bmags

Also I think sox may do another 8-10 million per year signing if they get a starter. Jason Hammel was terrible last year, and royals are rebuilding. I wouldn't mind seeing if a trade could go down. I don't expect to give much of anything (like, jacob may) since we are essentially taking on salary of a bad player.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 8, 2017 -> 07:13 AM) The Sox turned Bobby Jenks out at the top of the list. Right?

Have to say I'm enjoying this a bit. Marlins ownership past and present howling wildly over a player that has performed to expectations in the contract that ownership created that included a no-trade clause now crying foul at how unfair the whole thing is. Unfair is if he was albert belle, totally injured but refusing to retire. Unfair is if his performance was crap. Unfair is not that he is still a great player getting paid for his performance, but you don't want to pay for it and also want the best deal for trading those services.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 04:37 PM) Except I would much rather extending him 5 years today, than worrying about trying to extend him after he has aged two more years. I don't know, kinda sounds like at that point you know you don't really want him for those years. I'd rather know. And if it turns out he is awesome 2 years from now, we still love him, then i'll eat the cost of certainty because I'm pretty confident the market will be similar. Now, if we actually get a decent trade I'm okay with it, just skeptical we get a trade for much more than that cards hypothetical proposal (flaherty/sierra). And so that's why I'm in the "whatever" camp. I'm honestly a bit tired of the hyperventilating over trading anyone we don't control for 10 years. 2 years ago so much was different. 2 years from now so much will be different.

thank god for jerry dipoto

So after all of the "sox need to trade or extend" talk, when we actually put numbers to it we are haggling over 10 million dollars 5 years from now? yeah...not too concerned about just hanging on to him. We'll be okay.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 03:50 PM) We’re talking about a top 5 pick, it’s not an either or thing that high in the draft. I would expect a plus athlete with solid baseball skills even if it’s a high school kid. Right. And I would argue again that the main problem was not the player profile tendencies of the sox from 2005-2011, it was that they were cheap. When you roll with a very cheap draft budget back then you tended to get what you deserved.

If those players aren't that athletic though we'll just end up with a bunch of corner infield types that all need to have tremendous bats to be valuable. A lot of really good baseball players are really athletic.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 02:55 PM) If he wants that 5th year guaranteed I'm pushing him downwards a little bit (5/80?) but yes I'd do it. That's the tradeoff - he can have an extra year guaranteed but we're getting a better rate out of it. If he got Encarnacion's deal of 3/$60, he'd basically get 5/$90 over the next 5 years anyway, so there's no economic reason for me to do that. I get nothing for that extra year while he gets extra security. That assumes zero growth in contracts from 2016 offseason to 2020 offseason. $20 million then is cheaper than it is now.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 04:45 PM) CF of future. No I wasn't being sarcastic, I am smart and this is still a real possibility.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 12:08 PM) I am just going to say it. This is Exhibit A in the case that messages boards do not make good General Managers. Eh, sometimes the right decision works out wrong and the wrong decision works out right.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 11:49 AM) If you own a bitcoin right now, why would you even want to spend it? You could by $12,000 worth of things yesterday, or you could $18,000 worth of things with the same bitcoin today. Oh you said the same thing.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 12:20 PM) Sure, but you could have also said that at $10, $100, $1000, $5k I don't disagree that it's a speculative bubble at all, I'm saying it's completely worthless as a currency precisely because of that. Yeah, this is my problem with it. Why on earth would you ever trade something that could be worth double the next day? Conversely why would you hold onto something that could be worthless? It's a speculative asset but it's not a currency. And that's fine. But also, the decentralized nature of the currency was supposed to make it more reliable and less prone to the whims of poor policy. Well where is that

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 12:31 PM) I'll keep saying this, but it has nothing to do with affording him and everything to do with not wanting to lock him up into his late 30s. If I can lock Jose up right now to a 4/$80M deal for his age 31 to 34 seasons I think that's makes a ton of sense for us for a variety of reasons that have been well documented. And even if a Burger or a Sheets is pushing for a spot by 2020 or 2021, Jose's contract should be perfectly moveable and might even have some surplus value left. On the flip side, if he reaches free agency at age 33 and is still productive, I have no doubt he'll get at least a four year deal. Now you're either committing big dollars to his age 33 to 36 seasons (and maybe more), relying on a young player that may or may not be ready, or be forced to to sign or trade for what is likely to be a lessor player. And this is happening right when you want to be ready to compete. I'd much rather have Abreu under control (without a crazy long term deal) and worry about having too many good players when that actually becomes an issue. I'm not so sure anymore. Look at Encarnacion. He was a better hitter turning the same age as Abreu would be. 3 for 60, team option for 4th. So we are haggling over the potential of a 5th year worth probably 20 million. So we are either maybe paying abreu 20 million in 2022 or paying some other similar player at that time. The situation really won't be that bad. I'm much more worried about not having a bullpen when we get competitive than not finding a good 1b.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 12:09 PM) We should be able to afford it but is that a game you really want to play? If we don't have an experienced backup and we make a strong bid for Abreu and someone outbids us...suddenly we are trying to win the world series with a scrap heap 1b. Saying "Oh we can extend this guy in 2 years" is, especially for Abreu, a low reward, high risk move. If we wait, are we going to either save money or somehow find better production? There's a good chance we can keep him and keep his production, but if he walks, it would dramatically damage what should be the top team in the league for 2020. If he won't extend now, then he's telling you he wants to play the FA market and him walking is a real risk. Give him a fair offer and find out. If he's insistent that he's going to play the FA market, that's his right, but we should assume there's a real chance of us trying to replace our cleanup hitter rather than trying to build a title contender. I will be shocked if there is not an available 30+ year old slugging player that can only play 1b in 2020. This, to me, is really not that risky.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 11:44 AM) I agree with all of this. Everyone should their chance to tell their story. however, it appears that once allegations are leveled there is pressure for them to resign without them being able to defend themselves. No doubt that many of them should resign if they are true and many seem to be admitting it. If this is the case the should be forced to resign and prosecuted. However, they should also be afforded the chance to defend themselves and shouldn't be forced to resign, if they deny the allegations and want to fight it. I understand what you are saying but I do think it will be case by case. I was out on Franken right away because his response was such a tell and so typical of other cases where "the other shoe drops".

Gonna be honest, I don't see the FA market for 33 year old right handed sluggers being unaffordable in two years especially with where the sox will likely be at payroll.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 11:31 AM) But is it worthy of destroying his career and any good he may have done in public service if it's not worthy of a trial? How do you determine this without some sort of measure? It's a slippery slope of doing this based on allegations. He, of course will need to answer to his family. I say yes. For one, congress shouldn't be about any one person. It is a house of our government that features, yes, senators and congressmen and congresswomen, but aides and other professional staff. This is a public job and anyone shoud be able to work there without being harrassed. And any person should be able to be on a trip with those people without being harrassed. So when they behave that way, they should lose their job just like anyone at my company that would behave that way should. If there are isolated incidents its one thing, but no one in any position should get to just run roughshod over other people just because they can. The institution is more important than the person.

QUOTE (JenksIsMyHero @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 10:39 AM) Looks to me like it's Duke, Villanova and maybe Michigan State and then everyone else is just ok to bad. Nothing means anything until conference play. Although pac looks woeful this year.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Dec 6, 2017 -> 12:29 PM) The White Sox need to either extend Abreu or trade him. Holding him on his current deal while the team will be bad doesn't really make much sense. If he wants to stay forever and take a discount, then I think Hahn will be amenable. If he wants market value though, I think we see him moved. 4 year $70 million extension is the most that I'd think we see. I don't totally disagree with this but again, I think it's binary nature makes it seem like there is huge risk in just keeping him on this deal. Say Jose is still great for next two years and we look awesome. At that point we could a) resign abreu to an encarnacion like contract or b) go to market with some other DH. The true loss is just whatever prospects we don't get from a trade, and I still just don't think they are going to be anything more than depth. And also, I do put value on the next two years. Cliche, whatever, but I do think the players on the roster will benefit from Abreu on roster. I think they benefited from being moderately competitive in august onward.

Yeah TBH I think we'll handle by creating a spoilers thread and then re-merging

Right I don't think he expected the new CBA to be so hard against him but he wanted to come. I think his team would have posted him if he demanded it because I thought I heard one of the reasons he signed with them was their openness to posting him when he wished.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Dec 7, 2017 -> 06:57 AM) I hope that we keep dealing. I’m glad we got out ahead of it with dealing, problem now is multiple teams that had stocked up are now out of running with little talent to sign so we are in a more competitive marketplace.

Ron da don should take a bow

Whoa Loyola beat Florida