Dick Allen

Why was Javy Vazquez's $11.5 million a year to be a 4/5 starter, "reasonable", and paying Garland to do the same thing, except win a couple more games and strikeout a bunch less, insane? I'm not a big fan of Garland, but I'd rather have him than Javy. And you can probably pay him less money.

I read something pretty interesting today, where some teams just don't know how the weakened economy will affect them, and teams with big-time players who are well-paid may have to give these players up for pennies on the dollar during the season. It would mean a couple things for the White Sox. First, if they plan on trading a guy like JD and expect to get anything for him, they probably need to do it before the season starts. Also, the good news, after 2009, they really don't have very mucthey should be able to acquire.h in guaranteed money on their books. They may be in a position to acquire one or two or a few of these players.

Why do I think the White Sox will sign Mark Mulder to a no risk contract? Why do I also think if they do, there will be countless posts how Cooper will have him pitching like he did in his prime?

QUOTE (DBAHO @ Dec 18, 2008 -> 09:57 AM) Hmmm; Its weird in a market where Kyle Farnsworth can get get $4.6 million a year for 2 years, Cabrera may wind up with far less of a guarantee. For all his faults, the guy still is a pretty good player.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 16, 2008 -> 01:43 PM) http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-1...0,2965427.story Even the Cubs have a lot of concerns about advertising revenue going forward...so you know it has to be a concern to almost every MLB franchise, with the probably exception of the Yankees, Mets and Red Sox. Even the Dodgers are getting a little "cost conscious" (letting Furcal go, and it's natural with those contracts for A. Jones, Pierre, Schmidt, etc.) It will also be interesting to see if it's the Angels or Red Sox winning the bidding for TEX. The Yankees are going crazy though...Kei Igawa's deal was $46 million if you include the outrageous "posting" fee. I guess shedding Abreu, Giambi, Mussina and possibly Pettitte, they feel they can afford to take on that extra payroll. Last I checked none of these teams have lopped off as much payroll as the White Sox and say they are right up against their budget limit if not over, (not that I'm totally buying it). None also don't have the money coming off the books like the White Sox do the next year or 2, although the Yankees did have $85 million come off this year. KW liked to use Viciedo's signing bonus as Swisher's money so he will be $4 million cheaper in 2010. Dye, Contreras, Thome and Dotel will be off the books, with Konerko gone the following year. The other teams you have mentioned would have a much harder time getting to a Marlins-like payroll if it were necessary than the White Sox. Theorically, the White Sox could have a sub $50 million payroll in 2010.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Dec 15, 2008 -> 11:28 AM) When you go 0-6 with an ERA close to 8 there's lots of things you can find that don't look good. Mechanics are easily correctable. As long as his stuff is still there he's a legitimate prospect. Mechanics are not easily correctable. If they were, every pitcher would have flawless mechanics.

QUOTE (sayitaintso @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 02:29 PM) If miller does get the back up job, i am going to pull out my hair trying to watch him get a hit. Since the beginning of the 2004 season, Corky is sporting an .092 average on the big league level, including being 1 for 55 between 2004-2006. It he was the only back up, AJP would wind up playing a lot of games when he was supposed to have the day off.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 02:35 PM) Supposedly Fields had a bad leg or maybe even knee problem IIRC. I understand he was hurt, but why if he was a banged up as KW said, did they call him up? Why not get him fixed right away?

QUOTE (ChiSox420* @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 02:18 PM) I agree, with possible upcoming contract neg with Danks, Floyd, TCQ, Lexi, Beckham(Some sort of Longoria deal)... KW may just be making sure the economy can be a factor in all of these He has Dye $11.5 million, Thome $13 million and Contreras $10 million coming off the current books after 2009. Konerko's $12 million comes off after 2010. Crying poor is poor. There's plenty of room for the others. Danks and Floyd will cost a few more dollars in the next couple years, ans will Quentin. Ramirez is locked up cheaply for 3 more seasons, and Beckham is years away from arbitration. Maybe their suite sales are taking a huge hit.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 02:10 PM) So then what do you propose? Garcia? Colon? Lieber? Randy Wolf for 3 years? Capuano? Pedro? With a budget that limited it is hard to get a good SP that you can feel confident in. Of our in-house candidates, Richard couldn't get past the third time through the opposing lineup which leads me to believe he's best off in relief. Poreda still doesn't have the secondary stuff to start, and would you actually want to risk "rushing" him and ruining his confidence and setting his development back? Then there's Marquez, who the Sox seem high on, yet is coming off a horrid year and needs much work. He couldn't get the job done in Triple A and IMO he needs to show that he can before he can be a legitimate candidate. And speaking of not getting in done in Triple A, there's also Broadway who flat out sucks. Then there's Egbert, and he's IMO the second best option of the group behind Richard because he's ready and it he fails, he's not a guy we're going to really worry about screwing up with. Daniel Cabrera at least has MLB experience and has the type of stuff that, even if he fails as a starter, could lead to success out of the bullpen. Players who get non-tendered aren't All-Stars obviously, but since we're already over budget, aside from laying out trade scenarios of which high-quality SP prospects we may be able to acquire for our veterans or prospects, this is what we have to work with. I wouldn't give Wolf 3 years, but the others, except for maybe Pedro, could be had just as cheaply as Cabrera and give you a better chance to win. Cabrera in the bullpen won't work. The guy can't throw strikes. See MacDougal, Mike. See Sisco, Andy. Cabrera also had back and elbow problems last season. He's a 60 day DL stint waiting to happen.

QUOTE (fathom @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 02:00 PM) That would be a waste of 10 million dollars. Daniel Cabrera is terrible, and he's a huge injury risk! I also question Cabrera's "stuff." It seems to be fading. For a guy who supposedly is pretty unhittable, he sure does give up a lot of hits to go along with the ton of walks and HBP he allows. His K rate has been in freefall as well. He walks and hits more guys than he fans now. I think if someone got him to change his ways 3 years ago, he may have amounted to someone useful, but its past the point of no return. I know this stat means zero, but it is funny. He has 14 ABs in the major leagues. He struck out every time.

QUOTE (Tony82087 @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 01:56 PM) Henry Blanco should have been signed yesterday, but I digress. I agree, but apparently KW can't afford him. He's already over budget. It must have dropped because when he traded Javy, he said he was right at it.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 09:56 AM) But most of MacDougal's success was as a reliever, not as a starter. Second, being named an All-Star as a Royal is about as significant over the last decade as being named to the Big 12 Honorable Mention All-Offense list. That list over the last ten or so years includes the unforgettable Ken Harvey, Mark Redman, Dean Palmer and Jose Rosado. He made the AS team in 2003 and at the break had 24 saves and a 2.59 ERA. It wasn't like Steve Swisher making the team. MacDougal also had a pretty decent year in 2005 and was pretty decent in 2006 when the Sox acquired him. His big problem then was injury risk or he might not have been available. Now its throwing strikes. Years with Cooper haven't helped him.

QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 12:06 AM) "...the 19-year-old now plans to start up his conditioning program in Florida with teammate and Cuban countryman Alexei Ramirez." He'll lose more than 10 pounds... He's 6'1" 246 lbs. A scout said he lost 15 lbs. for his workout. Its something that will have to be monitored. 19 years old, going from Cuba to the USA with a lot of money isn't the easiest way to lose weight.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 09:05 AM) Cabrera has much more of a major league track record (not great, albeit) than putting him in the same area code of conversation with J. Sisco. He's thrown at least a one hitter and has shown the ability to dominate at times. Sisco showed that for BRIEF flashes during his rookie season in KC. And I wouldn't be surprised at all if they tried MacDougal as a starter again...although I'm sure he and his agent might balk at the idea, due to his injury history. Just because we can name two former Royals prospects who failed doesn't mean much to me. JP Howell looked like he couldn't get a high school line-up out when he was unceremoniously dumped by the Royals, but he's become a great find for the Rays. Sometimes a change of scenery can work wonders. Even with the second tier pitchers (Wolf, Perez, Penny, Garland, etc.) you're not getting anything resembling 100% certainty....except you're paying $10-13 million a season for the priviledge of biting your fingernails...instead of $4-6 million. And I know you're not proposing we go out and sign Lowe to a 4-5 year deal. You can put him in the same area code as MacDougal who actually has had a lot more success on the major league level. In fact, MacDougal was on an all star team. Also keep in mind, not only has Cabrera been pretty much a disaster his major league career, he also has injury issues. Maybe there is a chance the White Sox sign him and he becomes the star a lot of people thought he would be 5 years ago. I think the chances are very remote. I don't see how the White Sox are going to get a guy who cannot throw enough strikes, to do just that.

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 06:04 AM) Cabrera has NASTY stuff... i know he has a track record of being wild and he has underachieved. But man i would give him a chance to make our rotation any day of the week! It could be another Jose Contreras type thing- a guy with nasty stuff in the need of a new home. Its definitley worth a solid look at. So does Mike MacDougal. So did Andy Sisco. He would be a waste of money.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 08:35 AM) Aaron Miles isn't going to be coming back to Chicago, although the symmetry would be interesting with Uribe finally leaving after five seasons. He's very blahhhh/mehhhh defensively, and we already have Betemit and Lillibridge who are much more versatile. Lillibridge, in particular, has the combination of youth, speed and athleticism that KW craves. I guess there are SOME Miles Fanboys/Fangirls from back in the day that would love to bring Miles and Rowand back, but it's not going to happen (note, I didn't say NEVER, just highly unlikely!) I don't think Miles is a target or should be, but if these other guys are more versatile, it would be an upset. Miles played 2b,ss,3b,lf,rf,cf and p last season.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 13, 2008 -> 07:24 AM) The more quality arms (like John Van Beschoten, Cabrera and Ledezma) that we throw into the 4th/5th starter mix, the better off we'll be obviously. You're kidding, right? Why would the Sox be better throwing resources at garbage? Van Beschoten is 28 and has a career ERA over 9.00. Teams don't want him to pitch anymore. Cabrera never had an ERA at or below league average. Ledezma has never thrown more tha 85 innings at the big league level. KW already tried signing a bunch of garbage and having them compete in spring training for a job. That was the 2006 bullpen. We know how that turned out. In fact, it turned out so horribly, KW had to go get Mike MacDougal and sign him to an extension. Might as well throw him into the mix.

I was watching something yesterday, the Yankees signed those 2 but how much have they improved their staff? Mussina won 20 last year. Maybe CC wins 20, but then its a push. Burnett gets hurt all the time, if Petitte doesn't come back, I don't think they are any better especially with Riviera a year older. Father time has to catch up to him sooner or later.

Jayson Stark's guess at non-tenders: PITCHERS Daniel Cabrera Chad Gaudin Jimmy Gobble Brandon Backe Takashi Saito Tyler Yates Wil Ledezma HITTERS Marcus Thames Gabe Gross John Buck Jose Bautista Chris Burke Willy Taveras Jonny Gomes

QUOTE (Markbilliards @ Dec 12, 2008 -> 12:14 AM) They may not necessarily be giving up on Bailey, but instead getting the best out of a guy they don't even need. Check their rotation, it's great. Harangatang ( A great pitcher coming off a bad year) Arroyo (If they trade any pitcher it really should be him, but his 15 wins should trick the team into finding him worth keeping even though wins don't measure how good you are) Cueto (Could have higher ceiling than Bailey) Volquez (Amazing) Owings (Good pitcher, good future, great bat) They just lost their biggest bat in the lineup and they need someone to replace it. Dye would be perfect, and Bailey could be the key to get him here. Why hold onto Bailey? To form a six man rotation? If the Reds project Bailey to be as good as some people on this board do, and from what I can tell, they aren't scouts either, but seem to rip people who aren't so high on him asking for their scouting credentials, I find it hard to believe they would trade him for a 35 year old OF, fading defensively without the luxury of making him a DH and is signed for one season. That said, I would trade Dye for Bailey if they used Dye's money for a capable replacement, thus making the trade Dye for Bailey + replacement. Then at least, if Bailey is a bust, its no skin of the White Sox backs.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Dec 11, 2008 -> 03:49 PM) Ah, so now we can determine how good a top prospect in the baseball world is by the time he is 22. Dye for Bailey+ 2 other prospects is an absolute steal for the White Sox. Aren't you being hypocritical? If you can't tell a guy isn't going to live up to the hype after he's been bad, how can you tell he's a steal if he hasn't been good? Although if they spent the money saved on Abreu or Furcal I think it would be a steal as it would be those prospects for basically nothing.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Dec 11, 2008 -> 03:45 PM) Well of course "f***ing trash" is hyperbole, but Homer Bailey is not very good. It absolutely astonishes me that ANYBODY smart enough to be a White Sox fan would have positive thoughts about a potential deal like this one. Are you kidding me? This guy at one time was a top prospect, just like Joe Borchard. You have to ignore any bad he's had in his career. Trading a guy you can almost guarantee will hit 30 homers and drive in 90 runs for someone like this is a steal. Just look at KW's record. Every former top prospect bust he's acquired turns out like Gavin Floyd. They will teach him a cutter and he'll be unhittable.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 11, 2008 -> 03:37 PM) I think you can also non-tending players that are in the pre-free agent years, correct? Yes. Most if not all of the non-tenders are arb-eligible guys who are going to become more expensive than they think they are worth and cannot trade.

QUOTE (Markbilliards @ Dec 11, 2008 -> 03:18 PM) What's the difference between "non-tendering" a player and "releasing" a player I don't think the non tenders go through waivers. Its basically the same thing.