The Ultimate Champion

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Aug 1, 2014 -> 11:47 AM) Sox aren't garbage. They're average. They're are a bullpen away from probably being in the race for the wild card. We have holes all over the OF, no real C, no bullpen, 3/5 of our rotation is below average, a gaping hole at DH with no one really in the wings, very little depth in the minors. Yeah, we're garbage. Give us a bullpen & we're good? I say, take away Abreu & Sale and see how many games we win and what happens to interest in White Sox baseball. Our 2nd best offensive player might be a guy on the DL still. We are bad and it's a credit to the coaching (god I have admitting that as a Robin hater) and to some of the guys on this team that we have won as many games as we have. We've had multiple holes all year long no matter what, and you can only blame so much of it on injuries. And the injury factor also applies to the other 29 teams in baseball, s***, we won the WS and we lost Frank and Hermanson for much/most of that year. If injuries are an enormous factor than so is lack of depth.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Aug 1, 2014 -> 11:42 AM) The guy is a kid who hardly plays. He hasn't hit, but what metric says you are what you are at his age and experience? There are tools there to be used off the bench. He can play several positions. he has a great arm and can really run. I am sorry, you cannot possibly know a baseball player and what his future holds simply by reading his fangraphs page. I still maintain that Leury is a great addition to a contending baseball team, especially an NL one that likes to put all its PR/defensive utility eggs all in one basket given the need for competent PH and the DH for interleague games. But here on a garbage club he just looks useless.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Aug 1, 2014 -> 11:30 AM) But the Sox have a big, young LH power bat. His name is Adam Dunn. ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ Chisoxfn, you see this? This is who you've given otherworldly mod powers to. Just look at that statement right there. Unbelievable.

Also I want to point out that I like Danks a lot as a person and a player, this is just a baseball/contracts/Rodon type of thing. Danks is a solid dude and I wish him the best wherever he goes.

Just wondering if there are any (read: not totally obscene Howard/Kemp deals) bad deals out there similar in size & scope to Danks' deal that we could potentially move for Danks? Papelbon comes to mind I think, but he's making a lot and we'd need something else back (cash relief or a player IMO). Maybe Marlon Byrd? Is League still bad with the Dodgers? I'm thinking about a useful player we could acquire for the OF, pen, etc. that would still open up the Road to Rodon. Who is out there? And again, nothing all that crazy because Danks at worst is probably about a $5M per year overpayment over a 2 year span, so at worst we are looking at something like a $10M overpayment in total from 2015-16.

" Trade Flowers, Davidson and sell high on the helium of Ravelo" Yeah I think Hahn would have done that a zillion times over if he could have. That deal brings back a bag of balls, even if you drive them all to the airport yourself, because aside from the risk/reward factor their hit tools all suck, except Ravelo who doesn't project to have surplus value.

I like the Martin idea (as well as the deal for Salty option Roostifer considered before) as far as a shorter term stopgap. But I hate the idea of trading one of our best pieces in Alexei for a C prospect. C prospects bust at an incredible rate. I want to get someone else's proven player. And really look arond the league, you don't need an ideal type of C to win ballgames. The A's didn't spend a lot acquiring a C, the Jays signed Navarro for free as did the Rays and Cubs before, etc. We need to get a SP, LH bat, or an MLB ready SS out of Alexei. Or if it is a RH bat then it needs to be a damn good one in terms of potential. The LH bat is our biggest need.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Aug 1, 2014 -> 11:13 AM) 1) A big, young, LH power bat... how many of those are even out there? 4? We'd have to give up a lot. 2) I think that would be Tim Anderson. Yeah that's why I said we may not be able to get one, they are hard to find. Ideally we would be able to get a kid at the AA or higher level in an Alexei deal, but we'd have to go after prospects and young MLB players who haven't fully developed yet because you can't just acquire someone like that who is proven.

Not sure how it looks but I think the plan is: Rotation: 1) Sign or trade for a RHSP we can pencil in as the #2 2) Danks is gone, Rodon starts in Triple A to start the season IF he doesn't win a ST SP battle 3) Noesi is the RHSP in the 4th slot but he has to battle someone (with actual ability, not just Carroll, but probably Johnson, Beck, and hopefully a new addition) Bullpen: 1) Sign one veteran RH for the late innings to a 1-year deal or 2 year deal with an option (more of a major signing) 2) Trade for or sign a lefty (more of a larger acquistion, like Downs was) 3) Spot patch the rest of the way, giving up no real prospects, taking on little if any salary Offense/Defense: 1) Acquire a big, young LH power bat.... we may need to make a bigger deal for this to happen, so I'm not sure it does happen because it might cost Q to get someone at the MLB level or close 2) Find a 2016+ SS Catcher: 1) Flowers is fine at least as a backup because if nothing else he can handle the staff 2) Nieto should be in the minors starting unless the Sox are somehow extremely aggressive with him 3) The Sox should look to trade for or sign a veteran until someone younger/better fitting comes along... but no way should the Sox deal their biggest pieces to try to plug the C hole with a prospect, that would likely be a huge mistake IMO because most of these guys flat out bust 4) If the Sox can't find a longer term (3+) year solution at catcher for a reasonable price then get a platoon partner for Flowers or a marginal upgrade, but someone who can handle the staff, and just deal with it Trades: 1) Alexei needs to be traded because he's our best piece aside from Q 2) Tank needs to be traded because he's probably one of our best avenues to bring in a player with upside, and although the player we get will probably look like a bust or be underwhelming there should be real talent there 3) Sox should be willing to eat some cash or package a small piece to move Danks and clear the way for Rodon

Also the Cubs might be a good organization to hit up at this point, if possible. Other teams that have strong farms & make a lot of deals would apply. The Red Sox & Cubs made a Doubront deal where they PTBNL isn't announced until after the Rule-5 deadline. I'm not sure but I imagine that deal is probably considering a package of players that the Cubs probably aren't going to be able to protect from the Rule-5 on the 40. I think we should try to find players like that, non-40 man roster prospects which another team may consider giving up because that team knows it probably won't be able to protect the player & risks losing him for nothing. Go after some types like that, put them wherever you need to whether it is at the MLB or MiLB level, and see if they can prove enough to be worth protecting for next year. Also we're long overdue for a prospect-for-prospect type of deal. The last significant one I can think of was Cunningham for Richar. As long as they are not on the 40 we can make those types of deals. Even still, we can use the PTBNL tag to deal players on the 40 but then the transactions can't be completeld until IIRC sometime in September when playoff eligibility is gone.

I think that at least most of us should all be able to agree on the following, going forward from today through the rest of the season: 1) The season is over, it has been over, this is garbage time only, and any dreams of hotstreaks and 2nd wildcard spots are foolishness; 2) Because of the above, the focus needs to be entirely on 2015 and beyond ONLY; 3) Because of the above, we need to use the remaining schedule, the remaining PA and IP available, also the remaining defensive innings positionally, to "see what we have" i.e. answer as many questions as possible heading into the organizational meetings where we will really put forth an action plan for the offseason Now given those 3 above points which by now we should really all agree on, I think this is what we need to do: 1) Still do everything possible to dump Danks (if we can, but probably not) 2) Open up playing time everywhere and anywhere possible for anyone we think has at least *some chance* of being part of our future, whether it is a more of longshot like a Carlos Sanchez or Andy Wilkins, or a pretty solid bet like Marcus Semien 3) Still do everything possible on the waiver wire and/or in small trades at the MiLB level - keep in mind that only players protected on the 40man need to pass through waivers, the same trade rules as before apply to prospects not on the 40 - to acquire at least 1-2 pieces worth throwing out there in late August & September 4) Realize that 2014 payroll costs are fully sunk, completely unrecoverable, a total waste of time, and that the 2015+ payroll situation is really what matters. So you are prepared to dump Dunn & Beckham at full salary, especially if another team somehow by some great miracle decides to offer you a longshot prospect/reclamation project that is actually worth trying out for a month plus. So Hahn needs to get busy.

Danks contract still being here blows, but I can't fault Hahn/the Sox for giving it out when they did, nor can I fault them for not finding a taker. But it still blows anyway & I really hope we can dump him in the offfseason. As for the rest of it, not getting a RHSP with upside to plug into Carroll's rotation slot really bugs me. We hvae all these IP to fill, the games don't matter, so get someone with some ability to put in there. Take a shot on someone with a chance. I thought Viciedo could get us that type of player potentially, but nope. Lastly it's disappointing to see that massive mountain of dogs*** Adam Dunn still on this roster. I've been waiting for his dismissal for going on 4 years now. He's such a waste. Get this guy the f***l out of here already. And Beckham, I don't hate Beckham, but he's terrible and the annual amount he's making this year is probably the largest annual payday he'll ever see in his career, and for good reason. Get this guy out of here. Like Dunn, you're not getting anything anyway, just dump his sorry ass.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 04:59 PM) Seriously! Its not Hahn's fault these players aren't worth their contracts. He could dump Beckham's sorry ass at least. What a joke this deadline was. DFA the sorry sonf of a b****

If the Sox tried to re-sign Dunn I would find oiut the addresses of every member of Sox brass and would spend the entire next season stoppiong by each of their homes at 3am and flinging s***-filled paper bags at all their windows.

Mariners get Denorfia, putting Tank talks officially to bed it seems

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 01:23 PM) If teams are flooding the A's with calls, the A's are not going to decide that they should trade Hammel for De Aza. If they are flooding the A's with calls it's probably because they feel they can pick up Hammel for a song. You don't rush to the phones to give up a solid prospect. I think that's a fair deal but I'm not sure if the A's need an OF now.

QUOTE (Andy the Clown @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 01:14 PM) Since no one will take Danks, we have to aim for this rotation by 2016; 1) Sale 2) Q 3) ? 4) Rodon 5) Danks Despite Danks' suckitude, that's pretty good if they can get a real #3. By the way Rock, did the Sox lawyers and money-men call a meeting to discuss dinner locations? I would bet just about anything that doesn't happen. I think the order of likeliest scenario is: 1) They trade Danks, eating as much as they have to 2) Rodon is in the pen for "a litle while" to "gain experience" as the Sox try to do #1 3) The Sox trade Q for a haul They'll still try to dump Danks over the waiver period & if they can't dump him during the season then dumping him will be a major offseason priority.

I heard earlier this AM that tje Giants had a bat ring laying around or something and were looking at Beckham... okay, make that deal now.

Yeah he needs to dump one of these turds ATM it's obvious now Danks isn't going anywhere anytime soon. At least bring up someone different.

QUOTE (Charlie Haeger's Knuckles @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 12:56 PM) He just wants to show the scouts how effective he is pitching in high-pressure situations. Yeah well that turned out well. This whole John Danks trade idea seems to float about as well as a canoe full of bullet holes. LOL 45 pitches & he's not through the second.

Well if the Yanks have scouts in the stands I hope they're blind. Or constipated/in the bathroom passing kidney stones. God damn I just hope they're not watching this. Maybe Robin can pull him now before it gets worse.

If the O's get Price then the Yanks can even the score by taking on Danks' deal haha I can just hear Cashman going "This Price deal puts them in better position to compete with us."

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 12:42 PM) Like Daniel Nava and Grady Sizemore? Johnny Gomes? Ryan Carp? lol exactly standards my ass

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 12:20 PM) Plus Craig is owed $27 million the next 3 + years. He also sucks my balls. I'd much rather have Viciedo and it's not even close. I think Tank gets too much hate here even though he is a disappointment. Craig isn't a solution anywhere for us, and if we made a deal like that with Tank we'd just be going backwards. Tank needs to bring back youth + upside if he goes in a deal. JMO but homeless people leave presents on the sidewalk that are more appealing than Craig. Just hunt around a bus or train station there's all kinds of better things you can pick upo & put in your mouth/pocket that is better than Craig. Maybe Craig & Tommy Milone together wow what a package that would be. God damn the guy is garabge.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 12:06 PM) There's still life to a Danks trade. Wonder what teams the scouts rep? Yanks I'm sure. Sox paid off a bunch of actorsa to sit next to the Yankees scouts & pose as scouts from other organizations. The idea here is to create the impression of interest. The actors will say things like "you know I really don't think this guy is overpaid at all" and "you know they say he lost velocity but I sure don't see it."