Brian Cashman? Hi it's Kenny Williams

[shago]

Yankees have tons of prospects, 1.5 quality starters and some OF love to go around. Kenny, make the call....

 

We'll take Granderson too....

 

[Vote4Pedro]

i dont want prospects unless we are trading a major piece especially if we are going "all in" this year. I'd pass on Granderson but love me some Brett Gardner

Edited December 15, 2010 by beckham15

[Pale Sox]

Quentin/Floyd/Teahen for Ivan Nova/Gardner.

 

Cashman said he's targeting a RH 4th OF. Quentin wouldn't be a 4th OF, but it does indicate that Cashman senses the Yankees lineup is a little LH heavy. Their reason for interest in Floyd is obvious. Teahen is a salary dump with negative trade value, but a team like the Yankees can afford such an expensive utility guy more than anyone.

 

Gardner's appeal is obvious, and Nova has a power fastball/sinker that would probably appeal to KW. He'd also make our rotation a lot less costly going forward. We'll need that money next offseason when Jackson and Buehrle become free agents. Teahen being gone is a no-brainer in its benefit, and it opens up a spot on the 25-man for an extra reliever (which could be bought with our remaining cash...we could even afford Soriano in such a scenario).

 

These are just quick thoughts and will never happen. But I'm bored.

Edited December 15, 2010 by Pale Sox

[pktmotion]

ML Talent

 

choose one

 

Curtis Granderson

Brett Gardner

Joba Chamberlain

 

and

 

Prospects

 

choose one of...

 

Jesus Montero

Brandon Laird

Manny Banuelos

Hector Noesi

Gary Sanchez

 

or...

 

choose two of...

 

DJ Mitchell

Austin Romine

Luke Murton

Danny Brewer

Kyle Roller

Jack Rye

 

 

for Danks/Floyd...Jackson(pick one from each group of prospects)

[SoxFan1]

Am I the only crazy person who doesn't want to trade anybody from our rotation???? This doesn't make ANY sense to me. We're going "all in" by trading a piece of our awesome rotation? Or by dealing a good bat for relievers?

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

ML Talent

 

choose one

 

Curtis Granderson

Brett Gardner

Joba Chamberlain

 

and

 

Prospects

 

choose one of...

 

Jesus Montero

Brandon Laird

Manny Banuelos

Hector Noesi

Gary Sanchez

 

or...

 

choose two of...

 

DJ Mitchell

Austin Romine

Luke Murton

Danny Brewer

Kyle Roller

Jack Rye

 

 

for Danks/Floyd...Jackson(pick one from each group of prospects)

 

Trade 2 starters? Ehhh...

[ThunderBolt]

Why don't we just sign a couple bullpen arms and call it a day? Wouldn't that be preferable to trading half of our rotation?

[Springfield Soxfan]

Am I the only crazy person who doesn't want to trade anybody from our rotation???? This doesn't make ANY sense to me. We're going "all in" by trading a piece of our awesome rotation? Or by dealing a good bat for relievers?

I'm in complete agreement, do not trade pitching unless it is for other pitching. Without knowing Peavy's status and the a fifth starter still up in the air, I would not favor trading from this group at all right now. Also with the budget, KW still has the issue of Danks' contract and arbitration.

[Pale Sox]

My suggestion was to trade two of our players for more cost effective players of similar elk (OF, SP) based on the different needs of the two teams, and then to use the saved money on relief help.

 

But again, all these trade ideas are just to pass the time anyways.

[spiderman]

A few thoughts...

 

1) Jim Hendry is the one who should be on the phone if the Cubs are really interested (and that's a big 'IF') in moving Zambrano. I believe he's owed around $18 million for the next few seasons, and the Yankees are the one team, now probably desperate to land a front-line starter, who may be risk-adverse and willing to take a chance that he'll continue his late season success. Again, something tells me that Hendry is probably not creative enough to find a way to make this happen though.

 

2) The White Sox don't have an ace, but they do have dependable starters in Danks, Buerhle, Jackson, and Floyd (well, sometimes he's dependable). Hopefully, Peavy is able to return by June as a 5th starter, but I really don't know that trading one of the top 4 makes sense anymore now that the Sox are making a run - on most days, they will get a quality start, maybe not domination, from these top 4 guys, and with this offnesive firepower, it should be a good combination. I don't want to weaken the rotation espeically with Peavy already down.

[pktmotion]

Trade 2 starters? Ehhh...

 

 

No, one or the other. Not both. Obviously the packages wouldn't be similar, since Floyd/Danks/Jackson have different values. But I tried to give a laundry list of players I feel could accompany needs.

 

If the Yankees propose Curtis Granderson, Hector Noesi and Danny Brewer for Gavin Floyd I'd have to seriously consider.

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

No, one or the other. Not both. Obviously the packages wouldn't be similar, since Floyd/Danks/Jackson have different values. But I tried to give a laundry list of players I feel could accompany needs.

 

If the Yankees propose Curtis Granderson, Hector Noesi and Danny Brewer for Gavin Floyd I'd have to seriously consider.

 

Oh, the way you wrote it was "Floyd/Danks....Jackson" as if you meant either Floyd or Danks + Jackson.

[Buehrlesque]

I don't see the point of an "All In" team trading a SP for prospects, relief pitchers, or anything that would open up a hole on the roster. But...

 

Here's a totally wacky scenario I dreamed up:

 

Suspend reality for a minute and consider the following:

 

1. Trade Quentin and Viciedo to the Rays for SP Matt Garza

2. Trade Gavin Floyd to the Yankees for OF Brett Gardner and RP Joba Chamberlain

3. Trade Juan Pierre to anyone willing to take his contract, maybe with a $1.5 million subsidy

4. Trade Mark Teahen and one of Kyle Bellamy/Charlie Leesman/Nathan Jones to the Mets for OF Carlos Beltran plus $6.5 million.

5. Sign Freddy Garcia (one year, $1.5 million).

 

Net Payroll Hit for the Sox: ZERO* ($19.5 mil out, $19.5 mil in)

 

 

Now that's "All in"!! Do I think that is reasonable? Not entirely. But how cool would that be?

Edited December 15, 2010 by Buehrlesque

[pktmotion]

Sorry for the confusion.

 

I doubt anything will transpire with the Yanks/White Sox. And to tell you the truth, aside from Montero, Yankee prospects don't excite me enough to trade a cost-controlled young SP like Floyd or Danks.

 

If they had a deal in place to drop CQ for a 5th starter/prospects and wanted to turn Floyd into Granderson/prospects; i'd be fine with that. Even considering how horrible Granderson is against LHP.

[bschmaranz]

I don't see the point of an "All In" team trading a SP for prospects, relief pitchers, or anything that would open up a hole on the roster. But...

 

Here's a totally wacky scenario I dreamed up:

 

Suspend reality for a minute and consider the following:

 

1. Trade Quentin and Viciedo to the Rays for SP Matt Garza

2. Trade Gavin Floyd to the Yankees for OF Brett Gardner and RP Joba Chamberlain

3. Trade Juan Pierre to anyone willing to take his contract, maybe with a $1.5 million subsidy

4. Trade Mark Teahen and one of Kyle Bellamy/Charlie Leesman/Nathan Jones to the Mets for OF Carlos Beltran plus $6.5 million.

5. Sign Freddy Garcia (one year, $1.5 million).

 

Net Payroll Hit for the Sox: ZERO* ($19.5 mil out, $19.5 mil in)

 

 

Now that's "All in"!! Do I think that is reasonable? Not entirely. But how cool would that be?

 

I don't see #2 happening but other then that, I think it's somewhat feasible. Certainly not probable though.

[witesoxfan]

I don't understand where this thought that the Rays are going to be interested in Quentin is coming from, and I don't know why people have a fascination for Matt Garza. He is a good but not great starting pitcher.

 

The Rays are looking for players who are under team control for quite a few years. While Viciedo fits that role, Quentin does not and could legitimately end up spending only one year with the Rays. That doesn't seem like a good investment, does it?

 

I think people can forget about the complex scenarios where the White Sox make 4 more trades; I think I might honestly be surprised if the White Sox make 1 more trade at this point. I think they'll want to, but they need to get a return that they deem viable, and I don't see that happening with any of their guys.

[Lemon_44]

I don't see the point of an "All In" team trading a SP for prospects, relief pitchers, or anything that would open up a hole on the roster. But...

 

Here's a totally wacky scenario I dreamed up:

 

Suspend reality for a minute and consider the following:

 

1. Trade Quentin and Viciedo to the Rays for SP Matt Garza

2. Trade Gavin Floyd to the Yankees for OF Brett Gardner and RP Joba Chamberlain

3. Trade Juan Pierre to anyone willing to take his contract, maybe with a $1.5 million subsidy

4. Trade Mark Teahen and one of Kyle Bellamy/Charlie Leesman/Nathan Jones to the Mets for OF Carlos Beltran plus $6.5 million.

5. Sign Freddy Garcia (one year, $1.5 million).

 

Net Payroll Hit for the Sox: ZERO* ($19.5 mil out, $19.5 mil in)

 

 

Now that's "All in"!! Do I think that is reasonable? Not entirely. But how cool would that be?

The trade I'd like to see would be a different combo than you mentioned. I would like to see Pierre and prospects go to the Mets for Beltran. You could move Quentin to LF and have an CF/RF combo of Rios and Beltran. I know there wouldn't br a coventional lead off hitter but so what. That would be a loaded lineup :

Beckham

Alexei

Dunn

PK

Beltran

Rios

CQ

AJ

Morel

 

[witesoxfan]

The trade I'd like to see would be a different combo than you mentioned. I would like to see Pierre and prospects go to the Mets for Beltran. You could move Quentin to LF and have an CF/RF combo of Rios and Beltran. I know there wouldn't br a coventional lead off hitter but so what. That would be a loaded lineup :

Beckham

Alexei

Dunn

PK

Beltran

Rios

CQ

AJ

Morel

 

And Sandy Alderson is going to hang up the phone when you mention the name Pierre. Beyond that, the White Sox are already up against their budget, or have exceeded it. There's no room to bring in an additional $10 million, and the Mets aren't going to simply kick in money.

 

If the Mets are going to go into a semi-rebuilding phase, then they are going to trade Beltran for young, cost controlled players. That's the exact opposite of Juan Pierre. They have absolutely no use for Pierre whatsoever, and there will be other teams who are more willing to trade good prospects than the White Sox are.

 

The lineup isn't perfect, but it's not a big problem at this point in time. The only two small problem areas are the bench and bullpen, and those can be effectively handled rather cheaply. I could see the Sox signing another veteran bat and bullpen arm, and going with younger players otherwise. If the Sox add payroll at this point, it's not going to be very much, and I still think the Sox are probably going to be looking to shed some salary in a few other spots around the team too.

 

Can we please, please put this Beltran talk to rest?

[Lillian]

Those who argue that we shouldn't trade any pitching have a very strong point.

 

One area that the Sox could still improve, other than the bullpen, is left handed hitting.

Our division is very heavily weighted with RHP. Unfortunately, our lineup is still heavily weighted with RH hitting.

 

Quentin to the Yankees or Phillies, for a good left handed hitting outfielder would work for me. I still like the idea of Dominic Brown and Blanton for Quentin and someone who will not be counted on to contribute this year.

The Phillies are obviously going for it with all of that terrific, expensive pitching. They still need a solid right handed hitting outfielder to replace Werth, and they need to dump Blanton's salary. We could use Blanton to fill out the rotation if we can find a taker for Floyd, or one of the other aforementioned starters.

My question is whether Brown is really ready to contribute.

 

Granderson is interesting, although you would hope that the Sox would get another piece in a Granderson for Quentin trade, especially given his salary.

Not only is Brown, or Granderson a good fit, because they both hit from the left side, but they're also both plus defenders, and improving the outfield defense should be another priority.

 

If the Sox could do the Blanton and Brown for Quentin + trade, then I like the idea of dealing Buerhle to the Yankees for Granderson.

Blanton almost makes up for the loss of Buerhle, except for all of the intangibles that Buerhle brings. However, the salary relief probably offsets that.

The Yankees need the pitching, and money never seems to matter much to them. The "fly in the ointment" here is that Mark would probably veto any trade to the Yankees.

But I would sure love that outfield of Brown, Granderson and Rios, wouldn't you? Speed, defense, 2 out of 3 left handed hitters.

Oh gosh, I forgot. Where would Juan play? Oh, how sad.

 

Hey, the formula of stacking the lineup with left handed bats seems to work pretty well for the Twins.

Let's face it, other than Dunn, the Sox don't have any dangerous left handed hitters. Moreover, there aren't any in our farm system who could contribute any time soon, with the possible exception of the newly acquired Dallas McPherson. However, who knows if he'll ever be healthy enough to have an impact.

Edited December 15, 2010 by Lillian

[witesoxfan]

Quentin to the Yankees or Phillies, for a good left handed hitting outfielder would work for me. I still like the idea of Dominic Brown and Blanton for Quentin and someone who will not be counted on to contribute this year.

The Phillies are obviously going for it with all of that terrific, expensive pitching. They still need a solid right handed hitting outfielder to replace Werth, and they need to dump Blanton's salary. We could use Blanton to fill out the rotation if we can find a taker for Floyd, or one of the other aforementioned starters.

My question is whether Brown is really ready to contribute.

 

As has been mentioned, the Phillies are in love with Dominic Brown. BA had him as the 15th best prospect in the game going into the season and he only helped his stock by putting up a .327/.391/.589/.980 line between AA and AAA this year. They would be insane to include him in a deal as compensation for salary relief when they aren't getting that much salary relief in the first place. On top of that, there will be suitors for solely Joe Blanton. They won't get a lot for him, but he's a solid middle of the rotation starter, and that has plenty of value on the trade market.

 

Granderson is interesting, although you would hope that the Sox would get another piece in a Granderson for Quentin trade, especially given his salary.

Not only is Brown, or Granderson a good fit, because they both hit from the left side, but they're also both plus defenders, and improving the outfield defense should be another priority.

 

Granderson plays good defense in CF, as you mentioned; Carlos Quentin plays terrible defense in LF or RF. Considering that, at their peaks, Granderson really isn't that much worse than Quentin offensively, that defense alone makes him a much, much better player than Quentin. If anything, it would be the Sox giving (much) more in a deal along with Quentin for Granderson.

 

If the Sox could do the Blanton and Brown for Quentin + trade, then I like the idea of dealing Buerhle to the Yankees for Granderson.

Blanton almost makes up for the loss of Buerhle, except for all of the intangibles that Buerhle brings. However, the salary relief probably offsets that.

The Yankees need the pitching, and money never seems to matter much to them. The "fly in the ointment" here is that Mark would probably veto any trade to the Yankees.

 

Replacing one of the faces of the franchise with Joe Blanton would be pretty awful. And, as mentioned above, there is pretty much no way that Philly would trade Dominic Brown, like, at all. And then as you mention, Buehrle probably wouldn't wave his no-trade clause to go to New York.

 

 

But I would sure love that outfield of Brown, Granderson and Rios, wouldn't you? Speed, defense, 2 out of 3 left handed hitters.

 

There are a lot of things in this world that I would love to have. A Porsche 911, a bottle of 25 year single malt scotch, an ocean named after me - but these things aren't realistic, are they?

 

Neither is that outfield.

 

 

Hey, the formula of stacking the lineup with left handed bats seems to work pretty well for the Twins.

Let's face it, other than Dunn, the Sox don't have any dangerous left handed hitters. Moreover, there aren't any in our farm system who could contribute any time soon, with the possible exception of the newly acquired Dallas McPherson. However, who knows if he'll ever be healthy enough to have an impact.

 

The Twins stack the lineup with good bats, period.

 

The White Sox don't have a lot of pop from the left side of the plate, but they generally never have. They shouldn't go out of their way to try and accommodate that, because they have quite a few good hitters in the lineup as is. The main two reasons you want to specifically have left handed bats in the lineup are when you need to hit righties better and to cause matchup problems late in a game. Adam Dunn has accomplished the first goal pretty well by himself, and quite honestly, Mark Teahen off the bench is OK too. With regard to the second reason, a team isn't going to bring in a LOOGY to get Juan Pierre out. However, they probably will do so if Pierzynski comes up in a big spot - he's not an incredible hitter, but he's competent, gets base hits, and does hit for a little bit of power.

 

Oh, and Dallas McPherson really doesn't mean anything. He's got light tower power, but he's never been able to translate that to anything significant and is merely there for the Charlotte Knight's viewing pleasure.

 

[Lillian]

Thank you, "Whitesoxfan", for your thoughtful and well reasoned response.

 

I understand that the Phillies love Brown. Why wouldn't they? However, they reportedly also like Quentin. They really need a right handed power hitting outfielder, who is ready to contribute this year. I think that if you include one other piece, the Phillies just might go for the deal I proposed.

Quentin could realistically be expected to hit 30 to 35 homers, and drive in 80 to 100 runs. I doubt that the Phillies expect Brown to do that, at this stage of his career.

 

So are you saying that you wouldn't like the trade of Quentin + another player for Blanton and Brown?

Or, are you saying that the Phillies wouldn't make the trade?

[witesoxfan]

There's no way Philadelphia would make that trade. I can imagine they do like Carlos Quentin, but probably more as a replacement for Raul Ibanez. If you want to include another player to get Dominic Brown, you are pretty much limited to Chris Sale and any other minor leaguers the Phillies may want.

[SoxAce]

I loved Gardner for 2 years now. My opinion on him still won't change. He's like what Juan Pierre wishes he could be. Not gonna say any trade proposals cause it's rather pointless (but to dream) but I would like to see Kenny get creative this off-season since he disappointed me with his lack of creativity last off-season.

[Lillian]

There's no way Philadelphia would make that trade. I can imagine they do like Carlos Quentin, but probably more as a replacement for Raul Ibanez. If you want to include another player to get Dominic Brown, you are pretty much limited to Chris Sale and any other minor leaguers the Phillies may want.

 

Carlos Quentin and Sale is too much to give for Brown. Wouldn't K.W. be crazy to even consider that?

[Thad Bosley]

I don't know why people keep coming up with these Juan Pierre trade scenarios. He's clearly not going anywhere. Guillen loves him, and unlike with guys like Quentin and Beckham, there has been no speculation whatsoever this offseason about him being moved. He has one year left on his current contract, and he'll serve out that year as the Sox' leftfielder and lead-off hitter.