight games to close at .435 and beat Yankees farmhand Colin Curtis by 38 points. Morel did not join the league until Oct. 26 and did not accumulate enough plate appearances to qualify for the title until the final day. Source: http://soxbronzetitan.wordpress.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 QUOTE (justBLAZE @ Nov 20, 2009 -> 04:48 PM) This is the lines for the rest of the White Sox prospects: Brent Morel: .435/.456/.565/1.020 with 4 BBs / 7 Ks in 62 ABs (4 XBHs: 2 2B, 2 HR) C.J. Retherford: .246/.333/.348/.681 with 7 BBs and 9 Ks in 69 ABs (4 XBHs: 2 3B, 1 HR) Dayan Viciedo: .333/.350/.556/.906 with 1 BB and 6 Ks in 18 ABs (2 XBHs: 1 2B, 1 HR) With a phenomenal closing rush, White Sox prospect Brent Morel ran away with the Arizona Fall League batting championship. The third baseman went 19-for-33 over his final eight games to close at .435 and beat Yankees farmhand Colin Curtis by 38 points. Morel did not join the league until Oct. 26 and did not accumulate enough plate appearances to qualify for the title until the final day. Source: http://soxbronzetitan.wordpress.com/ Danks in full... Jordan Danks: .343/.458/.505/.963 with 20 BBs / 26 Ks in 99 ABs (10 XBHs: 7 2B, 3 HR) The discipline is nice...the 4.57 K/PA or 3.81 K/AB is still quite rough, especially against minor league pitching in a hitter's league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 QUOTE (Jerksticks @ Nov 20, 2009 -> 10:54 AM) Tell me, do I understand this correctly? Will he find more polished curveballs coming his way there? As I understand it, the better raw stuff is in AA, but more pitchers in AAA have been up to the show. Yes QUOTE (Jerksticks @ Nov 20, 2009 -> 10:54 AM) So would we get a better idea of his strikeout/discipline projections if he were exposed to more polished repertoires? Depends what he's struggling with. AAA is a good testing ground for hitting off-speed stuff. But there are hitters who can thrive there but not be able to hit a major league fastball. (ex. Josh Fields) QUOTE (Jerksticks @ Nov 20, 2009 -> 10:54 AM) I guess that's my question; are pitchers in AAA tougher pitchers? Difficult to compare. Some pitchers never make it above AA. Others go right from AA to MLB. AAA on average has pitchers who are more talented, but the primo talents don't spend much time there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 (edited) Patrick, how far away do you think Morel really is? I have never really looked into this kid until now...could he be our starting 3b as early as next season? Edit: I mean the 2011 season. Edited November 21, 2009 by iamshack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 21, 2009 -> 09:39 AM) Patrick, how far away do you think Morel really is? I have never really looked into this kid until now...could he be our starting 3b as early as next season? Edit: I mean the 2011 season. Don't know. He sure looked good in the AFL... Apparently, Gary Ward helped him make a few adjustments that obviously brought some nice results. But I think we'll have to see him over a larger sample size of at-bats. Next year at Birmingham will be very telling. I expect Viciedo will spend the year as Charlotte's 3B, so it's likely that Morel will spend 2010 with the Barons and 2011 in Charlotte before he gets a shot at MLB in 2012. That's assuming of course that Kenny doesn't get an itch and deal one of them before then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 QUOTE (scenario @ Nov 21, 2009 -> 11:18 AM) Don't know. He sure looked good in the AFL... Apparently, Gary Ward helped him make a few adjustments that obviously brought some nice results. But I think we'll have to see him over a larger sample size of at-bats. Next year at Birmingham will be very telling. I expect Viciedo will spend the year as Charlotte's 3B, so it's likely that Morel will spend 2010 with the Barons and 2011 in Charlotte before he gets a shot at MLB in 2012. That's assuming of course that Kenny doesn't get an itch and deal one of them before then. Thanks buddy. Personally, I have very little faith in Viciedo ever playing 3b for us. Given that Teahan has 2 years of service time remaining, I guess we could possibly see Morel as the 2012 OD starter. I'll be excited to follow his progress in BHam this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 http://www.mlb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?si...pddwin_perwin_1 Danks, Morel, and Retherford all starting today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Live link to the game. http://mlb.mlb.com/media/video.jsp?topic_id=7617858 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 The game is also on MLB Network if you have it, which I do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 QUOTE (danman31 @ Nov 21, 2009 -> 01:52 PM) The game is also on MLB Network if you have it, which I do. sweet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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