LDF

QUOTE (hi8is @ May 28, 2015 -> 12:56 AM) Here's how it works... Every day after the game, I'll post the main headline article off chisox.com Then, you mock it. Let's get some laughs going. Disclaimer: This is done in fun and not to hate. ahh i remove what i posted.... sorry.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 27, 2015 -> 11:42 PM) It is the schtick. Then there is reality. Reality dictates that a team understands the nature of its fanbase and try to cater to them to some extent. It is the entire reason we have never seen a completely sell of like the Cubs can do because of their fan loyalty. It is why the team was looking for near major league ready talent in most of its deals a few years back, instead of waiting for a process that could take half of a decade or more. Even if it failed, a slow erosion of fans being better than the bandwagon all emptying at once, and stupid stuff like BLACK FLAG coming back into vogue with the more meatball portion of the population. It is why as soon as the rebuild even started to look like it was turning a corner, the team went out and bought a bunch of major leaguers at market prices in an attempt to bring back some of the bandwagon. If Sox fans want to paint themselves as smart, they have to be able to take an honest look at the whole picture, and understand all of the pieces of the puzzle, not just the parts that generate calls on the Score. If you are ignoring parts of the story to paint your narrative, you aren't half as smart as you think. But no, let's go ahead and resume the whining about what a horrible 35 years it has been, and people can't take the horrible pain anymore. WHY ME? WHY DOES OWNERSHIP DO THIS TO ME? I AM ENTITLED TO BETTER! ahhh ok, but i am in agreement here. the sox can not afford to do a complete overhaul but not for those points you make, which are good, but the team will loose what ever fan base they have. they can not be half ass in running this org. it has been proven over and over by the lack of attendance. this is a way for the fans to make a point to the owners and the owners will listen. b/c of the market of the fans of the 2 baseball team and yes the profit margin of the over all revenue. btw, i didn't say anything about whining to you. another point, i never consider myself smart, more like being stubborn.

QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ May 27, 2015 -> 11:10 PM) And why are we even talking about bandwagon fans at this point in time, anyway! This team has amassed 212 losses in the past 2 1/4 years now. That's not appealing to any fans, bandwagon or otherwise. Where the debate should be is what we think Moe, Larry, and Curly, a.k.a. Jerry, Kenny, and Rick, should do to reverse these sad fortunes. why are you brow beating the subject. you ended it, and then stated back up back accusing someone of whining, and now you came back to this nonsense. loosing makes everyone have a short temper.

QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ May 27, 2015 -> 09:20 PM) wow, kite, can you expound on that "sell" comment? I know that JR has been slowly losing power in MLB, culminating with the Manfred appointment. Is he ready to move on? yeah ..... you got me thinking about that. i hate to being accuse of hijacking this discussion, but i am very curious. are they, the sox going to trade what, Hawkins, and of the of prospect listed in the top 30, like #10 or better?? i would if it was able to get comp picks n this upcoming draft.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 27, 2015 -> 02:45 PM) Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi 1h1 hour ago MLB statement on report of Orioles playing exhibition in Cuba this year: "No decision has been made about any team playing in Cuba." isn't that against the law of some sort????

according to mlb trade rumors..... Dodgers Designate Sergio Santos http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/

QUOTE (shipps @ May 27, 2015 -> 10:31 PM) This lady friend must be a serious relationship LDF. A George Clooney movie is next level type s*** man. haha ..... at my age, you know you need a motivating factor to get there. but i wish i remember what to do next.

i just went to see tomorrowland with my lady friend. for starters it is a movie for young couples with young children. not a movie for old timers like me. i almost walked out several times but i stayed to the end. don't get me wrong, great acting the 3 young stars were great, make that beyond great. they are going to have a great future in movies. plain and simple, no cussing, no major violence. a overall great family movie. bravo..... need more family movies like this.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ May 27, 2015 -> 08:24 PM) They don't have good people running the minors either. Rumor has it the word "sell" is coming up in the organization. Even with that the same inept people will probably remain for a while. All the people in the minors need to go. wasn't there some additions that Hahn has made that is running in parallel with the old timers. i thought Hahn install a copy last during the off season.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ May 27, 2015 -> 08:16 PM) Rumor has it he doesn't have the control like most GMs. These things you mention are similar to KW running the show. more likely, KW has the final input on decisions.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 27, 2015 -> 08:03 PM) I very strongly disagree with the concept that you should not judge the GM based on the results of their decision rather than how the decision looked at the time. It's an excuse that leaves us with a losing franchise. If a person makes decisions that constantly look correct at the time and blow up in their face every single time...then it is absolutely time to reevaluate that decision making process and that's where we are right now. The assumptions behind those moves are simply incorrect. We're ignoring defense. We're ignoring fundamentals. We're continuing to push people too aggressively. We thought we had a team (both this year and in 2013) that was ready to compete and we spent a whole lot of money based on that assumption. We are totally failing to understand this roster, this team, or how to build a competitive team. If every decision looks fine and they completely implode, then we need to reevaluate how we're judging these decisions. Either that, or every decision we made did work out, and the coaching staff completely failed in their job of getting those players ready to go. Take your pick. I'm going with "both". neither is not an option unless you're ok with winning 45% of your games. you are correct. someone can sell a eskimo ice cream in winter, it is not good salemanship but a personality to make that sale. that is why they have a something called reevaluation. to see if the trade, or sale was correct.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ May 27, 2015 -> 07:45 PM) Balta, I love you man, but this response completely missed the entire point of the part you bolded in my post. When it comes to roster moves, a GM makes his money by making predictive decisions. The reality is that every decision you make that is predictive needs to be viewed, essentially, as a probability. For example, every player in baseball, in a given season, comes with a small chance of becoming the best player in the entire league. They also come with higher likelihoods of being average or whatever, but there's no way to prognositcate what is going to happen ahead of time. It's all a deal from the deck, and the GM's job is to stack that deck in his favor as much as possible. So let's take Chris Sale, who has posted a 4.29 ERA so far. Heading into this season, we could expect that there's a tiny chance he'd bust and be the worst pitcher in the league, a larger but still small chance he'd win the CY Young, a larger chance he'd hit the DL for the whole year, a and so on with other outcomes -- but the most likely single outcome was that he'd put out a star-level season as one of the top 20 or so pitchers around. That is the outcome that Hahn expected and should be judged on putting out. Unless you think Chris Sale is a true talent 4.29 ERA pitcher and shouldn't have been considered the ace of a contender, you have to be comfortable with Hahn expecting more. Yet, here we are. Our ace has, on average, pitched like a #4 guy. That's how the cookie crumbles, though, there was ALWAYS a chance that would happen. you made an excellent post. if i remember correctly many posters had this team on or close to the 80 game win. i was over with over 90 game. even if this team goes 50% the rest of the way, it will be close to high 70's . the point is, and this is my assumption, many had higher hopes of doing better, or at least not as bad coming out of the gate.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 07:16 PM) One thing I read yesterday that was interesting, but it was Cowley so who knows if it really is true, that in 2011 KW fired Walker after Walker had to be restrained from going after him, and before Ozzie fled to Miami, KW fired him as well. JR vetoed both. interesting, any other info on why walker went after KW. wait a min. was that when KW and ozzie was having a huge argument and walker was there and went after kw.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 06:11 PM) The players have talent. They haven't played up to the talent. Most likely they will at some point. But fire, fire, fire. That's a meathead approach. that has always been the baseball way, esp if the manager is not getting it done.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 06:08 PM) The players are at fault. Firing Robin or firing Hahn isn't going to make them play better. It would be like firing the guy painting your house because you don't like what the landscaper did to your bushes. you can't fire the whole team, nor dismantle or fire sale or rebuild. and then you want to risk another season of well it is still not RV fault. come on. btw a weak analogy on the landscaper.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 05:00 PM) Well the same people who have these opinions of the players also at least thought Hahn had a spectacular offseason. . nice.... then who is at fault?? who should be blame??

this is a classic example of how things that is going wrong affects everyone and their opinions on everything.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 05:52 PM) Well then, let's look at the Sox roster with the consensus Soxtalk opinion of each player: Eaton..shouldn't be leading off. Shouldn't have received an extension. Bad Melky...one of the worst hitters in the league Abreu...a hair above average, the league caught up to him LaRoche...awful. Adam Dunn II Garcia...horrible fielder, should crash and be a negative WAR guy Alexei....old and done. Get rid of Gillaspie...Hahn made a mistake by not getting a 3B this past winter Flowers...needs to be cut immediately Micah/Sanchez.......not ready with the glove for one, not ready with the bat for the other Soto...godawful Beckham.........we know what has been said about him. Unfortunately he made the team Bonifacio.......what's his purpose Shuck........he needs to go. Sale.....what's wrong. If he isn't throwing his slider a lot he isn't an ace Samardiza......horrible. Big mistake trading for him Q...flash in the pan is lacking an out pitch Danks.......nothing needs to be written Noesi.....see above Rodon......can't throw strikes. Won't be any good unless he has a change up. Jennings......bad Putnam....flash in the pan Petricka.......OK but nothing special Carroll......DFA candidate, should be in Charlotte Duke.......should never face LH hitters Robertson.....good, but yet some have concerns So the manager has a roster where, at least if you ever read a gamethread, at least 84% of it, is just plain bad. How can losing be on the manager? i will acknowledge this, you did a lot of hard work in this. thank you. but i still have faith in this team and lets see how this list looks like at the end of the season. but for your question, these players were not all that bad coming into this season. so a rhetorical question. where did it all fall apart. if you really can't come up with a real viable, believable answer, then it is the manager, lost of faith in the manager, and the org.

QUOTE (Swingandalongonetoleft @ May 27, 2015 -> 05:44 PM) Konerko from his house in Arizona via Skype. They can roll a cart with the tv onto the field for pitching changes and disputes with officiating. innovative..... i like it.

we all should agree, this is a season, so far, as a season of miserable results and failures.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 27, 2015 -> 04:35 PM) Why is your solution to failure in a game designed for failure always to fire someone? Can't you come up with something a little more creative? oh i have to sign in and say this. b/c baseball is a team first and a money maker second, unless you are an owner. if someone is not getting results, the basic thing to do is replace that person

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ May 27, 2015 -> 04:52 PM) I agree. I don't see this move, which if made, certainly may be considered a knee jerk and panic move being done. I am sorry and concerned for the soxtalk members who are in the gloom and doom cycle and if we can start some type of mental halth counseling fundraiser for them I am on board. then i will be the first.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 27, 2015 -> 04:52 PM) The Sox are getting nothing for Brad Penny. sorry, my bad, i meant for the sox to pick up some one to replace Penny.

sell??? how bout the sox start their annual dumpster diving acquisitions. with all the players getting DFA or release. no one is going to tell me, there isn't a replacement or 2 that can help the org, esp getting rid of Penny.

some one said it, RV will not get fired. but how long will his embarrassment be of being a manager and if the team is still underachieving, how long will he take it. sometimes players looses faith in the org and in the coaches. that has been proven. for an interim i would let Joe McEwing manage and see how he does. off season. Maddux from Atl, Cora and even Dave Martinez. as possible managers candidates.