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In his starts (excluding the piggybacks) since May 15 he's at a 3.65 ERA. Exclude his start getting lit up vs. the Dodgers last week and it's 2.97. Probably some park factors and luck involved, but I do think he'll pitch better than his season numbers when back in a comfortable role (and perhaps a better clubhouse environment).

I would have passed on Doyle but I wouldn’t have balked at Adams and Wolkow for a rental starter. Hopefully we won’t need one and Thorpe/Smith can fill the role. I don’t think Getz ever considered a rental player, which seems fairly obvious with all four players that were acquired being under control for future year(s).

It seems like the pulse of the community is that they would have liked another starter, and everybody seemed resigned to punt on a catcher. I just caught up on the trade strings. The prices being paid were nuts. And to a comment you've made a couple of times, that you would have liked the pieces traded for Doyle (Adams, the DSL SS) used to get a starting pitcher. I think those two would have had to be the 3rd and 4th pieces in a Carlson-headlined deal for run-of-the-mill, 2nd tier dudes.

I do agree that we were all expecting Pereira to be able to play CF when he was first acquired, but that doesn’t seem to be the case.

I think this is well said - I think if you get them, maybe you think in offseason you can do something to improve but in season outside of minor tweaks or pitch sequence changes hard to do much. With Castillo I presume maybe they see some small things that can be done in season but won’t be drastic plus fact that they tout he has been far better since he went back to his normal routine in mid May. I think I heard sub 4 era since like May 15th…which he may have been a bit lucky but he’s also a competitor and he gives innings which they needed big time.

Yea but we had Perez out there too. Could have kept Hill in lieu of him. Anyway, if Doyle can re-channel 2024, we're set.

I've posted some reasons why elsewhere. He's had personal issues (lost a child due to miscarriage) and some injuries since his breakout 2024. The injuries are hopefully behind him, and he's been showing some positive offensive signs since returning from injury this year. He's a good defender which helps prop his value up. Sox seem to like taking multiple shots on multiple players to see who sticks and who their organizational philosophy can help. I don't have a problem with that.

Yeah, nobody is ranting here. I think some of the individual reactions in the general trade string are extreme (worst trade ever, etc.), and those just make me consider them, more. I'm not criticizing anyone for their viewpoints. I don't think that single play changed the org's minds on Pereira, but if they were leaning, I don't think it helped.

He gained some velocity since TJS. Huge plus IMO.

B-/C+ I don’t understand the Pereira move. He’s shaky in the field, but he seemed to have some RH pop. Seems like the kind of guy you’d want to keep around. If they feel Doyle is going to regain his form from a few years ago, I suppose it’s worth a shot. I like the Bart pickup, but I still feel like Lee should have been called up at some point. I’d rather see Shultz move to the pen. He can’t seem to make it through a second time around the order, so pitching in relief might accelerate his game. Fedde and Kay both give a solid 5 innings and keep the game close. Bullpen move is an upgrade. Most importantly, they didn’t give away anything that should affect their future.

I’m just not seeing where Doyle is much of anything either. He’s 3 years older than Pereira and has had a lot more time to prove himself in the majors. He has almost 1,450 more major league plate appearances than Pereira and here’s his career line. Yikes… .233 .284 .385 .670

While I hate this trade from a value perspective, I'm excited to watch Luis as I've always enjoyed him and he's always come off as a real competitor. I hope he can tap into some magic and find a little juice. Also will say the idea that he's stopped throwing the change isn't true. He's just thrown it half as much, and he started throwing a 4 seamer much more. The 4 seamer was a better pitch as the change had been regressing even in cincy, so the adjustment made sense. Change ups seem to have a sustainability problem more than most pitches now. I'm not sure if it's video and pitching machines, but elite ones shelf life appear to be shorter than sliders and fastballs. I will add that all this talk of the Sox acquiring a player to change them mid-season and unlock success is crazy imo. Guys don't drastically overhaul who they are mid-season.

Most of the grades in this thread are fairly comparable. I’m not seeing any hyperbolic “glum chums” ranting. You even graded it a C. Hyperbolic would be reasoning a player that you formerly liked out of your mind over one single defensive miscue.

Because we're a rebuilding club running prospects through the queue. Hill wasn't a long-term piece. And if they found a taker, they had to move him to give Pereira a shot to see what they had. Same with Acuña, Kelenic, Peters, Murray, Notch and Nishida.

Yeah, the more hyperbolic our glum chums rant, that makes me look for more positives, and then I find them. I've already reasoned Pereira out of my mind over that 8th inning single he let bounce past him on Saturday, and if Castillo can right the ship, I think he's a dude.

Hill was a great waiver pick up but once Braden came up and took over right field, he was the odd man out. Peters took off and was playing great which was totally unexpected.

I just don't think Pereira is much of anything because he can't stay on the field. We'll see if Doyle is any better.

I don’t think his one recent good game is the frustrating part. But Pereira was supposed to be a power bat that strikes out a lot and could play all three outfield spots. Now we traded away a potential nice bullpen arm, a flier young kid, and DFA’d Pereira to replace Pereira with the similar player that he was supposed to be, only Doyle is 3 years older. That to me is the frustrating aspect.

JR didn’t want to eat Hays salary só forced Getz to find a defensive replacement in Doyle…? As noted, already had a better player in Derek Hill unless they can somehow fix Doyle.

So we traded for what we had and then virtually gave away in Hill. We’ve done several of these zigzag sort of things over the last couple of years.

Preller is going to get fired (and quickly rehired by someone) if this gambit doesn’t work out. Farm system cooked except for Ethan Salas.

C for what they got. D for what they gave up to get it.

Thome

Between a C & a B, so I went B to err on the positive side. I like the reliever trade a lot. Bart they didn't give up much for, is a pretty good defender, and isn't a good hitter but is LIGHT YEARS better than Romo and Quero. I think Doyle is worth a look and it sounds like there was some competition for him. Don't really care much for what they gave up either. Also the usual suspects here hate the move and that automatically makes it better. Castillo is mixed to me. I'm glad they didn't shy away from taking on money, I'm glad they got rid of Dominguez, I think Boston Smith is nothing special as a prospect, but they'd better hope they can fix Castillo and get him back to at least a halfway decent starter. It's also funny how much people hate losing Pereira all of a sudden after one good game. If he was DFA'd before yesterday's game people would be celebrating. I would also rather have kept him, but it's not really worth worrying about. He was the best of some meh options.

Adams coming off TJ is a factor that comes into play.