witesoxfan

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 05:34 PM) Would you do it with 2 strikes and 2 men on base, 1 in scoring position? Not with 2 strikes, so that much is bad.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jul 21, 2017 -> 12:00 AM) Welcome boys. If you ever have any questions I have some of the other mods/admins phone numbers. What is this, blackmail?

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jul 21, 2017 -> 08:43 AM) 21? What are you trying to point out? That he's legal at SS!

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 05:24 PM) Where do you see that? Because I see him as a 50 FV. The trade has been praised on the Marlins end by Passan and others. http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playe...amp;position=OF

QUOTE (2005thxfrthmmrs @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 04:55 PM) So David Phelps who has no closer experience got a pretty nice return for the Marlins. And yet people still want to believe Robertson has no value in the trade market and that him for Clarkin and Clippard salary would be a fair deal. Granted Robertson makes about twice the salary, but eating half of his 2018 salary shouldn't have been an issue. Brayan Hernandez was the best prospect the Marlins received for David Phelps. He is a 40 FV player. The Marlins got squadoosh for Phelps.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 04:31 PM) My only concern is that Cashman is a smart GM, and really never trades the "wrong guy" so to speak. Not saying Rutherford won't pan out, but it does give me some pause. Haven't gone back a long ways but they definitely missed on Solarte in the Headley trade.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 04:21 PM) Jason Martinez of MLB trade rumors had this to say about the trade... "Rutherford is a top 25-40 prospect in baseball. They got him for a reliever with a few very good months, a rental in Frazier and shed Robertson's entire salary. I love this deal for the Sox" That's one of the two ways to look at it. I'm perfectly happy with the deal and have no issues with it whatsoever. Frankly, the Sox are looking at 4 elite talents offensively now. It's a huge if, because prospects bust, but if those 4 guys do all pan out and hit their 90% projections, you are talking about an offense that's probably top 5 in the AL already. If a few of the other guys become OK regulars - guys on the team now, guys in the minors, guys they haven't acquired - you have a top 2 offense in the AL.

Right now, your backups at 1B are probably Saladino and Davidson. Your backups in the OF are probably Saladino and Hanson. Your backups at 2B, SS, and 3B are Saladino and Sanchez. There are enough ABs spread throughout the field that Saladino gets his AB's throughout the field and everyone else gets enough playing time otherwise.

QUOTE (Buehrlesque @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 04:12 PM) Bunting for a hit is different than sacrifice bunting. If Timmy wants to hone his ability to bunt for a hit, that's fine. But what he did yesterday was not that. But sacrificing helps you get accustomed to bunting. You have to suck at something before you can get good at it. I didn't watch the game, but judging from the reactions here, it was apparently a pretty poor attempt. Get to the point where he's making good attempts, and then he can start to bunt for hits. Also, I'm not sure how true it is of professionals, but when I was playing, when I wasn't hitting well, I'd lay down a bunt now and then. It helps keep you locked on the ball longer, allowing you more opportunities to see spin and directing the bat where it needs to go. That can be some of it too.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 03:56 PM) Cashman made it pretty clear that is not how he felt about Rutherford, although I concede it isn't customary for a FO to trash a prospect when they move him. That said, the reaction I have heard among the industry "talent evaluators" has been that the Yankees got the best of us in this trade. There has, however, been people that tend to gravitate more towards the value of prospects that think the White Sox were the clear winners. Ultimately, it doesn't matter, and we'll find out what Kahnle becomes in NY and if Rutherford ever becomes anything in Chicago. See, I think you can make arguments for either side. The White Sox were looking at a guy in Frazier who was probably going to be worth a C- prospect, and Robertson maybe a C+/B- prospect if the Sox pick up half of his salary, and combining those two might get you both of the other prospects that you'd get. I don't think you're getting Rutherford for those two combined. Meanwhile, the Sox traded Tommy Kahnle who has literally been good for half a season. Given, he has been very, very good, like among the best relievers in the game, but it's half a season regardless, and they hardly gave up anything to get him, so if his inclusion gets you an A prospect plus a B- prospect and a C prospect, then I think it's worth it. On the other hand, Robertson and Kahnle are both still very good relievers and Frazier was still putting up positive value despite barely cracking the Mendoza line. The Sox got a very talented prospect in Rutherford but he's still in low-A plus a couple of other flyer sort of prospects, so yeah, you can say the Yankees won that deal. Frankly, the Sox got a guy they coveted so it's hard for me to say they lost that deal in the short-term, but I get how you can say they didn't win the deal or they perhaps didn't maximize value.

I very strongly dislike Linkin Park to the point that I turn the radio off when a song of theirs comes on, but this is sad. This shouldn't be the way anyone goes.

QUOTE (Buehrlesque @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 03:26 PM) Wow. That Anderson bunt last night was just the worst. I hate bunting more than anything, but last night was felt even more infuriating and inexcusable than normal. It just has to stop. When the team is good, it needs to stop. Let these kids get the fundamentals of this sort of stuff down. Given Anderson's speed, he may be able to steal 5 hits a year by putting down a good bunt here and there.

QUOTE (Username @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 03:08 PM) Look, I really like Yolmer too. But his trade value isn't going to improve if he's our backup middle infield guy. What makes him hard to give up - youth and control - also give him value right now over rental players. His peak value is a glove-first 2B with some bat value. Not as a part time or utility piece. Yes, he's got some position versatility. But his bat isn't going to play up well at 3B or even a corner OF spot. Edit: he's especially redundant when we've got a potential super-utility guy in Leury, who can play basically anywhere. Now, if you're worried about Tim and want to hold onto Yolmer in case he's the better long-term option? Now I see your argument. But Leury is currently the starting CF when healthy. If the Sox have too many good players, that's a good problem to have. I don't think you need to force anyone out of the lineup at this point. If anything, Sanchez is your backup IF and you turn Saladino into the super sub. He's struggled this year, but I've always thought there was a little bit of Zobrist's game to Saladino, though I won't say Saladino will do that exactly. There is absolutely no way I'm forcing anyone out right now. If there's a good enough offer, it's fine, move them. But I don't foresee being a backup affecting Sanchez's value. If anything, he's value is barely positive right now even with a ton of service time. If he's going to build value, then it means he is hitting really well, and if he's hitting really well, Renteria is not going to keep him out of the lineup.

QUOTE (Buehrlesque @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 03:20 PM) I don't know how much of this I buy. All prospects are risky, and the so-called "safest" and most MLB-ready ones aren't available in trades anyway. Plus, several of the safe options have struggled themselves this year (Bregman, Swanson, Meadows). So there is no surefire way to combat that. The one point I will concede is that through all this trading and drafting, the Sox have obtained mostly bat-first guys with questionable defense, which is a little worrisome and does narrow their avenues to success a little. But overall, I think RH did well and didn't leave anything better on the table. That's smart though. Bat first guys with questionable defense can be fit into a lineup, especially in the AL, as long as their defense is passable. Glove first players have to develop something with the bat or they become virtually worthless. Cleuluis Rondon fits that profile for the Sox, and Bourjos proved that with the Angels. Beyond that, good defenders will separate themselves as they get holder too, and if they are good enough, teams will find room. They are early in the process yet, give it time, they'll figure it out.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 03:09 PM) I really don't think that's true. I don't believe so either. I think he was getting the best players he could. If they could have gotten Torres from the Yankees, they would have. You can always play a SS at another position.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 02:57 PM) Does he have the arm strength for 3B and even plays in the hole at SS? I know people have been concerned about that and I'm asking because I have no idea personally. As a full time guy, probably not, but as a guy who fills in here and there, I can't imagine it would be a huge issue.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 01:20 PM) EJ is a fine example. Just like EJ if Fulmer is mentally weak enough where he can't recover from his early time in the majors then he wasn't going to be successful anyways imo. I for once actually agree with fathom and just don't see the stuff there right now. Maybe it's an injury, maybe he's f'd up mechanically, I don't know but right now I don't see a legit major league starter either. And that's the thing, we probably wouldn't have seen anything resembling good stuff from Johnson in 2014 either. Don't get me wrong, I haven't seen any of Fulmer this year, so I'm not disagreeing, just that you can't write him off because he's struggled this season.

QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 01:27 PM) Well he hasn't proven the talented enough part yet. If he were a few years older he'd be on his way out like Avi. He is the short stop version of Avi. I don't know what Tim Anderson you're looking at. The one I see shows a guy who is probably a .270/.300/.425 player with 15 HR and 30 SB at his peak with good defense, which is probably a 3.0 WAR player. Dude has struggled this year, but the talent is there. He's not the first guy to ever struggle in his second year in the majors. There is, afterall, a reason that the term sophomore slump exists.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 01:22 PM) Anderson's super young from an experience stand point as well. He's struggled at every level and has managed to make an adjustment at some point. I'm of the opinion TA will be fine and it's way too early to be freaking out about him. If he looks like this and his numbers are like this by this time next year then start freaking out. I wouldn't even say next year. I'd say if there's no signs of improvement come 2019, then it's time to start worrying and trying to find alternatives. That puts him at 26 years old, so there's little room to grow beyond that point. He is going to have to start drawing a few more walks, even if he just gets it to 5-6%, and it'd be ideal if he could cut his strikeout rate down by a few points too.

QUOTE (Superstar Lamar @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 12:48 PM) I would bet Gonzalez would get that look before Holland. We are getting to the people that will only provide salary relief, which means nothing to us as fans I could see Gonzalez go too, and Shields has a reputation as a big game pitcher, though regardless of how the Sox traded him, they'd struggle to get anything of relevance.

The precipitous fall off reminds me a lot of Erik Johnson, and Erik Johnson came back the following season after his disastrous campaign and had a phenomenal year. He's obviously recovering from Tommy John still, but Johnson became a super relevant name again.

QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 12:35 PM) By age only. Well, yeah, and because he's a very talented player. They aren't going to sign a 34 year old to be the SS for a rebuilding club.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 12:22 PM) Figured these guys could use a thread for any news and rumors (whether trade or dfa lol). I was hopeful we could spin one or two of them off for something useful (lotto tickets) but have been having doubts lately. I think Holland you'll be able to do that with, at least as a 6th starter/mop up/3rd lefty out of the pen to a contender.

QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 12:24 PM) Tim Anderson post draft or Anderson right now? Post draft he'd be 9th or 10th. Tim Anderson right now would be 8-10, just as Tim Anderson post draft would be 8-10.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 20, 2017 -> 12:08 PM) https://mobile.twitter.com/-/status/8880339...%7Ctwgr%5Etweet Steve bought another billboard huh?