harfman77

Will the Sox offer Crede arbitration? Look what happened with Mags coming off of an injury, and when he did leave we received no compensation because he was non-tendered.

QUOTE(wilmot825 @ Jul 9, 2007 -> 01:57 AM) My honest answer would be Dye and Contreras would be the top candidates to be traded soon. But as usual I am not to quick to jump the gun because of these reasons. 1) Kenny has fooled us before 2) Those 2 guys are not the only ones leaving 3) Ozzie likes Jose too much and Jose has had his best years here 4) Javy seems to have more market value 5) Is there a better package to ship off so we receive a better product? I still am baffled that Ryan Sweeney has not been called up to the Bigs again. And heres one totally out of the donkeys ass, a return of Brian Anderson. Is it possible that the send down could have sparked something, jolted something in his baseball mind? It can't hurt to find out now before we make a run for Rowand, Hunter, or who knows It is pointless to trade Dye or Contreras as they have little value in the market right now. I think players on the move could be Thome, if he waives his NTC, Iguchi, and Garland.

If Jon doesn't come to Kenny and sign an extension tomorrow, I think he will be moved. Vazquez is signed reasonably for three more seasons, now we have MB for four, Danks for at least 5. That is a pretty good corps. I think you can sign Jason Jennings for a reasonable deal in the offseason and he is a lot like Jon in many ways, but will be cheaper after missing part of the year with an injury this season. They are close in age, throw about the same speed, both feature the sinker. Jennings has worse numbers, partly because of pitching Colorado before the humidor.

QUOTE(beck72 @ Jul 9, 2007 -> 07:01 AM) My trade suspects: Mackowiak, Contreras, Dye, Iguchi and Thornton. Mine are Garland, Vasquez, Iguchi, Jenks, and McDougal.

1. Re-sign Buerhle 2. Keep Jermaine - He has little trade value with his performance and injury, the A level compensation picks will likely net you more talent in return than a trade will at this point 3. Trade Garland to the Dodgers - A package of Hu, Meloan, and Kemp should be doable 4. Trade Javy and Thornton to the Mets for Pelfrey and Milledge, both have done nothing but hurt their trade value this season and would give the Sox some youth, plus Minaya loves Javy from their days in Montreal 5. Trade Toby Hall to the Cubs for Ronny Cedeno - Cedeno is buried and has been playing very well this season in AAA, Cubs catchers are hitting a combined .180 since the Barrett trade. 6. Trade Bobby to the Braves for Salty and Escobar. 7. Trade AJ to the Phillies for Greg Golson. 8. Trade Iguchi to the Cards for Mark Hamilton The rest of the season would look like: C Salty SP Buerhle 1B Konerko SP Contreras 2B Escobar/Richar SP Danks SS Uribe SP Floyd 3B Fields SP Pelfrey LF Dye CF Kemp RF Milledge/Sweeney DH Thome Sign Jason Jennings in the offseason and if Contreras has a decent secod half trade him in the winter, or you can use him as the closer next season.

QUOTE(elrockinMT @ Jul 6, 2007 -> 11:03 AM) Pitching is what wins games and you build your team around. If you have stars like Buerhle and Garland you keep them and add youth around the experienced winners that you have. Vazquez is another real good one, but I think it's a toss up whether he gets traded or not. The guy has so much potential and we are starting to see some real great outings from him. Ifg any pitcher gets traded I think its Contreras to the Mets. Buerhle will sign that extension and stay with the Sox. I like Dye also, but whether the Sox try and keep him is a real question. He is having a down year like so many others on this team and I think he can still hit like he did last year and in 2005. You can't say he is washed up when his numbers are really no worse than Konerko's and Thome's. I agree, but hopefully you can get come young quality arms in return for some of our guys, plus some additional positional prospects that can help you out. If you trade Javy to the Mets and get back Pelfrey, and an OF prospect it gives you an arm you can plug into the rotation now, though Pelfrey needs some tuning, plus a piece you can plug in the OF. You save a lot of money that way that you can reinvest into player development and to add veteran players in the offseason, like Jason Jennings.

QUOTE(Straycats @ Jul 6, 2007 -> 07:44 AM) The Sox locker room thinks Buehrle is close to signing a 4 yr deal from today sun-times Sox players believing the Mark Buehrle contract saga is about to end with the left-hander signing a four-year, $56 million extension -- there's a feeling in the clubhouse that the storm is about to start. The storm where all of them are on new teams?

I think at this point the Sox just need to keep the bullpen they have and let them figure everything out. Aardsma was terrific in April and then broke down, Boone is living up the hype that he came in with last season, McDougal is having a terrible year, but he has had too much success in the past to give up on him now. I think that they just need to worry about fixing what we have rather than giving up pieces in trades for relief pitching. If nothing works out you can sign some FA relievers in the offseason and make some trades then, but at this point I just keep sending them out there and let them figure it out. If we keep losing it brings us closer to Pedro Alvarez next June.

QUOTE(gosox41 @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 11:33 PM) Is it safe to assume that if the Sox don't re-sing Buehrle, they're better off looking to trade every starter except Jenks? With the money owed to some players on this team, letting Buehrle go creates a gaping hole that will cost a lot of $$$ to fill. If the Sox do keep Buehrle, I'd only trade COntreras and bult around a pretty damn good rotation. Of course knowing, KW he'll fine the middle ground. But the team has enough holes that can be filled by trading a Garland or Vazquez since they're under long term deals. Bob I hope you meant except Danks, and yes, trade them all if you can get value. Even of they do sign Buerhle I would be up for trading all three of the other starters and keep the two lefties. Garland will fetch a nice package and the Sox will not resign him once he hits free agency, he will want too much money over too many years for JR to approve the deal. Trade him now while he has value. I am concerned about trading Contreras as his value is at an all time low since he came to the Sox, but if you can get a piece or two, like what Tampa when they traded Huff, fillers that can play on the major league level, you have to do it and pocket the savings for signing bonuses in next years draft. Vazquez could probably fetch a nice package from his old buddy Omar in NY.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 01:45 PM) Agreed on Mr. Hudson, I've always been a fan. I must admit that Michael Bourn intrigues me. I don't know a ton about him but just looking at his stats, he's very interesting. Seems like he has a solid batting eye and he can definitely steal a base. Any idea how high the Phillies are on this guy? Is he a possible Rowand replacement for them? The Phillies were allegedly scouting Marks last start along with the Dodgers. I saw on foxsports yesterday where the Phillies might be offerin a package of Carrasco, Bourn/Victorino, and a B level prospect for Willis. Not sure what they would give up for Mark, but I would certainly be interested in that type of package.

It seems like they were asking about fans that were being negative toward Boone at the stadium and how he toned that out. And I agree with him, you are an idiot if you are chiding players from the stands. Umps are another story....

QUOTE(redandwhite @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 02:21 PM) I've never tried to get rises out of anyone, so given my track record that obviously what I was trying to do here. I saw a rumor in an article stating how the White Sox are thinking of trading Buehrle straight up for Matt Kemp and thought to myself, well hey, Wily Mo Pena is a better player, maybe that would work instead. So you disagree with my statement that Pena is better than anyone in the White Sox outfield at this point in time? If you don't mind me asking, whose better? I suppose you could make the argument for Jermaine Dye, but given his age and the fact that in two months he'll be gone, Wily Mo Pena is better than anybody the White Sox can throw out there. You probably better have kept that thought to yourself because it is obviously not true. Matt Kemp, at his ceiling, is being compared to Manny Ramirez. He is better than Wily Mo is right now and has a larger ceiling and a much more affordable contract. Wily Mo is a crap all or nothing hitter that we have no need for, we have more than enough already. But like I said before, if it is Ellsbury and a couple B level spects than it would make the deal a little more intriguing.

For the Red Sox to get a deal done with the White Sox it will need to include Ellsbury. Wily Mo is the type of player the Sox are trying to move away from. I would take a package of Ellsbury, Bowden and Jed Lowrie. Either that or I make the deal with the Dodgers. Matt Kemp has the highest upside of any of the players mentioned and is already contributing more than Wily Mo ever will. Although Kemp is better and has a higher ceiling than Ellsbury, we could make that deal because we are growing desparate for a lead off man. Red Sox dont need Ellsbury anymore anyway since they have Manny, JD, and will sign Ichiro in the off season.

If we get Kemp for Buerhle, trade Mark and then give him his no trade once he is a free agent at the end of the season, and give up your second round pick to re-sign him.

I think we could send a starter like Garland to LA for a package of Meloan, Kemp, and Hu.

In my opinion, I would trade anyone that I coud get good value for, everyone is on the block for the right price. At this point I would rather keep Jermaine and take the comp picks because I feel his market value isnt that high. I am all for a Marlins style blowup where we go out and start fresh with prospects and then sprinkle free agents in around them in need areas. In the mean time the money freed up can go into player development and signing picks from this years draft and especially next years.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 07:47 AM) It's a tough question, but honestly I don't know if you can. Our bullpen is so fragile right now. You lose the most stable guy in there, how are you going to replace him? One of our own, or a free agent who would be more expensive than Jenks? Unless I got wowed by an offer, Jenks should stay IMHO. I think that we should be open to trading everyone if we get the right offer. If Jenks is dealt, maybe we get his replacement back in the trade, maybe we use one of the guys who has struggled this season, and if all else fails we move a starter to the pen - I would think it would be Contreras rather than Vazquez though. But again if we are going to be in the top two of the division, it doesnt matter. We need talent everywhere, and if you can get multiple pieces for one guy, especially a guy who pitches 3-4 innings a week, you have to do it.

Maybe all these leaks are just a show. Maybe MB and KW are letting the contract at these numbers slip out because they want other teams to think that signing MB will come cheap if they trade for him. Then a team will be willing to give up a little more for MB. After the season he then chnages his mind and wants more money and signs with the Sox for a deal that has just been negotiated. Very unlikely, but that would be a pretty shrewd way of driving up the value of a rental pitcher.

The job of the GM is to put a team together that will make the playoffs, the job of the manager is to win the playoffs. Kenny has not put good enough talent that fit well together out there consistently over his tenure. I really dont like JR's thinking of always hiring from within. For instance with firing the amateur scouting director and replacing him with someone else in the same department. You need a fresh look sometimes and that is something ths Sox lack a lot of.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Jul 2, 2007 -> 12:44 PM) Michael (Dallas): Regarding the Dodgers, do you think Kemp is enough to pry Buehrle away? Is it worth if for LA? Thanks. SportsNation Buster Olney: (1:22 PM ET ) Michael: If the White Sox get Matt Kemp for Buehrle, that's a pretty good deal for a rent-a-player (for Chicago). Talked to about 10 people in the game over the last 24 hours and not one of them -- not one -- thinks the White Sox are making the right call by refusing to give Buehrle the no-trade clause. Given what the market is for pitching, four years and $56 million is an incredible bargain, and they should just give him the no-trade clause, or come up with some way around this sticking point (like guaranteeing a $5 million bonus if he's traded, or something like that). I agree with , if they dont want to give a full NTC for the entire contract - thats fine, but at least give Mark some sense of security by adding an option year at a high amount or a trade kicker that pays him a little closer to market value.

QUOTE(LVSoxFan @ Jun 29, 2007 -> 01:39 PM) Since we're on the subject, I have a 101 question. I was discussing with a friend the another night my frustration with us not being able to capitalize beyond 2005 (remember all the talk of a potential dynasty? Pfft). How is it that clubs like Boston/NYY or Minny, year after year, are always contenders? Even Detroit--unlike us--doesn't seem to be having the dropoff that we did post-WS. Is it really just that they have money (or the Twinks have a farm club)? How come we can never seem to do that? After all, in seven years we've only made it into and beyond the playoffs once. Poor scouting and player development. All of those teams spend a lot of money in developing talent. The Twins have probably the best minor league scouts in baseball, they are very good at identifying players that they think will blossom and getting them in a trade or via Rule 5. The Red Sox and Tigers spend a lot of money in the amatuer draft and spend extra money to sign amateur players. The Mets spend a lot of money on international scouting, and the Yankees spend money in every category. The White Sox are poor at all of these. The last first round pick we had to become an allstar was in 1989.

QUOTE(Steff @ Jun 29, 2007 -> 08:54 AM) There doesn't need to be. They can make him the example. It's got to start somewhere. There is, they did not allow Arod to take less money to go to the Red Sox. Its not exactly the same as ARod wanted to modify his current contract, but it is an instance of the union sticking its nose into contract negoitiations.

I still think that if there are two pitchers that get moved they will be Contreras and Garland. I dont think that Kenny can afford to ship Javy off unless he gets a Fernando Martinez type talent in return after what he had to give up to get him.

QUOTE(kevo880 @ Jun 28, 2007 -> 02:47 PM) how old is Richar? could we see him taking over ss or 2b next year? He has moved to 2b to try and hide his defensive deficiencies, and has good range for that position. I think he could end up being the Sox 2B for August on if KW can get anything in return for gooch.

QUOTE(GreenSox @ Jun 19, 2007 -> 10:18 PM) Pods gives that when he's healthy and playing well. But he's the only one on the roster who can remotely play that role, he's been injured the last 2 years, but we build zero depth there. Erstad's lousy at getting on base and has no power; but per ozzie he's a .400 quality hitter - with that sort of logic, no wonder we're 11 back. The more I think about trading for Dunn, the less I hate it, as long as we dont have to give up someone who projects on the major league roster next season. If you can sign him long term, it gives you an opening to trade Thome to a contender. If not, we get two comp picks in the deal as well, and that would give us a chance to add some prospects that may have a bigger impact on the team long term than anyone we currently have in the minors. I imagine the Red would want some OF and pitching. Brian Anderson, Jerry Owens, and a combination of two-three pitching prospects.