Flash Tizzle

I'm not upset in the least about Williams' inability to reel in this "big fish." (And yes, I'm sure ten other people have used that metaphor). What value are Hunter and Miguel Cabrera, or any other player which will cost a significant amount of money/talent to acquire, when this team likely won't be a legitimate contender for several seasons? Problem here is, for one, Williams is the one digging himself into the corner by signing Linebrick then trading Garland for a short-term solution in Orlando Cabrera. It's obvious his intentions are for the White Sox to compete. Second, whining about opposing general managers, and -- prior to that -- talking about obtaining someone significant to the media, then falling flat, doesn't look very good. He's only backing himself into a corner, here. Atleast we'd expect hardships with a rebuilding project. What's the excuse going to be if this current club, perhaps another FA added on, finishes in fourth again? Will he wait until it's too late to trade anyone of value?

It's going to be difficult for this lady to live a normal life after this incident. Her face is plastered all over the news. I don't know how you walk down a street by yourself or visit a grocery store without looking over your shoulder. We've seen prior examples of how Islamic extremists hold grudges.

QUOTE(gosox41 @ Nov 29, 2007 -> 10:32 PM) It's a great idea and the Twins have the talent evaluators to make sure they don't get screwed over. It's such a great idea, why aren't the Sox doing this right now? Why are we tring to patch 5 glaring holes on a veteran 90 loss team when they payroll won't be going up enough to adequately fill these holes based on today's current market conditions? Bob If someone asked Williams this question and he gave an honest response, I'd guess the answer would be "100 million dollar payroll teams don't rebuild What concerns me is, are we more willing to assemble a team which, in its current state, won't compete; rather than considering a rebuilding project? So what, we finish with 100+ losses in 2008 and alienate the fanbase? Have the payroll drop 20 million for all I care. I guaran-damn-tee whenever this team competes again all the idiots shaking their fists in the air (casual fans) will be right back. Quicker we begin, the quicker we can stop looking down in the division. What really irritates me is, judging from Reinsdorf quotes several months ago, Williams position is safe. So then why is he approaching this offseason as if it isn't? I honestly hope next season we're either the worst team in the league or the playoffs. Nothing in between. No "we won five more games and that's a moral victory" scenarios.

QUOTE(jasonxctf @ Nov 29, 2007 -> 07:12 PM) i said it before and I'll say it again. The Sox needed to decide late last year whether or not they wanted to contend in 2008 or blow it up and not contend until 2010-11, etc. Anything in between or 1/2assed would be a failure. These are my exact sentiments. I actually envy the Twins here because, first, they undersand contention next year is unlikely and aren't making marginal signings/acquisitions to appease their fanbase; and second, the talented players they're making available will fetch quite the haul. Even if any deals are primarily the result of payroll restrictions, it's still a approach which may lead them back to the playoffs before us.

QUOTE(daa84 @ Nov 28, 2007 -> 03:39 PM) delmon young walked 26 times last year in 645 Abs...hes never shown a good eye in the minors, he does have power and will certainly develop more than 13 HR power in his future but im not nearly as high on him as some are....i also think the twins are moving towards full out rebuilding...santana will probably be dealt and nathan is likely to follow...they will have a nice core though with young, morneau, mauer, liriano, and potentially adding melky hughes + other prospects + what htey could get for nathan (who has arguably been the best closer since taking over in 04 Good. I hope Minnesota overstocks their farm system with talent. All the more pressure from our scouts to find talented players. It's sad that I have more confidence in Minnesota completely tearing down their team, rebuilding, and reaching the playoffs again before us. Number Eight really better land us quite the catch next June. We'll need something to look forward to if Minnesota reels in the packages we believe they can for Nathan and Santana.

QUOTE(RME JICO @ Nov 28, 2007 -> 02:18 PM) Yeah, it probably should have been green, but if the Sox sweetened the deal, maybe with some cash and a prospect it could be close. I really don't believe we're in any position to 'sweeten deals', even if it were to involve someone such as Delmon Young. We'd just be replacing one problem area (offensive prospects) with another (pitching prospects), without the benefit of having Liriano and Santana. We couldn't possibly one-up Minnesota's offer without including double the prospects. Considering Garza has proven himself capable of pitching in the majors, and has minor league statistics to back it up, it'd probably take DLS + Gonzalez to compensate for him. Is DLS, Gonzalez, Uribe (as a starting point) for Young worth it?

QUOTE(southsida86 @ Nov 16, 2007 -> 01:39 AM) I just wish that upper management on the Sox would just realize that unless they want to have a $150 million payroll then they are not going to compete in this division in 2008...or 2009 for that matter. Just blow it up Marlins style. Williams can't possibly look at his roster and think to himself this is a playoff calibur ballclub. What irritates me is blending a 'win now' with looking towards the future (evidence of which can be found with the return value of Garcia and McCarthy) is it's the exact kind of indecision which needs to end. Last season, I could understand the rationale. We were coming off a 90 win season and obviously Williams noticed the baron system. Can't just rebuild right then and there. Unfortunately, we'll probably see Williams assemble another dousy of a return for Garland. Except now far fewer people believe this team is any good. I would expect something such as a decent relief pitcher, C-level prospect, and a 24 year old Single A OF. Not I'm anticipating Kershaw for Garland, but it's foolish to salvage one of the few trading chips this team has for ANYTHING to help 2008. I'd hope Williams does something such as acquire a B level prospect and a raw, Low A 19-20 yr old positional player. Plug in Gonzalez or Floyd, for all I care. Whether our rotation is Buehrle/Vazquez/Contreras/Danks/Garland or Buehrle/Vazquez/Contreras/Danks/Whomever we're not exactly removing the one piece from a championship puzzle. If you're not in first place, with much hope for the immediate future, it'll be better off for everyone if the team finishes dead last. Yes, even behind the Royals. No way for anyone to spin such a disaster. And even if we're not competing (lets say within five games of a playoff birth entering September) by 2010, I would hope several additional years of minor league development between now and then provide us hope for a quick turnaround. We have the #8 overall pick next June, probably a Top 15 pick in 2009. Not to mention all of this emcompasses a heightened focus on player devleopment. People should be scouting for their jobs. If that doesn't provide an incentive, I don't know what will. There should be no more excuses for weak drafts. As I mentioned earlier, we'll still have a decent sized payroll. Even with several consecutive losing seasons I can't imagine it falling below 85 million so quickly. If it does, then there's all the more reason to conduct a successfull rebuilding project. No matter how bad it gets, the fans will return. I still believe at some point, whether Williams ever considers rebuilding or not, he'll need to be involved in a trade which substantially benefits our ballclub. A franchise changing deal. Something in which several future major leaguers arrive here for a substantially less amount from our end. Because if we're looking to rebuild from trades, it's going to take more than the Nick Massets and Jacob Rasners of the world to compensate for a complete lack of positional talents.

QUOTE(chisox2334 @ Nov 16, 2007 -> 01:12 AM) http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=78668 I don't doubt his sources. Crede may as well be gone before the winter meetings conclude. But it's obvious we're not having any of the names connected with Los Angeles that are referenced in the article. It's odd how Billingsley is listed as untouchable, yet Kemp, Loney and Kershaw are possible trade pieces for Choke Crede and (what I can only imagine) an additional several players. Hell, ieven if we were to miraculously land any of those three (or even Abreu and Broxton) I wouldn't package that with DLS/Fields/etc for Cabrera.

QUOTE(fathom @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 12:16 PM) Olney's reporting that the Dodgers #1 target this offseason is Aaron Rowand. I just hope KW keeps his poise this offseason with these huge deals that will be handed out. It really is too damn bad we're not going into rebuilding mode. It would cost a fortune to get this team back into the AL Central picture. My philosophy entering next season is either for this team to reach the playoffs or finish in last place. No in-between, indecisive bulls*** which delays management rebuilding another season. Either play in October or begin looking towards the future. Would finishing .500 honestly assure anyone of anything other than Williams (and perhaps a small contingent on Soxtalk) suggesting it's a 'small steps towards the playoffs?" We're not exactly a young team full of promising talent, in which small steps will be viewed as beneficial. This team is old, expensive; and I'm not willing to fool myself in believing 10-12 more wins is a promise of better things in 2009. And I'm not advocating any trade where several prospects are packaged for someone who could " win now," either. Our success or failure should rest upon the current collection of players. With perhaps several short term committments strewn about to fill the roster. When I read about Torii Hunter seeking an extended contract (> 3 years), I can't help but think it'll be useless since the first several years on this club he'll be looking up at Cleveland and Detroit. Possibly Minnesota. And then when his skills are really beginning to diminish, perhaps 2010, we'll finally be in a position to compete. That's atleast what I'm hoping, especially with the renewed interest in player development and (at worst) payroll around 85 million. On a different note, does anyone else believe any references to 2005 should forever be stricken from Soxtalk beginning in 2008? Anything which attempts to compare our success, troubles, how Williams assembled his team, or even Spring Training statistics to the 2005 team should never be spoken. If It were up to me, I'd place the numbers '2005' in a language filter. We really need to move on as fans and an organization. Not that we forget what happened, but for Christs sakes, to quit finding ways of building connections. It has to end at somepoint, right?

QUOTE(kyyle23 @ Nov 14, 2007 -> 07:55 AM) I would say that the movie adaptation of Stephen King's "It" was close to, if not better than the book. The book was good, dont get me wrong, but there is a whole sub-plot involving It killing a small population of homosexuals in Dairy(Derry?) that was left out of the movie, probably because it really didnt fit in the scheme of the storyline(or what was considered proper at the time the movie came out). The book is so thick, and it is a long part of the book that didnt really fit with the rest. It was definitely close. For the thousand plus pages of material, and a minimal budget, the mini series did an amazing job concentrating on the main issues. After finishing the novel several years ago I honestly believed the aforementioned points (budget, made for tv) worked in its favor. Some of the material, aside from the entire homosexual angle, just wouldn't work. Such as portraying the female member of their group as a whore, or the entire "Turtle" vomiting out the universe and 'IT' chilling underneath Derry since prehistoric times part. With all the references to Stephen King in this thread, I'm surprised no one has yet to suggest the film version of Pet Sematary was better than the book. Even though I enjoyed the movie, after reading the book it's obviously several notches below. I heard they're remaking the film, so perhaps now they'll attempt to recreate the Gage/Old Man encounter; or the forest Wendigo.

Kid Gleason may appreciate this -- For anyone with Comcast, tune into OnDemand's FearNet section (under Free Movies) and watch "The Haunting of Julia." It's an older movie starring Mia Farrow, and it's chilling. Despite dating itself, the atmosphere and soundtrack are terrific. It reminded me of another overlooked movie with similar features in "Don't Look Now." If you're looking for an underrated ghost story this is your movie. It seriously stays with you afterwards.

QUOTE(Steff @ Nov 8, 2007 -> 10:18 PM) I have no idea how you, and others who go on to grad school, do it. Same with doctors or lawyers. So much school. Takes a special mindset for sure. Everyone has their own selfish reasons for extending their education beyond a bachelors degree. Personally, I regard a MA in criminology as a way of ensuring advancement through rank in whatever agency I'm employed with. It may not be necessary now, but what about in 10-15 years? Currently, most police departments have a policy in which the upper ranks (deputy chief, chief) are only offered to those with masters degrees. I wouldn't be shocked if that requirement shifted to a PhD in time. Problem is, I'm nowhere near committed enough to pursue that. Atleast now. By the time I'm out of graduate school I'll be 25 years old. That's still places me ahead of 95+% of my peers.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 8, 2007 -> 10:40 AM) As to the bolded above, no, no he didn't. There was no attempt at rebuilding. There was only injuries and hole-plugging call-ups. The fact that we saw Fields, Owens and Richar was due to Crede and outfielders' injuries, plus the fact that the team was going nowhere, so why not? That is not rebuilding. I agree, he didn't rebuild. He rebuilt in place. What were Danks and Masset? Danks was acqquired as the future starter, whereas Masset was the potential fireball reliever for the 2007 team. What were Gonzalez and Floyd? Gonzalez was acquired as the future starter, whereas Floyd was the potential 5th starter for the 2007 team.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 8, 2007 -> 10:22 AM) One thing to keep in mind too. Its become apparent since the season ended that, unlike at the end of 2006, the organization has made a lot of internal changes to scouting staff, coaches and player development. Kenny and his crew are not blind to the failures. So whatever the team did before, I wouldn't look at that as a predictor for the future anymore, in the area of player development. I've been pleased with how this issue has been addressed. There's no telling how they'd handle a rebuilding effort, but I'm still more willing to trust Williams and company now more than I did last season. They realize the status of our farm system and no longer (from what I gather) look at it as a unit which exists to acquire veteran players. Next June will interesting, to say the least.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Nov 8, 2007 -> 09:55 AM) If they are going to do it, they better do it like you state above. My worry is that Kenny is trying to rebuild in place. He tried rebuilding in place last season and it didn't turn out too well. If Williams believes the White Sox stand a chance in 2008 (which I can't possibly believe), then I hope we finish with the worst record in the league. We've been over this issue before concerning draft position and balancing long term/short term goals. If finishing poorly two straight seasons is finally the push required for Williams to see what you, I, and numerous Sox fans see than so be it. If it takes until 2011 to reach the playoffs, I'll accept that as well. It's just, from my perspective, 2008 will be looked at in the same regard as 2001 and 2002 -- completely useless. Remember, this isn't a young team. Does finishing .500 really prove anything? Especially when the consider the status of several key components of our team, and how they'll either be near or at the end of their contracts (Thome, Konerko, Pierzynski, Garland) or possibly injured (Thome, Dye) with no immediate replacements in sight. Carter and DLS better not slow down their ascent to the majors one bit. And I still believe at some point within the next several seasons Williams needs atleast one trade which heavily favors our ballclub. A trade in which multiple major league caliber prospects return. No, one step backwards, one and half step forward type deals such as those concerning McCarthy. Or Vazquez. We can't have any more deals where we're weakening certain areas of our ballclub to improve others, or in the case of Danks/Masset/Rasner, marginally improve. If at that.

I honestly have no problem with the possibility of Uribe as our starting shortstop come March. We're not winning anything, anyways. It's better to limit our commitment than trade for or sign a player outside the organization. I'm more concerned with how Williams restocks our farm system. I'll be furious if, one, Garland remains on this team (he should have been traded before August); and two, if any package includes marginal major league talent. The latter being a distinct possibility because Williams is intent of competing this season. Our fans probably wouldn't accept anything less, unfortunately.

QUOTE(fathom @ Nov 7, 2007 -> 03:59 PM) After the way last year went, I don't think it's realistic to think of what this team has to do to get 1st in a loaded division. To be honest, the goal should be for this team to be over .500 next year, and go from there. If we finish around .500, it's time to completely overhaul the ballclub. It shouldn't be viewed as an accomplishment. Playoffs or nothing should be the options. We're only delaying the rebuilding process one more season while simultaneously providing hope that it's a stepping stone for 2009. This isn't a young ballclub on the rise. If by some chance we're 81-81 with the current collection of talent (and perhaps one of Hunter/Rowand/Furcal/mystery person strewn about ), I'd be shocked if Konerko, Thome, Pierzynski, Dye -- key cogs within the lineup -- would be expected to build upon it. I worry about them more than Owens, Fields, or Richar because those four don't exactly have a replacement available. A replacement that could be expected to immediately produce. I did like the idea discussed on Cheat's blog concerning the acquisition of Furcal/Burrell as potential draft investments. Essentially a deal (if the talent given up wasn't absurd) that provides short term and long term benefits. However, I believe it's just too much of a risk under the new structure for classifying "A," "B" talent. They may be injured or ineffective. There's also the possibility whichever team signs either has their first round pick protected. Or we sign several FAs and have to surrender those exact picks from the sandwich round. Does this sound like a bet Williams would make?

QUOTE(SoxAce @ Oct 17, 2007 -> 10:47 PM) Probably going to see it this weekend. If not, definitely next weekend. Bloody- Disgusting rated it fairly well. I trust their judgment of horror movies. If I can't find it online I'll definitely watch it at the theaters.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Oct 12, 2007 -> 06:44 PM) Yeah, and I thought that was quite clear, actually. Well, then I apologize to McCarver. I'm browsing the interweb and watching TV. Although if you ever point out anything wrong with one of my posts again I will subject you to a full beat down. Remember, I'm bigger than you.

Remember when the Red Sox gave us a "run for our money" in 2005? Oh, wait, we swept them. McCarver's an idiot.

The high expectations have already begun with me. He better be here before his 21st birthday. I have no confidence we'll have an internal SS replacement by then.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Oct 11, 2007 -> 09:15 PM) Flash, you really should jump on the Hawks bandwagon. You would be drooling over the kids up with the big club, along with the farm system in place.... Where's our Sidney Crosby? Well, the first order of business would be understanding hockey. I've never been a fan, although I'm not one to yell "hockey sux!11"

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Oct 11, 2007 -> 09:06 PM) That was one of my concerns as well. Any catcher Egbert pitches to from this point forward will be far better than any of Birmingham's post-Lucy journeymen. He'll more than likely be teamed up with Lucy in Charlotte, anyways. So we'll see whether his success carries over there.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Oct 11, 2007 -> 08:55 PM) I think you are getting at a real key here. When a player or pitcher succeeds repeatedly despite not having some particular key bit of "stuff", instead of wondering what it is about the player that is being missed, some people just decide it must be luck. Or the ballpark. Or anything other than maybe their method of evaluation (i.e. velocity) isn't perfect. Also... stuff is not the same as velocity. If he is getting people out as often and with as many K's as he is at multiple levels, with a fastball not much above 90, then he clearly does indeed have good stuff. This is what I was getting at. His fastball is a focal point for assessing his "stuff," yet the secondary offerings obviously are sufficient enough to pile up strikeouts. This is why I -- as well as you -- believe people are quick to label him a fringe prospect. And yes (not addressing you NSS), I know I continually call for prospects to be drafted with velocity. These are the pitchers I'd prefer. However, whether someone throws 90 or 99 if they're succeeding in their role Im satisfied.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Oct 11, 2007 -> 08:51 PM) He's a White Sox prospect. Why do I feel he's got a bad ceiling? He doesn't have particularly noteworthy stuff. That's about the long and short of it. That's the best argument anyone can provide as to why Egbert won't ever become a pitcher of value. Too bad other teams don't overvalue 5th starters. If Egbert becomes just that, we'll have just about cornered the market.