Jordan4life_2007

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 08:37 PM) This starting pitching is not special, and hasn't been for a complete season since....you guessed it, 2005. Danks is at best a #3 and you've got two #4 types in Floyd and Buehrle. And there's tons of questions surrounding Peavy.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 08:35 PM) The point is ... What the f*** does rebuild mean?? Finishing 20 under for 5 straight years instead of 10 over? We need to ride out this pitching staff and change the lineup again. "On paper" our starting pitching and bullpen is supposed to be special. Admittedly we have not seen that on a consistent basis. The Phillies would be the ideal model I'd like to adopt. Both KW and Ozzie would have to go first, though.

QUOTE (lostfan @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 08:34 PM) Uhh... not watching the game but I look at the box score and I see inside-the-park home run? To RF... geez, f***ing Quentin That box score is gay. Mauer hit a legitimate 3-run HR.

Bring on the rebuilding phase (I know it won't happen). But this is sickening.

lol@some fans being against a rebuild. You'd rather go through this crap every year? The Twins own us. It's that simple. And they're only going to get better.

Blow it up. This is pathetic. All with two f***ing outs.

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 07:37 PM) I cannot see the Sox ever bringing him into their organization after the fights he got in with their minor league affiliates. Also, unless we traded Danks, I'm sure Dodgers could get a much better package for him. I will say that the more I watch Quentin, the more I think he's finished with this organization. Hopefully some team views his '08 stats and thinks they can fix him. Now that's a guy I wouldn't have minded trading Hudson for. He's got serious 5-tool potential and is only 26, I think.

QUOTE (Jenks Heat @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 07:32 PM) MLBN was talking MVP and the guy with the Jays was in the talk with no Konerko. Konerko has as good a stats as Cabrera. PK is not going to get any love outside of Chicago and the Sox fan base.

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 07:23 PM) Probably someone awful like Carlos Beltran What do you think about Matt Kemp? Word is they're seriously thinking about dealing him.

I've been as hard on Kenny as anyone. But I'll never criticize him for the Peavy deal. So forget about Clayton Richard. Gio? I like him. But he net us Gavin Floyd. Daniel Hudson? Inexcusable. And yes, I want Ozzie gone last week.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 01:43 AM) No, those would the salary we paid Thome. He never won anything here. Please god tell me this was sarcasm?

QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 02:12 AM) Yeah but there are no guarantees. Royals, Pirates, O's, Indians, haven't they all been trying to rebuild that way? As painful as this season has been, we have what most baseball people think is potentially a great staff. We have to keep that staff intact and tinker some more and make some big time changes with the everyday lineup. You're on a roll tonight, greg. And you're right. There is no guarantee. But 8 missed Octobers in 10 years proves the way we've been doing things doesn't work, either. You named those teams. But I counter with the Reds, Rockies, Giants, Rays and Rangers. And it's not like we have to start right at the bottom. We've got some legitimate pieces. And we can spend more money than any of those other teams you named.

QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 12:27 AM) Oh wow, talk about going overboard..... Not really. It's probably not fair. But when you're already 4 games out (at the time of his first start) with less than a month to go you need the guy you're acquiring to step up and produce like right away. Manny looks washed up right now. If we lose these next two games, this will be the biggest waste of 4 million bucks in White Sox history.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 11:01 PM) I agree. Trading Danks makes no sense at all to me. I'd be A LOT more willing to trade Danks if we still had Hudson in place. Let's face it. Danks has pretty much been the same pitcher for the last three years. That's not a bad thing. But he's not elite or a "stud." I know he's still real young. But he doesn't have the stuff of a Jon Lester, Clayton Kershaw or David Price. If you could get a sick, and I mean sick, not just good, package for him, I'd do it.

QUOTE (J.Reedfan8 @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 11:36 PM) :o :o I'll add.... :o :o Greg I must say... that was an outstanding post. That's a bootleg greg. No way would he ever type that.

I think the gist of this thread is that the game has changed. Look all around baseball at the moment. At all the playoff teams or near playoff teams. Other than the Yankees, you see elite, homegrown, and more importantly, cheap and controlled talent up and down their rosters. The Rays, Rangers, Reds, Rockies head the list. And the Twins have obviously flourished at this for years. Yes, I know most of these teams sucked for years before they got to this point. But they're hear now. And it doesn't look like they're going anywhere anytime soon (especially the Rays, they're deeper than Oprah's asshole pitching wise, majors and minors). This is why guys like me, fathom, russ, I think Ace, ect, were so against the Jackson trade. It's not because we think Jackson is the second coming of Todd Ritchie. It's because it was a horrible business move. There was just no real logic behind it. Other than Cooper's insistence that he could "fix" him. But when you're already up against your financial threshold, and you already have glaring holes all over the place that need to be filled, you don't have that option. Somebody used the word "piecemeal" to describe the way the Sox run things. And that's a PERFECT way to describe it. I think that's what I mean when I say the '05 title was a fluke. Yes, we were the best team that year. But the way that team was put together was no formula for a sustained run, obviously. We added a lot of guys coming off down years or that nobody wanted and it magically came together for a year. And we've been doing that ever since with one division title to show for it the last 5 years. Unacceptable. I guess I'm one of the few fans that would welcome a "rebuilding" period (i.e. a down year or two) if that ultimately meant we were building for a sustained run of success. Finishing 2nd/3rd every year is like making out with a relative. Your ass is sitting at home watching the playoffs just like the teams that lost 95-100 games. Except they at least get a top 5 pick to work with.

QUOTE (hitlesswonder @ Sep 15, 2010 -> 12:14 AM) He can't play the field. So he's a DH and his OBP is going to be bad. Is Jeff Francouer an average major league player at DH? Not in my opinion. Average major league players are actually valuable players, so I'm not saying Viciedo is never going to be more than replacement level, or won't play in the bigs for a few years. I am saying that I expect him to be about as valuable as a Francouer that can't field. I'd be happy to be proven wrong, and maybe someone that has access to better minor league/scouting info can post and correct me if I'm wrong. But I don't think Dayan is in anyone's top 100 prospect list. I don't think he can stick at third. 1B is an option. Yeah, DH would definitely be disappointing. And he'll have to learn to take a walk every now and then. But the offensive potential is legitimate.

QUOTE (hitlesswonder @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 11:21 PM) Viciedo has no plate discipline and right now doesn't project as even an average major-league player at any point in his career. I've agreed with just about everything you've said all night until this little doozy. Where the hell did this come from?

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 09:58 PM) They deserved it. Let's go Reds! Reds/Rays would be the perfect World Series.

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 09:54 PM) Viciedo should be playing the rest of the way, same with Morel. Sale and Santos might as well get shut down the rest of the season. s***, forgot about Morel.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 09:49 PM) So we are 7 out. Time to play the younguns. lol. Like who? I'd rather they run some random fans out there then some of our pathetic minor leaguers.

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 09:47 PM) What's Rios' WARP since the ASB? I would say he's been our worst every day player, but stats probably won't say the same. Take away May, and he's been pretty ordinary. And he makes too much to be just ordinary.

QUOTE (mcgrad70 @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 09:39 PM) Exactly what Reinsdorf wants to hear you say and it's exactly why there is no sense of urgency. He can live off 2005 for the next 2005 years. It's a shame that the standards/expectations of a big market such as Chicago are so low. We're about to miss the playoffs for the 8th time in KW's 10 years here and there's not even a whisper of him possibly losing his job. Think a 2/10 ratio would fly well in NY or Boston?

QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Sep 14, 2010 -> 09:31 PM) LOL at all you "Manny sucks". Seriously, get a grip. His bat speed is that of a declining 38-year old.

Dick Allen, you were right. The Manny acquisition had disaster written all over it.