Dick Allen

Also a day where Avi and Palka shined. You would have to think he would basically take one of their places.

Meek says flu like symptoms. So he doesn’t have the flu, just something similar. but it does appear they will forego the service time and call him up soon.

Yeah, if you are going to bring Fry in now, why not for Choi? Oh well, he speaks Spanish.

Isn’t 2 WAR average?

Report post Posted 9 minutes ago (edited) No it’s not. I don’t think anyone has said the rebuild is a failure fire them now. I think it is logical to think they shouldn’t be the ones ding the rebuild. It’s also logical to state most other teams if not all, would have changed regimes for such an undertaking.  JR has fired 2 GMs during his White Sox ownership for reasons given, Hahn is just as guilty. Roland Hemond was fired after 1985, a season where the Sox won 85 games, because his minor league system was beyond awful, the Sox had some injuries, and the replacements weren’t major league quality. In honor of Taylor street sox, RH checks that box. He fired Larry Himes, near the end of a rebuild after the Sox won 94 games with the lowest payroll in baseball. Many know that JR didn’t particularly care for Larry on a personal level, but the reason give was can take a team from point A to point B but not to point C. How that was determined I have no idea, but at the deadline that year, Oakland acquired Harold Baines and Willie MCGee, the Sox added Minnie Minoso, who the commissioner then blocked, and Jerry Hairston, as a Pension related favor. Neither move had Himes fingerprints on it. But if you take JR at his word with the A to B to C crap, Hahn has shown when the White Sox were “going for it”, point B wasn’t much of a problem, but point C was nowhere in sight. he is a bright guy and talks a nice game. But the fact is, it’s 2018 and there is no evidence yet any of his genius has to do with baseball.

It’s not the question of what have they done since the beginning of the rebuild. It is what have they done prior to give them a 3 or 4 or 5 or 6 year window before anyone can critique them again? What kind of teams are in a position they have to trade cheaply signed stars! The Marlins? That isn’t exactly high company. As I wrote earlier, I believe at the end of next season, we should see some maturing. If these guys already on the big league roster are still struggling to be average, it may be time to look for some new evaluators. What I don’t get is the GM , a guy who has a far greater effect overall in producing a winning team, gets a far longer rope, and much less criticism than uniformed personnel who can only work with what they are given.

That is not the question. The question is what occurred prior to Dec 2016that would suggest RH and KW are the team that should be in charge of a total rebuild, to build a team with sustainable success.

We won’t know how the rebuild is actually going for a little while. To think it’s going great right now is just as proposterous. You don’t get paid for what you do in AA. As far as Hahn, as I stated, the time to can him was before the rebuild. It isn’t like he had a year and a few Hail Marys to get this team winning. He has been part of the decision making process for well over a decade prior to the rebuild, with great early results, and not much since. I don’t always agree with balta, but I think it is hard to argue any other franchise at the point the White Sox were at when they were going to pull the plug and start over, would have brought someone else in to do the job considering the guy in place is one of the reasons they had to do it, and it wasn’t like he had assembled a team that won, won, won, and just got too old and expensive. Most teams with guys like Sale and Q and Eaton signed cheaply, try to build around them, but the Sox cubbard was so bare, due in large part to the team that is now in place, they couldn’t do it. If this rebuild works, it will all be forgotten. The White Sox rebuild got a Moncada, Kopech, Basabe, Giolito, Dunning, Lopez, Jimenez, Cease headstart on the others. No rebuild is easy. But this one should be easier than most. See it through, yes, to a point. Theo had nothing to do with where the Cubs were at when he came to them. Hahn cannot say the same when he became GM.

I normally would agree, but he does have a point. RH would have been fired by just about every other team given his team’s performance since he became a GM. Maybe not 4 times, but at least once. Considering he was part of the decision making process previous to that, it isn’t like he was put in a position of cleaning up someone else’s mess, or had no idea just how bad the mess was. That said, these prospects are anywhere near as good as they claim, he will totally redeem himself

The time to can him was before the rebuild started. So I am pretty sure, unless something happens to JR, these guys are going to see it through. I just hope that seeing it through doesn’t mean put up with several years more of this. I would think by the end of next season, a determination as to how this is going can be reasonably done. If Yoan Moncada is still an averag player, if Gio and Lopez are still questionable starters for a good team, if Eloy struggles, if Kopech looks lost, if Luis Robert continues to not play, heads should roll. Larry Himes got canned after winning 94 games with the lowest payroll in baseball. Bad performance should trump bad personality. I do think 2019 is put up or shut up time to both KW and RH. I don’t expect playoffs, but I do expect some of the guys we have been marketed to count on start playing like guys who are going to make the White Sox win. And that evaluation should go on every year until the team is where they claim they are headed.

I think at least since 2012, you have to hold them equally responsible. To say he is just KWs lackey, isn’t exactly a glowing endorsement of the man. He had opportunities to go elsewhere, but he stayed. I think he did interview with St. Louis but pulled out. He had other opportunities but declined. That doesn’t sound like a guy with all of his degrees and education, and training being a glorified coffee boy. Rick Hahn’s name is on what has been going on with this team for a long time.

I would think so, but you never know. The free fall Detroit put on last season was impressive. The Sox still have a lot of games left vs teams that have called it a season. It could get NBA bad.

There is a Howard Stern clip out ther where Howard asks Trump, Trump Jr. and Ivanka, what something like 86+17 equaled. Trump and Jr. got it wrong. Ivanka refused to answer. They are all like really smart.

Why does Ivanka now speak in a whisper?

Considering the assets they had to deal for prospects, and the state of their division, this should be a lot easier rebuild than most. I would just just like to see a little more consistency with their high end guys in the majors. Gio was great last night. Don’t look like 2016 James Shields last time out. I am not a Moncada hater in the least, but it’s time he put up a stretch of games that show why he was so highly rated. Same with Lopez. I get young guys are going to be wildly inconsistent for the most part. But these are supposed to be elite guys. Instead of calling up Eloy for “hope”; it would be nice if we could get more than a game here a game there to hang our hopes on the others.

Just look at it another way. They were close to signing Alex Gordon. I admit I liked him, but he has been awful and I am not paid 7 figures to figure this stuff out. This past offseaon they were linked to Logan Morrison. How has he PLAYED? How can anyone trust these are the guys who know which free agents to pay? They hit the jackpot in 2005 with Iguchi, Dye and AJ That was long ago. IMO, the Sox will be bucking the odds if this braintrust leads them to where we want them.

I agree. In fact, one blunder, the Jeff Keppinger signing, was actually all Hahn. KW was opposed but agreed to let it happen. Hahn has said this and called it a learning moment. There aren't 2 teams here, Hahn for the good moves, KW for the blunders. That is someone's fantasy. They are all complicit . The reality is for good or bad, this is probably the only franchise in MLB who would have given these guys this opportunity with their recent track records.

Theo and Ludnow in all probability would not have traded Eaton for 3 pitchers. It is a different rebuild. They definitely concentrated on position players. The Sox are not emphasizing that. The Cubs and Astros didn’t have anywhere near a Sale, Eaton and Q and their contracts to acquire prospects. That alone should make the Sox timeline a lot shorter than theirs.

I mentioned this exact point a while back. I have never understood how you can be confident in someone evaluating guys who are farther away from the major leagues if you have no confidence they can evaluate players currently playing in the major leagues or are very close.The other difference is both other teams concentrated on bats. These aren’t execs that just started. The patience isn’t going to be as much as it would be if they had changed regimes for the rebuild. That’s just natural. People loved Renteria last year because he wasn’t Ventura, although if the Sox played exactly the same, it would be more proof Ventura was an idiot. Louie had to leave the Bears after 9-7. It didn’t matter the next year they were worse , Lovie wasn’t coaching them. Then it didn’t matter John Fox didn’t win, Trestman wasn’t coaching. Bears fans won’t be nearly upset if they go 7-9 this year because there is a new coach. If they kept Fox and went 7-9, there would be outrage. So KW and RH, don’t have as big of honeymoon period as a new guy would. There is no guarantee here. I have read so many times when discussing individual prospects how nothing is linear, yet rebuilds are all supposed to go like the Cubs and Astros.

It’s clearly racist. The dumbest low IQ ... people are always black. His base loves it, and agrees. I do wonder who gave him his info since he doesn’t watch fake news CNN.

I don't think anyone questions whether he deserves a call up, but this is one time the White Sox can use the rules to their advantage. Not being in contention doesn't put any pressure on them to field the best team possible. In future years, other guys in Eloy's spot probably won't be held back because they will make the team better, and they will be trying to win. So get the extra year of control instead of watching him play meaningless games we have seen plenty of others look really good playing and then falling apart when they actually meant a little more. The delay isn't going to hurt him. Is Tatis Jr. going to be set back forever even if he makes a full recovery, by not playing these final months? Lebron James probably could have played in the NBA when he was a sophomore in HS. Did playing against HS guys a couple years kill him when he went to the NBA? Eloy will be fine either way. Do something for the team. He doesn't have a large body of work above A ball. It's not egregious if he doesn't get called up. With Kopech, I agree with Law as far as pitchers go. Trying to determine what they will be 7 or 8 years from now is pretty close to impossible. Call him up whenever, although we are getting to the point of innings limits, so you might as well wait until next year. If you want and need White Sox precedent, John Danks pretty much sat out September 2007, and was probably at his best in 2008.

While true, the problem is, when he holds a rally, he may be the smartest person in the room.

This is part of the problem with interpreting good ABs vs. bad ABs. Players get too selective because a 9 pitch AB that results in a strikeout is considered a better AB than swinging at the first pitch and being robbed of a double by a great defensive play. The object of being "selective" is not how many pitches you take, it's getting yourself a good pitch to hit. That can happen on pitch 1, it might take a 9 pitch AB. Letting meatballs go by isn't being a good, patient hitter. It's out dumbing yourself. Moncada was pretty selective when the Red Sox signed him, and it's one thing the Red Sox organization has harped on. But they did seem to think it was becoming a problem in the last year or so, as they were letting way too many good pitches to hit go by. They are now preaching being a little more aggressive.

Especially considering at Big 10media day he said his wif was his best friend and soul mate. That they talk about everything, and she has a good sense of people.

The consensus is Urban is done at OSU. The question is who will hire him, and does he really want to coach anymore? He already retired once. I guess he takes a year or two off and gets back into TV.