Constant trade rumors post garcia trade

[southsideirish]

More valuable than a good catcher?

Who is going to fill Marte's hole? No one! Alomar, Burke, or Davis will suffice. No need to give up Marte for a 28 year old catcher who is having his first decent year with only 4 home runs so far.

[southsideirish]

Marte is a target of the Braves. Estrada is hitting almost .340. He probably is the Braves MVP thus far this year. He is known as a good defensive catcher. He makes the minimum. Teams don't trade that for prospects. The Atlanta GM is one of the best in the business, he doesn't get hoodwinked. Levineline mentioned Marte and Juan Cruz perhaps switching teams, maybe he has accurate information for once. Don't think for a second Estrada is coming here for prospects or as a throw in. He will work for cheap for several more years.

Then I would rather take my chances on Alomar/Burke/Davis. No need to create another huge hole in the bullpen. Pitching first.

[Dick Allen]

Who is going to fill Marte's hole? No one! Alomar, Burke, or Davis will suffice. No need to give up Marte for a 28 year old catcher who is having his first decent year with only 4 home runs so far.

I'm pretty sure if the Sox did a deal that involved Estrada and Marte, it also would involve Ortiz, and more Sox prospects. which would kick Scho back to the bullpen, to take Marte's spot. I guess its possible this may go down, but I hope not.

[southsideirish]

I'm pretty sure if the Sox did a deal that involved Estrada and Marte, it also would involve Ortiz, and more Sox prospects. which would kick Scho back to the bullpen, to take Marte's spot. I guess its possible this may go down, but I hope not.

Shoe to take over Marte's spot? :puke

 

I will keep Alomar/Burke/Davis thank you very much.

[cwsox]

Then I would rather take my chances on Alomar/Burke/Davis. No need to create another huge hole in the bullpen. Pitching first.

agreed

[mmmmmbeeer]

believe it will be something like Rowand/Rauch/Diaz/Davis for Jones/Ortiz/Estrada. The Braves get good young talented prospects while at the same time cutting payroll drastically. We get all star caliber talent add a bunch of payroll and it allows us to move Shoew or Garland into the bullpen. How about that team?

 

Imagine that lineup

 

2B Harris/Uribe

LF Carlos Lee

RF Magglio

DH Big Frank

1B Konerko

SS Valentin

CF Andruw Jones

C Johnny Estrada

3B Joe Crede

 

Rotation

Garcia

Buehrle

Loaiza

Ortiz

Shoew/Garland

 

Bullpen

Shingo

Marte

Politte

Garland/Shoew

Adkins

Cotts

Jackson

 

We could add a bullpen arm later maybe? Cut Jackson loose? A man can dream can't he?

====> Me after the Sox win the WS with that roster

[JUGGERNAUT]

Look I know you want to keep Maggs for the stretch drive but you seemed to forget that ATL is not out of the NLE by a long shot. They are 4.5 gb & Beckett's on the DL.

They're on a two game winning streak & are playing about as good as FL & PHI right now.

 

I don't think any one fears the Mets in that div so ATL can hardly justify a white flag

trade. The Maggs+players for Jones+Ortiz+players makes sense for both teams because ATL is essentially trading defense for power. It's a move they make for both the present & the future.

 

I don't see Kenny giving up Marte or Shingo because they are becoming the best setup+closer combo in the league. But just about everybody else is fair game. ATL was expected to throw in cash in the original deal to cover Ortiz salary. They were going to pick up Maggs remainder & the SOX pick up Jones remainder. Now the SOX might be able to pull Estrada away by picking up Ortiz remainder. This is where JR would really be pony up the bucks.

He's already picked up about 2 mil in cost between what was saved on Koch & what's being spent on Garcia. To pick up Ortiz would be another 3 mil.

 

Ortiz is a FA so he'd definitely be a rent a player. To be honest I don't know if he's that much of an upgrade over Garland. I'd rather have the LH Moyer.

 

LH Moyer: 8 quality starts, 4 winnable starts, 4 poor starts. 2001 post season starts: 3-0 & about a 2.6 era.

 

It's that kind of experience that I think would

help the SOX further in the post season then Ortiz.

[Chisoxfn]

The latest rumors have Ordonez going to Atlanta for either pitcher Russ Ortiz or center fielder Andruw Jones.

 

"I have not had one conversation with regards to Mags with [Atlanta GM] John Schuerholz," Williams said. "And I have spoken with him."

 

To me that seems pretty strong. If Kenny is going to make a deal then I think their is a good shot we got Jones and one or both of Estrada/Russ Ortiz and Maggs won't be involved. I do think Crede could very well be a part of the deal though although I don't know if the Braves have a need at 3rd (cause they do have Andy Marte in the minors).

 

The Sox will take their chances of losing Maggs at the end of the season for draft picks, knowing that Andruw Jones will then take over for him. But their is a decent shot that they will play together for at least a few months and that would be pretty damn interesting, imo.

 

Oh ya, If Maggs doesn't go in this deal, then you can book Rowand beinga part of it. I'd say Rowand/Crede/pitching prospect could do it, but I doubt the Sox deal Crede. The only reason I suggest Crede is that Uribe can shift to 3rd with Harris at 2nd and I'd say the Sox would be in solid shape.

[Ishmookie]

what aboutwunsch whats up with him?

[Chisoxfn]

what aboutwunsch whats up with him?

He's on the DL, but he could always make an entrance.

[ZoomSlowik]

I don't know where the idea that Jones=Maggs started. That's a joke. Has anyone looked as his stats? He's hitting .248 this year, has hit over .280 once in his career, and his knees are bothering him. His defense isn't what it used to be, and he's notorious for dogging it, and could be a real problem in the clubhouse. Plus by adding him, you destroy your flexibility. If they acquire him, there is no chance Maggs is back(whether or not he is part of the deal), and your chances of keeping Garcia drop, plus you can't add players in Free Agency, where there will be some attractive options. You are much better off keeping Maggs for the rest of the year. There is simply no hitter that would be available that would have the impact Maggs would have once he gets healthy. Even if you lose him at the end of the year, you pick up a few draft picks and have $14 mil to work with in payroll. Ortiz is also overrated. He walks a lot of guys, and without the pitcher as an easy out, his ERA probably jumps a bit. These guys are two of the most overrated players around, and are not worth adding. Some bullpen help might be nice, but these guys suck. The only pitchers that I think would be worth getting before the end of the year that may in some scenario be available are Odalis Perez and Randy Johnson, which are unlikely.

[BrandoFan]

I don't know where the idea that Jones=Maggs started. That's a joke. Has anyone looked as his stats? He's hitting .248 this year, has hit over .280 once in his career, and his knees are bothering him. His defense isn't what it used to be, and he's notorious for dogging it, and could be a real problem in the clubhouse. Plus by adding him, you destroy your flexibility. If they acquire him, there is no chance Maggs is back(whether or not he is part of the deal), and your chances of keeping Garcia drop, plus you can't add players in Free Agency, where there will be some attractive options. You are much better off keeping Maggs for the rest of the year. There is simply no hitter that would be available that would have the impact Maggs would have once he gets healthy. Even if you lose him at the end of the year, you pick up a few draft picks and have $14 mil to work with in payroll. Ortiz is also overrated. He walks a lot of guys, and without the pitcher as an easy out, his ERA probably jumps a bit. These guys are two of the most overrated players around, and are not worth adding. Some bullpen help might be nice, but these guys suck. The only pitchers that I think would be worth getting before the end of the year that may in some scenario be available are Odalis Perez and Randy Johnson, which are unlikely.

 

Who the hell knows what JR and his bastard frugal partners are planning for this franchise beyond 2004. If they have finally wised up and realize that they could build something long-lasting here, a dynasty that will make back and then some whatever "extra" they would have to spend, to say nothing of raising the value of the franchise itself, which is their main investment.......then great - give up the prospects, take on multiple-year contracts of highly-talented-but-also-ridiculously-inconsistent players, whatever it takes to accomplish that 5-10 year goal.

 

Seeing Garcia in the Sox uni gives me more hope than 2002 and 2003 did combined. First step in the right direction, hopefully Garcia pitching his ass off encourages Sox management to take other risks as well.

[BobDylan]

When he gets acquainted with his teammates and pitches at home for the 1st time, he'll want to be here alright.

He'll want to stay here alright. Especially after I take him out back and introduce him to my thugs...

[hi8is]

I don't know where the idea that Jones=Maggs started. That's a joke. Has anyone looked as his stats? He's hitting .248 this year, has hit over .280 once in his career, and his knees are bothering him. His defense isn't what it used to be, and he's notorious for dogging it, and could be a real problem in the clubhouse. Plus by adding him, you destroy your flexibility. If they acquire him, there is no chance Maggs is back(whether or not he is part of the deal), and your chances of keeping Garcia drop, plus you can't add players in Free Agency, where there will be some attractive options. You are much better off keeping Maggs for the rest of the year. There is simply no hitter that would be available that would have the impact Maggs would have once he gets healthy. Even if you lose him at the end of the year, you pick up a few draft picks and have $14 mil to work with in payroll. Ortiz is also overrated. He walks a lot of guys, and without the pitcher as an easy out, his ERA probably jumps a bit. These guys are two of the most overrated players around, and are not worth adding. Some bullpen help might be nice, but these guys suck. The only pitchers that I think would be worth getting before the end of the year that may in some scenario be available are Odalis Perez and Randy Johnson, which are unlikely.

when its seen like that, I cant believe ive supported the idea =0

 

but there is an upside that ive been preaching all over

[YASNY]

The Braves would love to get out from under Jones and Ortiz contracts, and still look like they are "going for it". That's why I see Maggs as a potential part of this deal. I think KW should insist on Estrada being included before even considering taking on those contracts.

 

The Braves could either keep Maggs for the year and let him walk, giving them some major payroll flexibility or turn him over for a couple of ML ready youngsters (Minnesota? ) .

 

So you'd have Estrada, Jones and Ortiz for Maggs (or possibly PK), and maybe Rauch and Rowand. Intersting possibilities, but longshots at best.

[JUGGERNAUT]

Forget the LH Moyer.

Because of bonuses in his contract, whoever trades for him owes him a 3 million base in 2005. If he pitches over 200 in this season, he's going to cost 7.5 million for 2005.

He's presently at 97 ip, so 200 is certainly w/in reach.

 

I don't see the SOX trading for him at a total cost of 10 mil (what they owe 2004, & 2005).

[Chisoxfn]

I dunno, 7.5 mill is pretty cheap for Moyer considering the numbers he puts up. Thats assuming he can go out and pitch his ass off once again next season.

[Wong & Owens]

I dunno, 7.5 mill is pretty cheap for  Moyer considering the numbers he puts up.  Thats assuming he can go out and pitch his ass off once again next season.

I read somewhere that Bavasi told the Yankees that he was not trading Moyer under any circumstances.

[upnorthsox]

I read somewhere that Bavasi told the Yankees that he was not trading Moyer under any circumstances.

Moyer has a rock solid no-trade clause and has said he has no intention of waving it so it's really not up to Bavasi.

[witesoxfan]

The Braves would love to get out from under Jones and Ortiz contracts, and still look like they are "going for it".  That's why I see Maggs as a potential part of this deal.  I think KW should insist on Estrada being included before even considering taking on those contracts. 

 

The Braves could either keep Maggs for the year and let him walk, giving them some major payroll flexibility or turn him over for a couple of ML ready youngsters (Minnesota?    ) .

 

So you'd have Estrada, Jones and Ortiz for Maggs (or possibly PK), and maybe Rauch and Rowand.  Intersting possibilities, but longshots at best.

That's scary-ass s***, and I had not thought about that. The Twins could easily get Maggs(Jones+LeCroy+Balfour...that could get you Maggs from the Braves standpoint), and that would be worse then losing Big Mo.

 

Now that I've considered that, Maggs cannot be apart of a deal where he is sent to a non-contender. The only place he could be traded to is to a contender in the NL...if we would happen to see him in the WS, so be it. You cannot run the risk of trading him to a non-contender simply due to the fact that Minnesota COULD have interest in him, and he could spark their lineup.

 

Let's just get Jones and Ortiz, and be done with it.

[JoshPR]

On the way home from work today I was listening to the radio and they were talking about how they still think Jones might be coming to the South Side and Maggs departure but not only that but also the deal involving Johnny Estrada. I wish he could be had because we are in big trouble without Olivo...

 

  I also heard KW in the morning on the way to work speaking of the Garcia deal and possibly other deals in the works, he didn't say anything because he said he finds it disrespectful to say he wants to improve a part of the team and disrespecting the players who try hard everyday. However, KW has said in other interviews there is another big deal in the works and I am hoping for some bullpen help along with some kind of good catcher in the majors or a high prospect in the minors. As you guys can see  I am still hurting from Olivo's departure.

Why would the braves wanna trade Estrada?

[BrandoFan]

I dunno, 7.5 mill is pretty cheap for  Moyer considering the numbers he puts up.  Thats assuming he can go out and pitch his ass off once again next season.

Jamie Moyer has a 4.05 Road ERA, worse than all Sox regulars or just about.

[hammerhead johnson]

but there is an upside that ive been preaching all over

Oh yeah? Where's it at?

 

You should listen to sports radio more often. You get to hear Atlanta sportswriters and experts all around the country tearing Andruw Jones a new one.

 

That's why you'll never hear me talking about some stupid s*** like this trade. Cub fan talk, no doubt.