CanOfCorn

"Hostile and Offensive" shouldn't disappear because the tribe supports it. If, Rock, as you say, Native American mascots have been deemed hostile and offensive and it's time to retire them. Then it's time to retire ALL of them. Just because the tribe supports it, doesn't mean OTHER Native Americans find it hostile and offensive. Bottom line, I'm upset at both the University and the Peoria. But mostly, I'm upset with the NCAA. They have absolutely no reason to be involved in this. ZERO! Talk about the U of I needing to deal with internal problems, I think the NCAA has bigger things to think about other than school symbols/mascots/etc.

Hey, Uribe Reports to Camp.

Chose baseball because even though Umps are usually right on balls/strikes, you have to know who is calling the game before you even get out there. Does the ump call high strikes? Wide strikes? Inconsistent? That messes with your head before you even step into the box.

QUOTE(IlliniKrush @ Feb 23, 2007 -> 04:11 PM) http://www.pjstar.com/stories/022307/ILL_BCFAESNC.083.php Classic.

QUOTE(Jimbo @ Feb 23, 2007 -> 09:48 AM) Jail Shortest...thread...ever.

Now is not the time to dump Jamar. Now is the time to make sure he is ok. Make sure he understands the consequences of his actions. Make sure that, even though he effed up and effed up bad, he still has a support group around him. You turn your back on him now, and there's no telling what he might do. I do agree, however, he shouldn't have been on the bench. After you've all nailed him to the cross, has anyone thought about Jamar? Maybe he's realized what he's done and struggling with it. How would any of you like it if you screwed up and your entire support system turned its back on you? I'm not saying he shouldn't be kicked off the team. Or kicked out of school. I'm saying, NOT NOW! We aren't talking about a 29 year old who should know better. We're talking about a 19 year old that should know better but is still young and is going to make some horrible decisions. He should stand up to it like a man, but help him find his way.

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 06:23 PM) The Native American students at the U of I have been offended by the Chief for a very long while. Isn't that enough for the white guys who think the Chief is "cool" to say maybe this "tradition" needs to go away? I was there when it started and there was a Native American woman championing the cause, I think her name was Tilton, but she was helped by a white male. The same one who went after Niles West in the late 80s. Just FYI.

QUOTE(AddisonStSox @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 06:04 PM) Hoy-oh All kidding aside, I have enjoyed and appreciated your thoughts on this matter, Corn. I think both you and doc have represented the alumni population very well. I've said my piece on this matter and I look forward to enjoying a most-promising football campaign with you. It was a great ride while it lasted. I will always have the memories of the Chief dancing (literally) in my head. I'm saddened for future generations, but will move forward with whatever symbol they choose. Let's hope the Zooker can get this program turned around. I gotta get back to a game one of these years. Oskee-wow-wow!

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 04:32 PM) What type of contract would you give Jermaine Dye. A 3 year deal? A 4 year deal? And what do you think is fair money wise, when he talks about market value? And yes I would go all out to sign Ichiro if he became a Free Agent, and when you think about it, how many big market teams will be after him? Yankees - Already have Damon as their leadoff man. Mets - Already have Reyes as their leadoff man. Red Sox - Probably would be the main competition, especially if Coco Crisp struggles again. Dodgers - Have Pierre and Furcal. Giants - A team I'd be wary of, especially with dumping Bonds's contract if he retires after 07. Angels - Just signed Matthews Jr. to a big contract, so probably not. Rangers - Probably would chase him as well I'd imagine. So we'd be in with a decent shot I'd say. I think you are right on about the Giants. With the large Japanese population there and all. I would think the White Sox would be two or three on the list, but you forgot one place...the North Side. Jacque Jones is all but gone and they could use Ichiro as their leadoff and bump Soriano down to a run-producing spot. I don't knwo if they will spend the money again next off-season, but ya never know.

QUOTE(AddisonStSox @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 05:59 PM) "chief" BOOOOO!!!!

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 05:42 PM) Duh, less than 1 percent of all students at U of I are native american, its simple numbers game. Of course the only people's opinions that matter in this issue are the Peoria Tribe, which makes the numbers of people on both sides pretty moot. FWIW, i see alot of people trying to attack FSU as their only fram of reference. There are plenty of other schools that have kept their name the same way that FSU has and the opposite of what U of I did. The following teams face the NCAA ban: Alcorn State University, Bradley University, Chowan College (Braves); Central Michigan University (Chippewas); University of Utah (Utes); Carthage College (Redmen); University of Illinois-Champaign (Illini); Mississippi College (Choctaws); University of North Dakota (Fighting Sioux) Southeastern Oklahoma State University (Savages); Catawba College, Midwestern State University, Indiana University-Pennsylvania, Arkansas State University, University of Louisiana-Monroe; McMurry University, Newberry College (Indians); Bradley is off the list...but still under the NCAA watch. CMU, Utah and FSU I think are the only three that are allowed to keep the name and UND is suing to keep theirs. Since I don't know...are there still groups fighting to dump ALL of those names? For instance, are the outside people that were fighting against Chief Illiniwek now going after Utah, FSU and CMU? Cuz if not, they are hypocrites. My point is, I don't care if they have an agreement or not. This is the way the world works now, and it sucks, but if even ONE Native American is offended by ANY of the above examples, they ALL should be done away with. Man, it really pains me to say that, but that's the direction things seem to be going. So, either get out of the way and allow the University to choose their own symbol, mascot, traditions, etc. OR deem them all equally offensive and do away with them all. And if the NCAA is going to do the latter and get in any University's business, than they should be held to the same standards when dealing with things like recruiting infractions, etc.

QUOTE(Controlled Chaos @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 03:53 PM) I was thinking of a game with a group of adults. It used to be we'd have some friends over and getting a little f***ed up was enough. Apparently, the wives/girlfriends would like a little more substance to our get togethers. So I was just looking for something fun. We have played "scene it" before, but the girls don't have a chance against the guys in that. In fact, nobody has a chance against me in that game, yeah I'm callin you out!!! YER GOIN' DOWN!!!!

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 04:55 PM) Well, the FSU Chief was given to FSU by permission from the tribe, they also have had first hand experience in creating it and okaying all actions that the Chief performs. They also create the outfit of the Chief. illniwek was wearing the outfit of a rival tribe doing a boyscout dance with no permission from the tribe. The native americans see that as dishonoring their name and figurehead. SO I would say yes, the Illniwek is more wrong. Are they all wrong? Yes. Should all school be forces to change their mascots and names if they are native american based? yes. But in this case, no other teams matter, because the decendants of the "Chiefs" namesake dont want it, so you cant have it. Outside of people who go to illinois, does anyone else think the Chief's "dance" is cool? Im just wondering about the basis of claiming its one of the "coolest things in collegiate athletics." (not trying to stir you Illini up, just want outside opinions) I liken it to script Ohio that the buckeyes do before games, and im pretty sure not many people outside of OSU fans think thats really cool. That is definitely a great tradition. Especially when they have special guests dot the "i." There are great traditions everywhere. I remember talking to people from other colleges at U of I games saying how cool the Chief was. And there was never booing coming from the opponents section, at least not that I ever heard, during halftime. I guess my problem isn't really with the Native Americans or anyone who opposed it, it's with the NCAA...Greg Couch said it best today: Just be consistent.

Rummikub...Monopoly...Scene It! (Undefeated, by the way). Just don't EVER play Battle of the Sexes...that is, if you ever want to get laid again.

QUOTE(BigSqwert @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 03:13 PM) In 1850 slavery had been around forever. Did that make it ok? Are you really comparing this to slavery? C'mon.... So, is Florida State or Utah any less racist? Just because they have an agreement with the tribe? Any more honorable? If the NCAA is going to blast one school because it's racist, then all of them should be, no matter what the agreement is. Do you guys agree?

QUOTE(BigSqwert @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 02:36 PM) Vazquez will never be the dominant guy that our coaching staff thinks he can become. He's been around for a while and every team that he pitches for thinks that he'll come around. Ultimately they get fed up with his inability to reach his potential and ship him to the next sucker willing to try and fix him. Don't need dominant. Garland isn't dominant and he has back-to-back 18 win seasons. Innings eaters are what we need. And if Vaz can get through the order for the third time without screwing the pooch, he will be a success and may even be extended. I'm not going to say Buehrle is gone for sure yet until I see (1) how good of a year he has and (2) how good of a year Danks has at AAA.

QUOTE(gar102 @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 11:47 AM) ''I've played through injuries, family issues with my dad or whatever, and I've been through stuff that something like this won't bother me. I've already made enough money to take care of my family.'' Finally, a player that is honest! I agree, he is classy and should end his career here. Dear Latrell Spreewell...

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 07:41 AM) I think Santo belongs based on the numbers he produced in the era he played. I think that's always the debate. Are players judged against ALL other players at their position or by peers? Tough call, but if McGriff can get in, then Santo should.

QUOTE(bmags @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 12:37 PM) well i guess i'm not that suprised. the blue collar comedy tour sells out I can hear the programming meeting now (insert Wayne's World flashback noise....NOW!): "Remember when Tucker Carlson got his butt whupped on national television by that ultra-left 'comedian' Jon Stewart? Let's get him back." "I'm listening." "Mock the mocker!" "I love it! Git 'er done!"

My favorite story was going with a group of people to the Cork and Kerry, none of us are Irish, by the way...and we went with a friend of my wife. Who, just happened to have played basketball at Rice and then in Europe. So, we are in the Cork and Kerry with a 6' 6" black guy. The ONLY black guy in the bar and pretty much the only one we saw while we were down there. The joke was, when any of us went to the bathroom, we had to slam our thumbs in the door...that way, we will all stick out like sore thumbs. But it was a blast and I'm sad I'll miss it again this year. Whoever the aldermen are for those Wards need to make the Monday after a city-wide holiday...just for recovery's sake.

QUOTE(Pauly8509CWS @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 01:28 PM) For the rest of you guys that go here, watch it again, I've been here for less than a year, but I got chills every halftime. Because that means, when the Chief is out there, the people you sing the Alma Mater with are basically like your family. You are one with them, You are the Illini Nation. I got a bit choked up yesterday, being on the floor for the last Chief performance, and you know what, I get choked up watching it. I grew up watching Illinois sports, and I came here excited to know that we had one of the most storied half times of all time, and now it's being taken away from us. Oh well, all I can say to the people who claim to be offended by Chief, get off your soap box. To those that are here and understand, don't let anyone forget that we at the University of Illinois, were robbed of one of the coolest things in collegiate athletics. Thanks for posting that.

Do they have a "Flavor Saver" division?

QUOTE(daa84 @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 10:06 AM) That said, I do think it was excessive for those who were balling at the game last night. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that the Chief should or shouldn't go, I just think that some people have the right to be upset over this, and that others on this board have no reason to tell them otherwise Have you ever been to a White Sox game that ended in an historic fashion? Or, maybe a clinching game to get to the World Series? Emotions sometimes get the best of you. Sometimes at a sports event. I still tear up when I see the 1980 US Men's Hockey team beat the Russians. Why? I don't know. Is it still excessive? I teared up at the end of the Bears-Saints game. It happens and it's not excessive.

QUOTE(whitesoxfan101 @ Feb 22, 2007 -> 12:01 AM) Now since I never have or will go to U of I, I won't fully understand. But having been to over a dozen football and basketball games in Chambana, having family that went to school down there, and knowing people now down there....I never have or will get the Chief thing. All those people crying and such tonight....get over it and remember it's just a student in a costume dancing around. Cry over what the Indian race in this nation has become. I'm glad the Chief sillyness is over, although I would hope "fighting illini" doesn't go away. If they get rid of that, might as well change the name of the state. Please...despite what AddisonSt said...which is right on, by the way, and thank you for that...don't tell someone to "get over it" right after you say, "I never have or will get the Chief thing." That's just wrong. You've made your point. The Chief is gone. And many of us, who grew up with the Chief (both my parents went there) and then got to enjoy the Chief for themselves...it is sad.

Pods is not a no-tool player. He was injured last year. Ever try to run with a pulled muscle or a sports hernia? Ya ain't gonna be good. He gutted it out and should be commended for it. He also should have been benched, if there was a good replacement, which there wasn't. So, let him heal and let's see what kind of ballplayer he is this year.