Quin

QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 30, 2011 -> 01:43 AM) The Ozzie hatred wears me out. The thing is on HIS website. He could have dictated the message to somebody who wrote it. I love Ozzie Guillen. Fixed. He never was a class act. Never. I loved Ozzie, then he just became more of an ass. He is not, will never be, and never was (except to fans at the stadium), a class act.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Sep 30, 2011 -> 01:29 AM) Well, the other problem is let's say Quentin asked for $17-19 million over 2 years (second year to buy him out of first year of FA). With his injury history, it's just as likely he could end up being a drain on the payroll. You're taking a big gamble assuming he would be the most marketable bat on the market. Certainly, he COULD be, but is it another payroll risk Williams/JR are willing to take? A lot depends on what were the legitimate offers for Quentin that were bypassed by KW in June/July. The other kid acquired from the Marlins (Oswaldo) has to figure into the battle with Escobar for the infield/utilty spot being vacated by Omar Vizquel. And you just MIGHT want to have one veteran on the bench. That's a pretty youthful group of 4. I want Martinez to try and be groomed into a starting SS in Charlotte. Lilli isn't young anymore. He's 28.

Definitely Sell: Quentin, Danks, Thornton Probably Sell: Floyd, Crain, Ohman, Frasor (offer arb or trade). Would Sell if Could Get Anything of Value For: AJ Rotation: I'd expect Sale to take "Ace" status mid-year. 1 - Mark Buehrle (resigned to $10M per) 2 - Phil Humber 3 - Chris Sale 4 - Jake Peavy 5 - Dylan Axelrod/Zach Stewart duke it out in spring training. Bullpen: Santos and Reed in the back will be nasty and I think Santiago and Lindsay could cover some, but the BP is taking a hit. CL - Sergio Santos SU - Addison Reed SU - This will have to be adressed externally for a lefty SU. MR - Shane Lindsay MR - Gregory Infante/Jhan Marinez LR - Loser of Axelrod/Stewart LR/6th Starter - Hector Santiago Starting Lineup: Rios and AJ would have Flowers and Lilli spell them a lot. LF - Alejandro De Aza SS - Alexei Ramirez DH - Adam Dunn 1B - Paul Konerko RF - Dayan Viciedo C - AJ Pierzynski 3B - Brent Morel CF - Alex Rios 2B - Gordon Beckham Bench: Flowers would be groomed as the next starter, Lilli would be a super-sub in the OF. Escobar basically replaces Vizquel with room to grow, Kuhn adds mad flexibility. C - Tyler Flowers 1B/OF - Brent Lillibridge SS/2B - Eduardo Escobar 3B/SS/2B/OF - Tyler Kuhn IF Dunn, Rios, and Gordon find out how to hit again, and Morel continues his September Surge into next year, that lineup could be enough to carry that rotation with Buehrle, Peavy 18 months from surgery, Humber and Sale building innings, and a Rook. Edit: I really like KHP's idea of giving Q 2 years to trade him at the deadline. Theoretically, also hold onto Ohman, Thornton, Crain for that.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 11:24 PM) There's ZERO chance that was written by Ozzie Guillen personally. It was written by someone in the PR office of the Florida Marlins, 100%. There's not a single grammatical error....so obvious, it's not Ozzie's style of expression at all.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 09:51 PM) I don't know why u guys care what Ozzie says. Ozzie is Ozzie. He talks a mile and minute and even he has no idea what's coming out of his mouth. I loved the Miami Herald story. They asked his wife if he's ever quiet. She said, 'When he's asleep.' Hahahahahahaha That's so funny because that's why he's gone and we don't have more than 2 division titles in the past 10 years. Also, his wife could learn to shut up too. She helped start the feud.

QUOTE (knightni @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 09:24 PM) Milwaukee>Tampa>Texas>Arizona>Detroit>St Louis>Philadelphia>New York This is mine, but swap Detroit and Philly.

It breaks down to this: Which managerial tree is more impressive? Mike Scioscia --> Joe Maddon --> Dave Martinez or Frank Robinson --> Manny Acta --> Sandy Alomar, Jr. Quite frankly, I'd love either one but Martinez comes from a far more impressive tree.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 09:07 PM) Maybe Soxtalk should outlaw corporal punishment, because Caulfield just paddled Marty's ass all over this message board. He can put it on his resume/CV for Baseball Debate 101: Playing the Devil's Advocate and Constructing Powerful Arguments Based Off of Logic and Past Examples QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 09:17 PM) So much so that I'm thinking about putting him on IG-NORE.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 06:51 PM) Swisher got along with Milton Bradley, but he couldn't get along with Ozzie Guillen. Ouch. Swisher is a cancer!

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 07:56 PM) No one is taking that money on. Not for Rios + Dunn. Oh god, I wouldn't do that. Crawford might bounce back, but his contract will be bad if not worse at its end.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 07:25 PM) Because he strikes out a lot.

When trying to accept it, he dropped it twice than couldn't even reach it on the third try,

Crawford, contract considered and the fact that he was an A+ deal to Klaw while Paulie was a D.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 02:34 PM) The new manager will properly motivate him and it's 45 homers again from Mr. Dunn! And .325 from Rios! And what if that does happen?

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 01:09 PM) Man, just watching the Rays game last night, everytime they showed Maddon, Martinez was right there with his own scribbles on paper. They almost seem like equals in that dugout... I'd be very satisfied with his being hired as manager. I sure hope KW/Jerry do their due diligence. I loved his quote. "If you're not a fan of baseball...you're not a fan!"

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 02:25 PM) You should not be so defensive.

QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 02:10 PM) Guillen won a title as a 3B coach. I could be a damn 3B coach in the MLB. That means nothing.

Guillen and Williams WS Titles With Tim Raines: 1 Without: 0

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 01:59 PM) Williams has no World Series titles or even post-season appearances with managers other than Guillen. And Guillen doesn't have them with another GM...

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 01:57 PM) God I hate having to do this. I really do. Marty's right. The USA Today Passan The fact that Alexei was there in CF on opening day was anqother of Ozzie's classic lineup experiments, like Jerry Owens in LF and Carlos Quentin on the bench. Goddamnit Balta.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 01:52 PM) It wasn't. Sarcasm.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 01:55 PM) So Williams has a world title and a higher winning percentage. Guillen has a world title and a lower winning percentage. Do.Not.Follow. QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 01:56 PM) Guillen World Series Titles with Williams: 1 Guillen World Series titles with out Williams: 0 Just sayin' Marty

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 01:51 PM) Ok, then Williams got Quentin to be a reserve OF'er. One or the other. He did. No one expected Quentin to be the monster he was. But that is what slid Swisher to be the center fielder, was that Quentin came out of nowhere.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 01:50 PM) I better watch out. I guess it doesn't show us that Ozzie actually lowered KW's winning percentage. It just sounds like a thinly veiled mob hit.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Sep 29, 2011 -> 01:44 PM) Milkman you are making a mistake by using win percentage to defend Williams over Guillen. A very big one. The f***? Is Ozzie going to come kill him or something? Ahahahaha. Also, yeah, Swisher was not acquired as a CF. Opening Day CF was Alexei.