caulfield12

If they don’t sign Wheeler, Bumgarner, Ryu, Keuchel or even Hamels...and this is (indirectly) given as part of the excuse, that’s where a lot of posters are going to have a problem. And there’s the whole issue of (needlessly) blocking Vaughn at 1B OR him DHing and preventing Grandal from getting at-bats there to keep him as well rested as possible in the second half of seasons (especially during July/August Chicago weather.)

Why didn’t we extend the same courtesy to Mark Buehrle back in 2011-12? He and Konerko were the heart of the organization (and World Series winners) for over a decade...not just six non-winning seasons. Ozzie leaving made it easier on Jerry, somehow? Why didn’t we also stay loyal to Jim Thome in 2010...?

They were never in them to begin with...

We better never hear: 1) Extensions for Giolito, Moncada and Robert were just out of our “comfortable” price range...or that Moncada/Robert wouldn’t sign extensions despite Abreu being around 3 full seasons rather than just 1 year. 2) The reason for not signing Wheeler has anything to do with payroll obligations in 2020/21 3) Jose just can’t hit well at DH...needs to be on the field 130-140 games per season as “capitan” and designated team role model. 4) That we needed to move on from Collins and/or Vaughn because of this deal. 5) KW or Stone or Cooper mentioning limited available current/future payroll due to attendance issues If this forecasts adding the last remaining “name” Cuban player in Puig for one year/$8-12 million and a 2021 option, it’s still not worth it...

Still not enough...what would they do, trade Josh Bell to open 1B for Sheets? Walker has to put up a 800+ ops at Birmingham before his stock will rise enough for him to be a headliner.

No way they add Castellanos then...they likely add a Moustakas at DH for closer to $20-22 million over two years. Castellanos is likely to get at least 3-4 years/$45-60 million and then you’re not only committing yourself to a pretty bad defensive outfield but putting Robert’s health at risk as well.

How many times will Puig’s name come up in the next 4 months? The Cuban Connection is strong with us, Mandalorian...

Daniel Hudson's another guy who has had a really long/extended career despite having two operations. The biggest point is that even two surgeries for starting pitchers is no longer a death sentence, like it used to be a decade or so ago (I think Chris Capuano was one of the first, but he wasn't a classic stuff guy, either). But it's also a risk. The success rate is 80%ish for one surgery and closer to 60% for two, from everything available online.

Even post-game Cubs' radio call-in lunatics categorically say no, on behalf of White Sox fans. This comes from the "meathead" take of why wouldn't X/Y/Z club trade any given superstar for 5-6 prospects (even thought the prospects all suck.) Of course, in this case, you can't trade Vaughn in that type of move. It's basically crazy talk. And why you would include Rodon when his value is negative...it would be better just to release him if they don't feel his value will appreciate between now and mid-season 2021. The rest is just noise/names.

Haniger=Benintendi >>>>> Mazara Obviously, depends on the acquisition cost for those first two. Haniger has put up the really big fWAR numbers, but he's also older and could be declining due to injuries.

If they DO discard Collins, it means Moustakas to the White Sox makes a heckuva lot more sense. Wheeler, Grandal, Moustakas, band-aid RF/Gennett and another veteran RH reliever. Get 'er done!!! That still might be TOO ambitious, but definitely not out of the realm of possibility, either.

Ron LeFlore before 1981, just because of the Lavar Burton movie... https://www.blessyouboys.com/2018/2/15/17016852/detroit-tigers-history-ron-leflore-former-all-star There's a really great untold story about Torii Hunter at the beginning, never knew.

Jaime Navarro Actually, Belle, Fisk, AJ, Dye and Abreu were arguably the five best. Dunn was definitely huge, at the time. The combination...and time sequencing of Cabrera/LaRoche/Robertson, that SEEMED like a great offseason. Tom Seaver at the time was a huge name (for the White Sox), back in 1984.

That close, and they might as well break the club record for first $100+ million contract while they’re at it...plus, with the most loaded field of suitors with all the red flags on Bumgarner, Ryu, Keuchel and Hamels, that number easily ranges in the $100-115 range and possibly touches $120 million. Hopefully, nearer to $100 for future payroll’s sake, though.

Fwiw, Chris Rongey is long gone. Back in StL, not even sure he’s still in sports broadcasting at the moment. Connor McKnight kinds of grows on you with his earnest enthusiasm, he’s no Dave Wills, but decent at least. He at respects callers, for the most part.

Only if I teach 30+ hours per week and miss less than 2 days of school in Year 5, at age 55. Ironically, teachers are typically forced into retirement at age 60 in China...but I think there’s an exception if you stay with your current employer (as opposed to signing with a new school at 60+).

This, from late 2016...the obvious risk or concern here is automated/computerized ball and strike calls being instituted in the the next four seasons https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/page/playoffs16_appreciatinggrandal/putting-value-los-angeles-dodgers-catcher-yasmani-grandal-proper-frame “Or, arguably, catchers who frame, which is how Grandal got brought into this MVP conversation in the first place. Grandal is a fine hitter, though that fact is obscured by his home ballpark and a low batting average. Only two catchers -- Jonathan Lucroy and Wilson Ramos -- were better hitters in 2016, by wOBA, and only Lucroy, Buster Posey and Russell Martin top him since 2014. But he doesn't hit the way MVPs hit. His arm and blocking aren't notable, and he has twice led the league in passed balls. But he's almost certainly an extraordinary pitch-framer, finishing second in the majors in Baseball Prospectus' framing runs (with 27 saved) this season after leading the majors (with 26) in 2015. That made him the seventh-most valuable player in the NL this year, according to BP's wins above replacement player -- just as PECOTA had projected. The existence of pitch-framing is not controversial; teams have taught it for decades, and Grandal traces his own education in the skill back to a college coach. He takes pride in his ability to steal strikes, and his teammates and bosses praise him for it. There is, then, nobody disputing that collecting strikes is real, and very little dispute that Grandal is good at it. But there's also no disputing that making strong relay throws is a real skill for a middle infielder, or that a good pickoff throw is a real skill for a pitcher. Were I to argue that Elvis Andrus' relay throws are worth 30 runs and make him an MVP candidate, I would find disputers. So Grandal's potential MVP candidacy would come down to one question: Is the number -- the 27 runs -- credible?”

Where’s Balta? It’s 3:37 a.m. China time, c’mon! The bizarre thing is just signing a five year contract to stay teaching here...precisely twelve hours ago, on Thursday. Unfortunately, only five zeroes!

Well, Anderson is “only” under control through 2024...but he’s certainly not a priority in comparison to Giolito, Moncada and possibly Robert. Those last two will be the toughest to extend. Giolito repeats his 2019 and he suddenly puts himself in elite territory...so now is the ideal time to strike if they’re 100% confident in his “repeatability.“ That would obviously carry a not insignificant amount of risk, as he’s already past the first three years. Of course, no extension and his arbitration numbers rise exponentially each season as well.

Hawk, that you? We’ve been missing those last weeks of 1967 stories for awhile now.

Good to hear. Now if they successfully convert on one of their top pitching targets, the high-decibel/unbridled optimism level will legitimately be reinstituted for the first time since the Moncada and Kopech debuts.

When Realmuto and Sal Perez are your best options after 2020...this type of go for broke move was necessitated because waiting and hoping on Realmuto...who at least 50/50 resigns with Philly, that’s just as much of a risk because who’s their starting catcher then if that falls through? In the end, both Narvaez and Collins weren’t good enough...nor was wishing, hoping and praying on a McCann repeat. If this goes south, or those three players all go on to successful careers outside of Chicago and Grandal has a swift fall-off...that will be the time to have that conversation. This is one of those moves that also puts the nail in the coffin for Hahn OR makes him GM of the Year. We’ll see...but it’s the first real risk they have taken since signing LUIS Robert and trading the Big 3 to kick off the rebuild.

They’re going to start him off low in the order and tamp down the pressure/expectations as much as possible. Down the line he gets more comfortable and confident at the big league level, sure. At the very least, he’s putting up numbers similar to Mike Cameron early in his career. As long as the K rate is less than 35-40%, he’ll be fine. He just can’t be Brian Anderson hitting in the 625-675 OPS range, at least not longer term.

The problem is 2022-23 is clearly the heart of the competitive window, as currently constructed. With Grandal’s age, competing this year at least now has to be looked at realistically...predicated on the rest of their moves and all the young players making steady progress and not busting...at least the very top guys. Ryu, Bumgarner, Keuchel, Hamels....they collectively as a group fall into that same category of win now rather than win later acquisitions due to age, mileage and/or injury concerns.

Love that they went out so quickly and set a precedent...even with an extra year and maybe $10-15 million higher than most were ideally hoping for, overpaying by a bit was always going to be a necessity to not let these negotiations linger on and on and then risk losing said player to a surprise last-minute bidder.