lasttriptotulsa

Anybody else just avoid a thread completely once Marty starts posting?

QUOTE (SoIL @ Jan 24, 2014 -> 08:30 AM) I don't know, a .285 with RISP and .264 for a career are not terrible numbers. They're actually pretty decent. Especially with Gold Glove caliber defense at shortstop. Yeah, he probably has more ABs in the 9th spot the most players, but if he's the all-time leader in RBIs there, then something went right. It's not a guady or major stat, but it still shows nice production. Wasn't the idea to put Ozzie in the 9th spot to be another "leadoff" hitter and to have some speed at the bottom of the lineup. .264 is pretty awful when it's made up of almost entirely singles. His career high in extra base hits is 36 and his next highest is 31. Combine that with the fact that he never walked more than 26 times in a season and you end up with a whopping .626 OPS. Fact of the matter is that Ozzie was a pretty decent player up until he had his collision with Raines and hurt his knee at age 28 and that was mostly due to speed and defense. After the injury his defense and speed suffered greatly and he became a pretty useless player. Case in point, his cumulative fWAR through his age 27 season (before the injury) was 14.6 through 7 seasons. Not great, but right around an average MLB player. After the injury, his cumulative fWAR was -1.7.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 23, 2014 -> 09:50 PM) Abreu jerseys on sale at SoxFest. Get one while you can. They're already available from MLB.com as well.

If the Sox could have gotten Garza for the reported 4/52 the Brewers did, I would have been ok with that. Main reason being he didn't require giving up a draft pick. I want no part of Jimenez or Santana unless they end up signing for a 2 year deal for fairly cheap in which case I would sign them and try to flip them at the deadline or in the offseason.

QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Jan 23, 2014 -> 08:55 PM) For the record I've been saying Santana the whole time not Jimenez but..... Why is 2015 not a factor? Why not sign a really good #3 starter now for 12 or 13 mil per year? Can we agree that if the team wants to compete in 2015 another SP is going to be have to signed or acquired somehow? Why wait and pay a premium price when there is a more than serviceable SP now at a bargain price? Santana is 31, not 37, I think its more than reasonable to say that he should pitch at a high level for another 4 years. If you would have asked me 2 months ago whether or not I thought the Sox should sign Ervin Santana I would have said heck no without hesitation. But at some point you have to factor in value and capitalize on a buyers market. And do people really think this organization is going to spend 90+ million on 1 of the top SP's being mentioned for next years FA class? Not going to happen. Why wouldnt they spend $90 million on a top end starter? They just proved they were willing to go at least to $120 million on a guy who has never pitched in the majors.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 12:30 PM) Unless something crazy happens in the spring, Flowers is the start, Nieto is the back up, and Phegs goes to Charlotte. This is my thinking too. The organization seems to be high on Nieto so I doubt they're going to want to lose him right away and Phegley seems like he needs a little more time in AAA.

After watching Phegley last year, I think the odds of him ever becoming a solid major league player aren't good.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 10:17 AM) Bears Bills Cardinals Giants Jaguars Raiders Rams Steelers 8 teams who can be forced to have Hard Knocks. Reading around the net everyone wants the Bears. I've never watched the show so I don't know the exact format, but I'd have to think it would have been entertaining to have the Raiders do it while Al Davis was still alive.

QUOTE (southside hitman @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 10:21 AM) They are paying his contract in 2015-2017 no matter what. They just got 27 million in relief when he was suspended for the 2014 season. Not if he retires. Then they still hold his rights, but he doesn't get paid.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 10:19 AM) Also as much as I want to see ARod gone, now I have a need to see him come back next year so the Yanks are stuck paying him till his contract runs out in 2017. Oh I definitely want to see A-rod come back. He hasn't been good for awhile and after a year off and being a year older I bet he'll be even worse. I think it will be funny to watch A-rod play horribly and have the Yankees stuck paying him $25 million a year for the next three or whatever his salary is.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 09:42 AM) Kaz Matsui being a huge flop helped the Sox get Iguchi for a song. I really wanted the Sox to sign Kaz Matsui when he became available as I thought he would be pretty good.. Boy was I wrong on that one.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 09:41 AM) I'm very content with this. Way too much for Sox to spend...and the Cubs don't get him. Yea it works out alright. It will be especially sweet now if he flops as the Yankees will be stuck with yet another ridiculous contract.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 09:37 AM) According to this site, his taxes based on his average yearly salary (22.143M), would be: NY: 1.941M CA: 2.230M IL: 664K That's not exactly the way it works with players though. When the Yankees are playing the Sox at the Cell, Tanaka's check will be taxed at the Illinois level and so on. He will only be taxed at the ridiculous NY level when they are playing at home.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 09:34 AM) Yeah, but I also think Darvish paved the way for this contract for Tanaka. Teams were looking at Tanaka as the next Darvish, and if you don't believe that, you are kidding yourself. Agreed. If Darvish came over and flopped, you'd better believe Tanaka would have not gotten as good of a deal.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 09:26 AM) And you only pay that tax rate when you're playing the game in that state, road tips get counted at the local state's rate, so there's lots of gimmicks going on and that's only a small portion of the difference in these deals. Really the only time it's worth mentioning state income tax in regards to professional contracts such as these is when a player goes to a state like Texas or Florida that has no income tax. Then roughly half their contract is state income tax free and that can be significant, but if you're talking a state being a couple percentage points higher than another it really doesn't make much difference to a player when they're making the kind of money they're making.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 09:16 AM) Tanaka may be a step below Darvish right now but there's an age difference between when the 2 pitchers came over. They both came over at 25.

QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 09:14 AM) I wonder if sale will eventually ask for it to be restructured with these contracts getting larger and larger He can ask all he wants. This isn't the NFL, teams generally don't cave because a player holds out or whatever. MLB contracts are guaranteed and that goes both ways. I do agree though that Sale will probably wish he hadn't signed an extension so early if he stays healthy and keeps pitching like he has been.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 09:09 AM) This isn't exactly true. Teams are paying closer to $6 mill per WAR now, and that price is likely to go up over the duration of the contract. Depending on the breakdowns, it's likely that he'll have to end up being closer to a 4 WAR pitcher to "earn" this contract, but really, you sign this contract because you believe this guy is an ace and he can deliver 6 WAR production for the first couple years of the deal. 6 WAR 6 WAR 6 WAR 5.5 WAR 5 WAR 4.5 WAR 4 WAR = 37 WAR over the duration of the contract People are also assuming he has peaked. He's 25 years old. It's very possible that he HASN'T peaked yet and that the breakdown could be 5 WAR 5.5 WAR 6 WAR 6.5 WAR 6 WAR 5.5 WAR 5 WAR = 39.5 WAR It's not a terrible contract, but it's an incredibly risk contract because if he is anything less than Dan Haren in his prime. FYI, Haren over the same age time period put up a 32.6 WAR with the last year being worth 1.8 WAR. There is absolutely precedent for pitchers with this repertoire falling off a steep cliff. Tanaka is supposedly a step below Darvish. Darvish put up a 5 WAR season last year. The two Cy Young winners were 6.5 and 6.4 WAR pitchers. You really believe that Tanaka is going to be significantly better than Darvish in his first year in MLB and pitch at basically a Cy Young level? I really doubt it.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 09:05 AM) Pish. I'm always taking the hitter. I generally agree with this. Not saying I would have wanted Abreu at 7/155, but there is just so much more risk involved in signing pitchers to mega contracts.

QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 09:00 AM) Well, unfortunately for the sox, they wanted mccan and tanaka but so did the Yankees. Thank god they had teixeira lol Ha. Yea no kidding.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 08:56 AM) Yep, supposedly. Supply and demand I guess. Shows you how great of a bargain we got on Abreu IMO. Exactly. I thought at the time that the Sox were making a risky move, but after seeing the contracts handed out this off season if Abreu even turns into 75% of what we hope his contract could be a steal.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 08:54 AM) Too bad. Now I hope he sucks. The problem with the 4 year opt out is then it basically costs you $5 million extra per year with the posting fee. Hopefully in a few years Tanaka will look back and say he should have signed with the White Sox, but the Yankees were desperate. They probably would have paid him whatever it took. I like the White Sox agressiveness, and Hahn is either a great actor or really thought he had a shot. This bodes well for the future IMO. Yep. If the money is divided up evenly over the 7 years and Tanaka opts out after 4, they Yankees essentially would be paying him $27 million per year.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 08:54 AM) At least. He needs to best Darvish essentially. Isn't the general consensus amongst scouts that Tanaka is even a step below Darvish?

So Tanaka needs to be a 5+ WAR pitcher for 7 years for the Yankees to get their moneys worth. I don't like the odds of that happening.

QUOTE (thxfrthmmrs @ Jan 22, 2014 -> 08:49 AM) Props to all those who fooled themselves into believing Sox were higher than the Yankees on Tanaka's destination list. Whose to say they weren't at one time? Money talks. This deal is probably at least $35 million more than the Sox were willing to go.