Dick Allen

QUOTE(BearSox @ Jan 18, 2008 -> 01:25 PM) For all the MacDougal haters, believe it or not, but Mac probably has the best stuff in the pen, or at least the 2nd best, depending on how Jenks is pitching. Second, if healthy, Dotel will be better then Linebrink, but right now that is a big if. 11 million over 2 years for Dotel would be quite the stupid risk to take so I'm not surprised that this is now just a rumor. If we do sign to a more realistic contract though, I'm all for this move. Stuff is nice to have, but it really means diddley if you can't throw a strike. I'm not a MacDougal hater, but if you can't throw strikes, and he couldn't in 2007, you are pretty worthless. If he can't get some sort of control to return, he can be good again. If this Dotel signing happens, it makes the bullpen a lot better. If someone from the Masset, Aardsma, MacDougal group pitches in 2008 like KW hoped they would pitch in 2007, the bullpen becomes one of the strongest in baseball, and then the Sox go from a mediocre at best team to one with a chance.

QUOTE(ptatc @ Jan 18, 2008 -> 08:11 AM) I still don't hink Ozzie will use his bullpen anymore than in past years. However, no matter which way you look at it, a good bullpen will make a good manager and a bad pen will make a bad manager. Unless Danks or Floyd suddenly show they can consistently get to the 7th inning, he's going to have to. I like this move a lot. You can never have too much pitching. KW needed to spend money on the bullpen and he did. I will congratulate him for that.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jan 16, 2008 -> 11:11 AM) Colon tore a rotator cuff partially in the 2005 playoffs. As far as I can tell, he attempted to rehab it to pitch during 2006, but was pretty much a disaster that year and wound up having the surgery. He attempted to return from the surgery in 2007, but again was no where near where he once was, his fastball wasn't there, his shoulder was still sore, and he wound up overcompensating for the sore shoulder by causing pain in his elbow it appears. Furthermore, according to the NY Daily News, he's also used Juan Gonzalez's trainer, who just happened to be caught carrying steroids through an airport (The guy said they belonged to Juan). His only positive in closing out 2007 was that he still had his right arm. And if 3-4 months have gone by and some team like the Mets, who have money and who desperately need a starting pitcher...has not yet snapped him up...that really, really ought to tell you something. And by the way, you have no idea how much fun it is using The Google to search for anything involving the 2 words "Colon Surgery" even if you stick in Bartolo. Gee, no team wanted to give the Angels a broken bat for Bobby Jenks, KW shouldn't have claimed him. There's probably very little chance Colon is the CY Young pitcher he was in 2005, but even if there's a 30% chance that he could be a decent 4th or 5th starter what is the harm in signing him if the guarantee is low?

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jan 14, 2008 -> 05:02 PM) If Colon was able to give some team Garland type numbers according to their scouts and medical people, he'd be getting $10 mil this year and probably already have signed with a team like the Mets or Braves who clearly have openings for a starter come April. Not necessarily. I would agree if he were pretty close to a lock to being able to do it, but he does have some damage. I believe in 2006 he was diagnosed with a partially torn rotator cuff, which he didn't have operated on. Its probably anyone's guess as to how he will do, but if he will sign for peanuts and play for incentives, unless his medical reports say his arm is absolutely shot, I hope the Sox sign him or someone like him. Like was posted above, the chances Contreras, Danks and Floyd all pitch well are pretty slim. Someone trying to make a comeback looking to prove himself worth big money would be a good gamble IMO if the guarantee was low.

QUOTE(Kenny Hates Prospects @ Jan 14, 2008 -> 02:41 PM) If the Sox are in serious contention without Colon then you probably wouldn't want to make significant changes as you say. If the back end of our rotation sucks, then we suck and we're going nowhere in the division. If that is the case, it is much better to go with one of Broadway/Egbert, or even Nick Masset. If we're going to suck, we should at least suck with young players who have some kind of chance to learn at the MLB level and help us in the future. Colon makes absolutely no sense for this team unless we acquire another better, more reliable SP. If we had a reliable #3 starter, like say Jon Garland for instance, we would have a solid group 1-3 with two more veterans penciled in at the bottom and our young pitchers representing depth. It's still Riske to have to rely on two of Colon/Contreras/Danks/Floyd/Egbert/Broadway turning out as solid #4 and #5 starters, especially in our division where there is minimal if any room for error, but it's a lot better than relying on three of those guys doing the job. Colon makes a ton of sense if the White Sox and their medical team determine Colon is capable of giving you Garland-like numbers for what probably would be a fraction of the cost. If he's healthy, he eats innings, something Floyd and Danks have not shown they can do yet, and if winning is the goal in 2008, that is something this team needs.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jan 14, 2008 -> 11:25 AM) And let's face it...some team is going to give Colon a lot more than $3 million a year for a 1 year deal. Maybe not. If someone wants to give him a ton guaranteed, then KW should pass. If he's willing to pitch basically for incentives, the Sox need pitching and hopefully he could come in and provide a solid #4 or #5 type of performance. Or maybe he can't help, but at least they are checking him out, I will give KW and Ozzie credit for that.

Terry Bevington and Jaime Navarro were the only 2 White Sox that I have ever totally despised. There have been lots of players I didn't think were any good and wanted traded, but they really didn't affect my blood pressure like the 2 guys mentioned. I must say I am totally shocked Juan Uribe has only 1 mention.

Giving him $10 million a year for 3 years would be an even worse contract than they gave Jaime Navarro.

QUOTE(elrockinMT @ Jan 11, 2008 -> 03:14 PM) Colon is a battler. If healthy, or at least as healthy as we can be sure of, he might be worth the chance. I still wonder about the condition of Freddie Garcia. I liked him too Garcia won't be pitching until June at the earliest. I wonder what kind of cash Colon is looking for. I'd give him a contract where he could earn a lot, but it all has to be perfomance based. If teams are questioning the condition of his arm, it may keep the guarantee in the contract he will eventually sign vvery low. As much as I've always liked Colon that would be the only thing that makes sense to me if you are considering him. It would be silly to give him $8 -9 million guaranteed.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jan 11, 2008 -> 02:33 PM) Again, no it isn't. Ozzie still uses his bullpen less than any other team in the league, regardless of whether or not his starters are good or suck, whether or not his bullpen is good or sucks, etc. Ozzie does not have a quick hook for any of his starters. He will put a guy out there for 5-6 innings and let people whack at them if he has to. The numbers say that, my eyes say that, and even the positive things we've heard about him (like how he'd let Garland work through his troubles) say the same that. Increasing the Bullpen's innings last year by 25% would still leave us in the bottom half of the league in innings pitched out of the bullpen. BS. He's not going to leave those guys out there to get killed. See Danks the second half. If that continues and Floyd can't match Garland's innings, and there's no reason to think he can at this point, the bullpen, which you correctly stated hasn't been overused the past few seasons, and still was miserable the last 2, will be overworked. And if they suck when they aren't overworked, being overworked is only going to make it uglier. They need more pitching, whether it is in the rotation or the bullpen.

The White Sox were above .500 vs. the ALC in 2007. They still came close to the worst record in baseball. Floyd and Danks taking up 40% of the rotation is going to put a lot of stress on the bullpen.

QUOTE(sircaffey @ Jan 11, 2008 -> 01:48 PM) Swisher's that bad in CF? Carl Everett part 2? And we're to believe KW hasn't talk to LAA about Konerko...? Ha. He's better in CF than Everett. Of course, I'm better in CF than Everett.

If he wanted to sign for real cheap with a lot of incentives, I'd take him. He was throwing 92-94 in September. I think his real low readings right now may be because he's not turning it loose yet. I don't necessarily think its because his arm is shot.

QUOTE(sircaffey @ Jan 6, 2008 -> 07:02 PM) Can someone point me to an example of where a player switch off a position to 1B, and performed well at 1B immediately? I know Konerko didn't. There must be some basis to your assumptions. Erstad

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Jan 6, 2008 -> 06:16 PM) Not just on this board, Sweeney has basically made the rounds of several MiLB scouting reports as being Mr. 5 o'clock, a guy who hits in BP but cant hit like that in games. I always like Sweeney's swing and his hitting approach. I think he will still end up being a nice MLB player some day if he hits like he can, if not, hes a 4th OF'er bumping around the league. You read too much Keith Law.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Jan 6, 2008 -> 06:08 PM) I didnt know Linebrink was a 27 year old middle of the order hitter that is just entering his prime and is signed until 2012? But if you would like to keep comparing this situation to something else totally irrelevant, thats cool. I wouldnt mind seeing the reactions from when Reed was traded. I know you wouldn't have seen a complaint from me. They were 2 very different situations. A team with a legit chance picking up pitching vs. a team that with the current roster is a longshot, giving up pitching. Young, cheap pitching. You can talk about the White Sox OBP all you want. The difference from the 2005 OBP and 2007 OBP for the team was .004. The 2006 team has an OBP .020 higher than the championship team. Pitching is what wins.

QUOTE(kyyle23 @ Jan 6, 2008 -> 02:43 PM) bringin the old "INAA" out of the closet. LOL. I hear that Sweeney has the livest swing in the whole wide world. Series It seems ripping Sweeney is the thing to do now. I really don't understand. The guy has a beautiful swing and has been hurt. Granted his numbers were dissappointing in 2007, but he's only 22. Josh Fields gets so much love on this board, when he was 22 he hit .250 with 16 homers in AA.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Jan 6, 2008 -> 06:04 PM) I WISH WE HAD THOSE PROSPECTS!!!!! I NEED PROSPECTS!!!!!! WHO CARES THAT WE GOT A YOUNG SLUGGER FOR THE NEXT 4 YEARS, I WANT MY DAMN PROSPECTS!!!!!! So you would have been all for trading Josh Fields in 2006 for Linebrink considering the bullpen was terrible and Fields was just a prospect.

The "rumor" is BS. Per Dave Van Dyke White Sox general manager Ken Williams spent Saturday flatly denying a fast-spreading story that Paul Konerko was being traded to the Angels for infielder Howie Kendrick and pitcher Ervin Santana. "I haven't spoken to [Angels GM] Tony Reagins or anyone with the Angels since the winter meetings [in early December]," Williams said.

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Jan 5, 2008 -> 06:50 PM) What are you talking about? That post was probably the first time I mentioned ZIPS at all. I've never mentioned one word about its credibility, just that it had a pretty optimistic prediction about a guy who was in AA last year. There was a post the other day not from you but wa stating ZIPS projections for the 2008 White Sox. It was pretty ugly. I wasn't going after you, but the board in general takes projections with a grain of salt if they are bad, but gospel if they are good.

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Jan 5, 2008 -> 06:10 PM) John Sickels and ZIPS have high opinions of Egbert, and I'm guessing KW does too. Doesn't ZIPS also have a very low opinion of the 2008 White Sox even with Swisher? Are we supposed to think they are accurate when positively predicting a White Sox player, and a bunch of crap when their projection is less than we hope? I hope some of these minor league pitchers can do something on the major league level because pitchers get hurt and some are ineffective. When the White Sox won it all, they needed 3 closers. With the price of pitching today, either KW is going for it for 1 year and then holding a massive firesale for prospects, or he thinks none of his pitchers will ever get hurt, or be ineffective, or he plans on having a few drafts of the century.

I think people will realize Crede is a little better than they think once he is gone, if he is healthy.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Jan 5, 2008 -> 01:38 AM) Hey, I don't really think the Angels are an ideal partner anymore, but any deal that involves Santana and one of Kendrick/Figgins is fine with me. I'd prefer Kendrick over Figgins because of age and the pure ability. The one key is whether Matthews JR would actually be considered a negative trade chip (from the Angels perspective) in the sense that the Angels would give up more just to be rid of Sarge Jr. Plus if the Sox dealt Konerko and got Matthews Jr, leadoff hitter (Willits or Figgins or Kendrick), Santana (or Saunders), and cash (depending on who the guys are the Sox got, they would possibly need cash) I would be happy. I know Matthews Jr. has a horrid contract and it is a major risk, but I think it would be worth it to get the extra pitcher and a legit top of the order bat. I would obviously ask for either Kendrick or Saunders (if I didn't get Kendrick than I'd take Santana, but if I didn't get Kendrick and instead got Willits I'd try to pry Saunders because he is further away from FA). Defensively I would like an outfield with Quentin/Matthews JR/Dye (in fact flip flop Dye and Quentin with Dye in LF and that is a damn good defensive outfield). Swisher at 1B and Figgins plays 2B. Again I'm not saying it happens but who knows, maybe the Sox deal Crede in the package as well to get rid of his contract. Again, without the Sox getting one of the Angels big money outfielders I don't see a deal going down. But I'd love it if a couple of those names came the Sox way that is for sure. Why would the Sox take GM Jr.'s contract? He is owed more money than Konerko.

QUOTE(Rex Kicka** @ Jan 4, 2008 -> 09:00 PM) I kinda feel bad for her. Horrible family, bad marriage, crazy divorce, bipolar. Having a psychotic break in front of the whole world? This all went from funny to just sad a long time ago. I agree. A lot of people are laughing, but this is sad. I was never a fan of hers, but watching someone's life unravel like we've been subject to is pretty hard to watch. I watched some show and the paparazzi was following her every move when she walked into a Starbucks. It would drive me crazy. She probably has more than enough money right now to live the rest of her life very comfortably. I just hope someone can get through to her so she has a life to live, and her kids have a mother who is competent. Who cares about the career.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 08:55 PM) Does he really believe that this is a championship level team? He must be drinking out of the same bottle as Isiah Thomas. KW needs to get some more pitching and he will have a decent ballclub.