CaliSoxFanViaSWside

QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 9, 2013 -> 06:18 PM) Yes it does. It does us little good to get to mediocre in the next few years. Huh ? Don't we have to get to mediocre before we get to good enough to compete ?

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Aug 9, 2013 -> 03:50 PM) So far we have turned Jake Peavy, Alex Rios, Jesse Crain, and Matt Thorton into Avisail Garcia, Brandon Jacobs and Oh boy, that's rough Ricky. Let's hope you know what you're doing. You left out the 2 PTBNL's . I know we all want some instant gratifcation but everyone who clamored for a rebuild should be happy. This is how it's done. Yea we didnt get a Will Myers but who got anything this year for veterans ? It's just a bad time for getting prospects . I'd call it bad timing not bad trades. W're all still living in the world of the previous years and that's not the way it is now.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 9, 2013 -> 02:48 PM) You should have kept reading. The plan should be to have a plan. I'm not sure what Hahn's is. But he's clearing money when there's a very weak FA class, which was alluded to in Jim's article you keep linking to. There are caps on the draft and international signings. There simply is nowhere to spend all this money in the immediate term. Accepting that, and looking at our available resources, it becomes clear that we do not have the talent in-house, nor the supply in the open market to drastically improve anytime soon. If you accept that, then what we should do is what the team across town is doing - converting current resources to future resources. The goal is build an organization that can challenge for championships consistently. What resources did the Cubs turn into futures resources ? Garza ? Ok The Sox got the highest upside player than anyone the Cubs got for Garza for Peavy . Soriano ? The Cubs basically pay for him to play for NY and got who back ? Maybe you're talking about the Cubs making international signings ? I'm not a Cubs expert by any means so when did they do this ? Maybe some of it before they changed the rules on that before the Sox had the financial flexibility they have now ? By paying a large some of money like the A's did on Cespedes to a guy or 2 still in the minors ? You'll have to be much more specific about that bolded term before I can give you an adequate answer. I'm still not clear what you think Hahn could've done with Rios or Peavy that didn't get done . The trade market was not giving up great prospects . Every team was either hording them or claiming no finances to take on higher salaried players. I have not once said spend the money on free agents so saying that to me makes no sense . I wasn't alluding to the article itself but also all the comments . I just think you have the minority opinion. That doesn't make it wrong . Just because you don't see a plan doesn't mean there isn't one. I mentioned trades and there will continue to be international signees available 23 or over that arent subject to the draft and I also mentioned upgrading scouting throughout the world. Steve Stone is saying he thinks it's the best trade the Sox could have got. Again what good does it do to keep Rios so we could watch him decline and be worth even less while paying him more of his salary ? I see a plan. We have starting pitching . What we didn't have is financial flexibility ,near ML ready talent ,defense and hitting. Seems like a lot to spend money on to me It's just going to be a tougher road to hoe for the Sox than it is for the Cubs because its a different climate now than it was even a year or 2 ago. The worst thing you can say is that the rebuild could've started a year or 2 ago. Now we have the financial flexibilty ,a few more ML ready talents that have focused on hitting and defense. We spend a few million on Micker Zapata. We'll have a top draft pick just like the Cubs have had for a few years and maybe get one next year also. That seems like the start of a plan to me.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 9, 2013 -> 01:37 PM) Suddenly a super sub is a quality return...c'mon, stop forcing bs down our throats. I'd really like to know what you think the plan should be . Not happy with the return for Rios and you say we already have a good fielding SS . So we're supposed to keep the old expensive guys for what reason exactly ? I've read a lot of informed fans opinions on here and SSS and the consensus here varied a bit from the consensus there about what we should get for Rios. Perhaps you should read this and the comments section .http://www.southsidesox.com/2013/8/9/4604770/alex-rios-white-sox-rangers-waiver-trade-rumors . Most there thought Rios for the cash was good. One guy got most of the heat for saying Sox should get something and even he said a MI prospect would be good enough. There are plenty of areas for the Sox to spend including upgrading scouts in specific areas like the Pacific Rim. Scouting and development are areas we need some improvements. You're acting like everything must be accomplised all at once. A piece here a piece there , upgrade the talent in the minors and the majors. Make a trade or 2 for need . Use talent received or already on the roster for trades. It might take 2-3 years . We may be stuck being crap a while who knows . Some talent is better than no talent while also giving yourself financial flexibility to upgrade the organization as a whole. Keeping over 30's waiting for them to get injured or decline in skills on a losing team is worth nothing and accomplishes nothing.

My game threads have been good for the Sox. 4-1 record , Rios traded and Garcia brought up. And Alexei's 1st HR since 2nd day of the season !!

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 9, 2013 -> 12:16 PM) The more I look at this guy the more I like this return. It's not the #1 prospect in baseball but this kid is a legit piece that adds a lot of ability to the IF going forward.. It's exactly what I've been wanting except not established yet. I ve been advocating speed and defense for SS and CF to help the pitching staff. Luery can play both. In the off season I'd like to see if the Sox could get someone like Carlos Gomez or Ben Revere in a trade and that's still a possibility at least.

Leury Garcia (SS) Age PA H 2B HR BB SO SB AVG OBP SLG wOBA 21 416 110 12 2 22 79 31 .292 .337 .398 .329 Yet another up-the-middle talent, Garcia’s ceiling is a little below that of his fellow prospects found higher on this list. With that said, a strong showing from 2012 could help him make a legitimate push for a 25-man roster spot in 2013. Although he’s too aggressive for his own good — just 22 walks in 100 games — and has below-average power potential, Garcia hit .292 at Double-A in 2012 as a 21-year-old. He then got the rare opportunity as a prospect to play regularly in the veteran-laden Dominican Winter League and showed the ability to handle both shortstop and center field. A contact I spoke with said Garcia could potential give big league manager Ron Washington a lot of options. “He’s taken a big jump in winter ball….,” the source told me. “There aren’t a lot of guys that can play both shortstop and center field. He had a tremendous offseason.” With Elvis Andrus and Jurickson Profar ahead of him, Garcia has moved around the field a bit and can also play second base and third base. The contact I spoke with called him a legitimate shortstop who has the ability to play regularly with plus speed at the big league level. The feeling is he’s underrated because the organization has been aggressive with his development. “He’s always played a level above where, perhaps, he should have.” If Garcia doesn’t break camp with the Rangers, he should head to Triple-A where he’ll continue to polish his defensive repertoire while also learning to become more patient at the plate. This is from Fangraphs from Feb 2013 Rated #15 Rangers prospect at that time. Olt was #2 Leonys Martin #4 . The guy I was hoping for ,Sardinas ,was #5 .http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/texas-rangers-top-15-prospects-2012-13/

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 9, 2013 -> 11:56 AM) I was one guy who wanted to get something solid back for Rios, and I'll take Leonys as a decent return. It fills a need, has some talent, and grades well on several tools. He also makes the roster work a lot better if Semien makes the big leagues next year. Leury , you're thinking of Leonys Martin the Rangers CF .

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Aug 9, 2013 -> 11:44 AM) Reallllllly? Why would the team's performance have anything to do with it. Turning two above average to great major leaguers into essentially Avisail Garcia and cash is a poor return no matter how some homers want to spin it. That said it is far from the end of the world and can work out in our favor but that will have to wait until the offseason. Right now it's a mediocre at the very best. Some might look at it as you being the homer. You think Rios was worth more and the only scenario in him being worth more is the Sox competing in 2014 . Not real sure that was very likely .

If it ends up being Leury Garcia he's a very good fielder and speedy. Given his height and weight "Little Leury" sounds good.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Aug 9, 2013 -> 08:26 AM) Dunn has cleared waivers. Jon Heyman ‏@JonHeymanCBS 2m Adam Dunn clears waivers, eligible to be traded anywhere. he'll make nearly $20M thru '14 but is hot http://cbsprt.co/1exCcIn I know twitter has limited space but Heyman says Dunn hot since All-Star break doesn't exactly paint the clearest picture since it's actually been much longer.

Not sure how this works since it's a day/night DH. If the Sox win the 1st game is a new thread necessary for the 2nd game ? If they lose same question . Go Sox !

QUOTE (flavum @ Aug 9, 2013 -> 08:09 AM) I'm just assuming he stays. I understand why they don't just want to give him away, but if they did just shed the payroll, it wouldn't bother me. I know that's not the popular opinion, or necessarily the right thing, but I wouldn't care if they just let him go to get the money off the books and get Garcia in the lineup. It may not be the popular opinion here at Soxtalk but if you read through the lengthy comment section here http://www.southsidesox.com/2013/8/9/46047...er-trade-rumors it seems the consensus is the salary dump is the way to go.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Aug 7, 2013 -> 08:05 AM) Most of the stuff we're talking about now isn't really related to my original post about how Viciedo has been worse at the plate this year, so I don't really know what to say about that. But the line quoted above -- I absolutely agree with. The problem is that it isn't a given that he actually will learn to lay off the bad stuff. The thing about Garcia being older and more advanced than someone like Hawkins is, in fact, one of the biggest reasons I worry about his plate discipline -- because he has come much farther, and has been instructed much longer, and he still is swinging at 41% of the pitches out of the zone. When you combine that with the fact that the White Sox coaching staff (from what I glean from the media and the way most Sox hitters have acted) appears to encourage an aggressive approach, I am afraid there's a good chance, maybe even a higher than average chance, that Garcia won't actually learn to lay off said junk. Watching Viciedo make zero progress is just further reason to believe the coaching staff isn't able or willing to teach an approach that will work for Garcia. Of course, it's certainly possible that Viciedo simply isn't capable of recognizing pitches and it has nothing to do with the coaching staff. Maybe Viciedo is just obstinate and all of my impressions of the coaching staff are wrong; they are trying their best. It's also possible that Garcia will never listen to the coaching staff anyway and have a revelation and change his approach for the better on his own. Or maybe he'll just be Vladimir Guerrero. I hope one these things is the case, but there is no evidence that points to them, so it must be considered less likely that they will happen than what all of the data points to. And so I'm worried about him because it doesn't look like he's in the right environment to succeed, and that's why I didn't like the acquisition. I acknowledge he has tremendous talent and potential, but I was hoping that the Sox would address their horrid immaturity at the plate by acquiring a hitting prospect that had already shown a propensity for a more mature approach, and I thought it was a real possibility because there were some logical candidates on teams that wanted Peavy. You have certainly gone out of your way to be fair. I actually think you worry too much. Paralysis by analysis. I'm just glad the Sox got such a young guy who has already had success at the higest level no matter how brief it was. He obviously has a lot of talent. I'm not looking for reasons why he might fail. Yes ideally in a perfect world , he's not a finished product but show me more than a handful of guys at AAA who hit .375 and doesn't swing at alot of bad pitches. Then tell me you knew they were available for Peavy. In your mind you wanted more of a sure thing but it took some crazy 3 way trade just to come up with Garcia and he came from a team who needed badly to replace a guy who was going to get suspended and a team in our own division. That in itself tells me all the other guys who fit Hahns description of ML ready were not available .

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Aug 8, 2013 -> 07:35 PM) What's the love for him anyways? I know he's young, but looking at his numbers he hasn't been able to hit. I would like to stay away from defensive minded middle infielders. The Rangers community site ranks him number 7 on their list. Eh. Gallo is second and Nick Williams is third. I've always been a pitching , defense and speed proponent though I certainly know the importance of the long ball in the Cell. I want a slick SS and speedy CF to help the pitching staff as much as possible. Sardinas main problem has been staying healthy. This is a decnt fantasy write up of him . I think its accurate. http://www.faketeams.com/2013/7/1/4484048/...-versus-reality

Still might get done if the Sox get Sardinas if the Rangers envision a DP combo of Profar and Odor for the near future . Sardinas and an A pitcher Sox eat $3 mill.

Erik Johnson through six frames - 6.0 IP, 3 H, 1 ER, 2 BB, 3 K Charlotte Knights (@KnightsBaseball)

@arios51 is one of 17 players in history to have at least 500 extra-base hits and at least 200 steals through his first 10 seasons. From @mlbstatoftheday

http://trsullivan.mlblogs.com/2013/08/08/r...trade-unlikley/ The two sides had multiple discussions before the non-waiver trade deadline but could not a agree on a deal. The White Sox were asking for Pitcher Martin Perez, Pitcher Luke Jackson and Infielder Rougned Odor – the Rangers were not interested in parting with those players for Rios. Sorry Jimmy just saw you posted it already.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 8, 2013 -> 02:49 PM) Yep, he made it so clear something was up. That's why I'd be surprised if Rios is on the Sox come Saturday. If Rios is moved I'll wait til then to say I told you (and Shack) so about Rios getting moved before Dunn would in yesterdays game thread.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 8, 2013 -> 02:23 PM) Yeah I agree his numbers are inflated but I was figuring with his career numbers and his injury problems this year he might be closer to the $10 million range. I'd guess that most teams would look at him and think he's no longer a guy that should be playing every day in the field. That's how I'm looking at him. If I'm paying someone $10 mill I want him playing every day not some broken down K machine who's best days are very much behind him.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 8, 2013 -> 02:13 PM) I'll admit, us signing Granderson is like my worst fear as a Sox fan. I'll 2nd that. He's like the opposite of what the Sox really need in CF and that is a young ,fleetfooted, cost controlled guy.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Aug 8, 2013 -> 01:06 PM) I would be on board with that return to be frank. I wouldn't eat half of his contract cause at that point, I'd likely rather have Rios then whatever the club is getting in return. Since Cruz was suspended the Rangers don't have to pay his contract for those 50 games , is that correct ? If it is then the likelihood of the Sox sending any money decreases.

QUOTE (southside hitman @ Aug 8, 2013 -> 11:46 AM) Damn there goes that theory. I just saw that play where the ball goes off the wall and between his legs in RF. Gets me every time haha Also they just extended Ryan Raburn and he plays RF too.

QUOTE (southside hitman @ Aug 8, 2013 -> 11:29 AM) Cleveland? Maybe he wanted him to clear waivers. In that case, this is much ado over nothing. They did just DFA Mark Reynolds but Rios doesnt play the positions Reynolds does.