Dick Allen

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 6, 2015 -> 06:23 PM) What significant injuries have the White Sox had this season, compared to other division rivals (Justin Verlander, Nathan, Alex Rios/Hochevar, Swisher and Gomes, Ventura for PED's, etc.)? Last time I checked, the Rangers and Twins were both predicted to finish in last place in their respective divisions by EVERYONE. So, to summarize, you would be happy to give up your highly-compensated (with a 14 year track record) sales job to the equivalent of Robin Ventura, right? This season is 23 games old. Sale missed a start. If you are going as deep as you are, there is Nate Jones. Nick Swisher? Really? Joe Nathan?mAlex Rios? Of course you were the guy telling us Cashman screwed up trading Greene to Detroit. To summarize, jumpimg to conclusions 1/8 th of the way in will make you look real bad when it is all over.

Noah 1-14 from the line in the playoffs.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 6, 2015 -> 05:52 PM) And everyone would be willing to do that, if he had won something in 2012. Because of that collapse, and the piss poor fundamentals and lack of execution and just a plethora of mental errors from mid-September 2012 until today, what conclusion/s are to be drawn? Because we can't blame this team's poor defense and poor baserunning on Dayan Viciedo and Alejandro DeAza any longer. What's the ONE common factor during that time period? You're going to balance Ron Gardenhire's 6 AL Central Division championships in 9 years with Robin Ventura's 5 1/2 months in 2012? REALLY? You give Ron Gardenhire Byron Buxton and Miguel Sano playing up to their ability and 100% healthy, you'll have an 85+ wins Twins' team again....if not for the fact that they went after Ricky Nolasco and Erwin Santana (another board favorite last off-season). http://www.wadenapj.com/sports/3708353-do-...-problem-licked So basically, you want Robin Ventura (a manager hired with ZERO experience or credentials) to be given the same benefit of the doubt...which just doesn't make any sense. Let's say Dick Allen was Regional Salesman of the Year for 6 out of 9 years. His company then brings in someone they think COULD be better, but is totally inexperienced and never even done sales and he consequently produces results that are pedestrian at best, and which leave numerous questions in mind of any future improvement. He hasn't proven anything as of yet....how long is the company going to stay in a state of uncertainty before going back to the person with the record of performance on the back of their (sales) baseball card? I'm starting to believe you are actually Chris Rongey in disguise, lol. You have more excuses than cod liver has pills, as my now 86 year old mother would say. Whit Sox players don't play well, clearly Ventura's fault. Lack of talent , and injuries be damned. Any other manager has a team that sucks, so and so didn't play well. Why isn't Joe Mauer's drop off on Gardy? Or Choo's horribleness your pals fault? If they were White Sox you know who you would be blaming.

If it was anything serious, I doubt it would take place on the field during BP.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 6, 2015 -> 04:22 PM) Everyone in baseball other than some at SoxTalk knew the Twins were going into a long-term rebuilding process....which was exacerbated by having a turf team unprepared for outdoor style of play AND Mauer, Morneau, Santana and Liriano falling off the map production-wise. Let's add the reign of terror by Bill Smith. See below. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/820267-...erry-ryan-built Yet you seemingly have no idea the White Sox were rebuilding and pin losses on him. He took over a 79 win team that lost Buehrle, and they win 85, but the collapse. That is all on Robin......except Paulie, wrist surgery, Youk, back gives out, Sale, out of gas. If you are going to ignore losses for Gardy because of talent, to be fair, you would have to do it for Robin.

QUOTE (LDF @ May 6, 2015 -> 03:18 PM) very true, but first, it is that player, that is needed to be put on the waiver. this is a nice discussion for the "what if". but i still need to see, if that player is better than what the sox have at the present. however, dang i really hate me for this, i always have a however. but however, catching is a huge hole in the system. The problem is nobody is going to waive a good catcher, and if somehow they do, if the Sox aren't first in priority, forget it. If you look at catchers across baseball, as bad as we think Flowers is, or Soto is, there are a lot more guys like them than guys who would be upgrades. A good catcher is worth his weight in gold. That's why there is zero chance the Brewers trade Lucroy.

QUOTE (Tex @ May 6, 2015 -> 03:13 PM) Walker has been gone three years and ZERO playoff appearances. With Walker World Series WIN! Is playoffs and world series the best way to judge the effectiveness of an individual coach? I do think something was learned. If this offense had been hitting like this under Walker, the fire him, bad at his job...threads and posts would have been too many to count. There really is nothing out there calling for Steverson's head.

QUOTE (LDF @ May 6, 2015 -> 03:07 PM) with the roster at 39, what i think is, if a player who is put on the waivers list is better than anything that is on the roster or in the system, and that is a need, the sox will pick him up. I don't think position matters as much as a scouting report. There are still several things they can do to make room on the 40 if needed.

QUOTE (BigHurt3515 @ May 6, 2015 -> 02:36 PM) Looks like we are wearing the same jerseys tonight. Good move! Wear them until it doesn't work. And get some gray ones. They need some help on the road. I never liked those uniforms. I always thought they looked like space suits. For some reason, I think they look better on fans in the stands.

QUOTE (Jake @ May 6, 2015 -> 03:00 PM) Unless you think he should have foreseen Peavy's arm injury, that was a great deal -- the only thing we lost was money. Woe be to us that we lost Clayton Richard and Aaron Poreda! And he eventually turned into Avi, Montas and Rondon. I don't know how that set the organization back.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 6, 2015 -> 02:20 PM) Who in the AL Central would you rather have been a fan of the last 9 years? The post I was responding to mentioned decade. I have always thought that to be 10 years. You can cherry pick 9 years, but I'll take the title 10 years ago over 4 or 5 playoff flameouts any day of the week.

QUOTE (Soxfest @ May 6, 2015 -> 02:21 PM) I saw Cody Ross got DFA again. Not just DFA'd, but released. He is really bad right now. Doesn't get on base, and zero power. It sounds familiar.

QUOTE (flavum @ May 6, 2015 -> 02:15 PM) "Could be worse" doesn't excuse the Sox overall performance over the last decade. Who in the AL Central would you rather have been a fan of the last 10 years? Only one has won a title. I agree, they should have been better. But it certainly hasn't been paper bag over your head bad.

QUOTE (Soxfest @ May 6, 2015 -> 02:05 PM) What I learned most from Greg Walker era is JR is too loyal and keeps guys 2 to 4 years past when they should of been let go. Yeah, the offense realy took off when he finally took off. What a horrible thing, loyalty.

QUOTE (greg775 @ May 6, 2015 -> 02:06 PM) To not make the playoffs in that long a span is really embarrassing. Could be worse. The Royals didn't make if for 30 years, now they think they invented the game, after making it as a wild card.

QUOTE (flavum @ May 6, 2015 -> 01:49 PM) Side note- anything on Crain lately? No news is most likely bad news.

Hope he clears. I don't know if he's ever been outrighted, but he is a lot better insurance in Charlotte than previous seasons' versions.

QUOTE (shysocks @ May 6, 2015 -> 01:42 PM) Not "the org has a black hole," the org is a black hole. From 2012 to now the Sox are 13th in the AL in OBP. And that can be easily solved by firing the manager, and hiring a guy whose teams lost 99,96,96,92 games from 2011-2014 becoming the first Twins manager to be fired since the same season Hawk fired Tony LaRussa.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 6, 2015 -> 12:54 PM) Jay Zawaski ‏@JayZawaski670 2h2 hours ago "I think Robin is going to be here as long as he wants to be." - Steve Stone 5/6/2015 From all reports, Robin is the type of guy who if he thought they would be better off without him, would walk away. He doesn't need the money.

It's going to be a lot warmer tonight, and maybe 85 tomorrow. The homer drought will be ova.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 6, 2015 -> 09:48 AM) Obviously the point of this is to say the team isnt talented enough....therefore the coaching staff shouldnt be blamed for Corky Miller, Andy Gonzalez and Leury Garcia. Lol. Not extreme examples there. The problem is "good" or decent hitters struggling like Eaton, Ramirez, LaRoche, Cabrera (no power, low walks)....or supposedly "talented" hitters like Beckham and Viciedo. It seems you are arguing its more on the scouting and GM, correct? In other words, if you were forced to fire Hahn, Steverson or Ventura today...who would you choose to protect and why? I know you will say nobody should be responsible....that the team will improve magically over time if we are only patient and content to be non-contenders for yet one more season. Players are responsible. If you fire people to show "accountabilty" and not really address the problem, guess what? Problem not solved. You wind up going 30 years with 1 wild card appearance, you know, like your Royals. But keep on believing Geo Soto won't throw the ball into CF on a steal attempt if anyone but Robin is sitting in the dugout. The great Joe Maddon's team blew a 5,4 and 3 run lead the last 2 games alone. That has to be on him, correct? I mean he put Edwin Jackson into a tie game. He needs to be fired. Theo needs to show some accountability.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 6, 2015 -> 09:28 AM) The question is how many years without a playoff appearance when we are supposed to be the largest market team in the division with all the built-in advantages is acceptable? 10? 15? Should we just tip our caps to Illitch for spending more and having a better GM, to the Twins and to the Royals now for building much more solid foundations for sustainable success? What does Buddy Bell have to do to get fired, for example? What is he actually superior or even good at? The irony is with all the advanced statistics in the world, the subjective matter of judging coaches and front office personnel seems to be getting more and more difficult. We can quantify and assess players in a multitude of ways, why not coaches, too? So that is what we learned from Greg Walker.

QUOTE (bmags @ May 6, 2015 -> 09:00 AM) I don't understand the point of a position if there is no accountability for it. Are you likely to find an amazing hitting coach that always gets the best out of your offense for years? Maybe not. In a slumping offense is it possible a new voice can make a change? I think so. But, yes, I appreciate those peddling an orthodoxy that if someone does not control everything they control nothing and thus can never be held accountable for performance of their team. Because that's the way everything else beside baseball is run. Accountablility would be holding the people resposible accountable. Accountability should be a 2 way street. If you are going to blame someone if something doesn't go right, then you should give them credit when it does. The White Sox have fired plenty of people. The easiest, cheapest thing to do is fire someone if it truly made your 9-14 team 14-9. But, if the people on the inside, who really know what is going on, deem that not to be the case, firing them isn't showing accountability, it is naming a scapegoat. There is no way the White Sox current problems are on one guy. There is no way when Andy Gonzalez and Darin Erstad and Corky Miller are in a major league line up, that the Sox not scoring many runs is because the hitting coach is bad at his job. I wish I still had an article a friend of mine sent me a couple years ago. It was a guy who was some sort of club soccer coach. Parents would spend tons of money getting their kids the "top of the line" coach, expecting college scholarships and perhaps professional paydays. His message was, no matter how much money you spend, no matter what reputation a coach has, the overwhelming chances are your kid is average, and will never be anything more than average. Save your money. The fact is, Vince Coleman isn't going to make Adam Eaton a guy that steals 70 bases. No hitting coach is going to make Tyler Flowers a second coming of Mike Piazza. Don Cooper can't make John Danks throw 95. No one said there is no accountability, but really, from the outside, not having access to their daily interactions, any fire someone for accountability issue makes little sense.

QUOTE (Tex @ May 6, 2015 -> 08:53 AM) Dick I agree with everything you wrote, then I look at the conclusion we could make, that coaching and managing doesn't matter at all. Which doesn't have much face validity. IIRC the discussion about Walker also centered around the system's approach to hitting. How the farm system was not growing many hitters. Maybe that is an area we should look at You still need talent, and I don't know how you can pin minor league offensive failure on the major leauge hitting coach who cannot work with them. Perhaps a organizational hitting approach is needed. I don't know, everyone is different. If everyone just watched the Tom Emanski videos and did everything exactly the same, they, as a whole would probably be easy to pitch to, as their weaknesses would probably all be the same. But if you want an overall organizational philosophy, that would be up to people higher than the hitting coach. I know they mentioned something like this when the hired Steverson, but it still requires talent and execution, and of course, more importantly, better hitters. Steve Stone said on the air a couple weeks ago how he would love to be Mike Trout's hitting coach. All you have to do is shut up.

You want a good offense, you better have good hitters. If you expect a hitting coach to make mediocre or bad hitters good major league hitters at this point, there isn't a person in the world who can make that happen. Walker was the hitting coach when the team had a really good offense, and a really poor offense. He was never a genius when they were good but a fool when Andy Gonzalez couldn't hit. As I stated many times before, it wasn't like hitters leaving the White Sox went on to bigger and better offensive things. Swisher did, but he didn't work with Walker. The exact same thing is going on with Robin. The Sox are 4-12 in SB. That, is all his fault. If the were 30-30, guess who wouldn't be getting any credit? It would be a Vince Coleman lovefest. Last night, Robin sent Gillaspie on a 3-2 count with Alexei up to actually try to stay out of a DP. It is a manuever every manager uses. Of course, Alexei fans and it's a easy DP. Robin is a fool. It's a clown show on the basepaths. Coaches and managers matter, but they don't make a 90 win team a 65 win team, and dont' make a 65 win team a 90 win team.