(1) It's not just BA's rankings.

(2) These scouting services' rankings are based talking to scouts and coaches in the various leagues.

(3) I never said a deal had to be made using prospect rankings.

 

My only point is that a consensus top-10 prospect in all of baseball is not a third piece.

For sure and i wasn't coming after you. My point is that Glasnow could be a third piece to the Sox if they don't like him. This is totally logical because the Pirates have played their hand by trying to replace him with Quintana. The idea of being excited by getting Glasnow as the first or second piece is a terrifying proposition to us as Sox fans. Most of us would not be excited to get Glasnow as the first or second piece, and rightfully so. So yes, he would be a terrific third piece. Second is an arguable stretch and first is a freaking nightmare. Absolute nightmare.

For sure and i wasn't coming after you. My point is that Glasnow could be a third piece to the Sox if they don't like him. This is totally logical because the Pirates have played their hand by trying to replace him with Quintana. The idea of being excited by getting Glasnow as the first or second piece is a terrifying proposition to us as Sox fans. Most of us would not be excited to get Glasnow as the first or second piece, and rightfully so. So yes, he would be a terrific third piece. Second is an arguable stretch and first is a freaking nightmare. Absolute nightmare.

FWIW, I still think Cole, Quintana, Glasnow, Taillon, and Nova shapes up as the kind of rotation that should scare the Cubs. So, there's reason why they might do a trade for Quintana even if they do like Glasnow a lot. 2 rookies, 3 guys who had health problems, and a "Searage already fixed him" guy in that rotation without him, it has a lot of upside, but the #1 thing that would fit in that rotation well is "a guy who is strong and really, really, really consistent" because it balances out something going wrong.

As far as I know there has been zero reporting or even whispers that Meadows is untouchable. I could be wrong though.

 

Re: Glasnow

The reality with Glasnow is if he walks 5 batters per 9 innings he will not be a starter.

 

If the Sox dont think the control issues can be corrected then he's destined for the bullpen and he's not a headline piece. With Giolito they obviously recognized the Nationals bungling and they have confidence Kopech and Dunning can be developed. If the scouts and coaches are telling Rick Hahn that Glasnow is not a fit unless he's on the back end of the deal he will listen to them, not the general consensus from Baseball America.

 

As far as I know there has been zero reporting or even whispers that Meadows is untouchable. I could be wrong though.

 

Re: Glasnow

The reality with Glasnow is if he walks 5 batters per 9 innings he will not be a starter.

 

If the Sox dont think the control issues can be corrected then he's destined for the bullpen and he's not a headline piece. With Giolito they obviously recognized the Nationals bungling and they have confidence Kopech and Dunning can be developed. If the scouts and coaches are telling Rick Hahn that Glasnow is not a fit unless he's on the back end of the deal he will listen to them, not the general consensus from Baseball America.

 

Glasnow is built and delivers a baseball like recent white sox draftee Alec Hansen, there is a lot to like there. Even in Hansen's SSS within the organization it appears they were able to correct his problems and he may go down as being the steal of the '16 draft, coming into last year he was projected to go 1-1. I agree with you though that Hahn will do his due diligence when it comes to these trades.

Sickels Pirates top 20. Rates Keller higher than Bell.

 

http://www.minorleagueball.com/2016/12/31/...spects-for-2017

 

What a system

As far as I know there has been zero reporting or even whispers that Meadows is untouchable. I could be wrong though.

 

Re: Glasnow

The reality with Glasnow is if he walks 5 batters per 9 innings he will not be a starter.

 

If the Sox dont think the control issues can be corrected then he's destined for the bullpen and he's not a headline piece. With Giolito they obviously recognized the Nationals bungling and they have confidence Kopech and Dunning can be developed. If the scouts and coaches are telling Rick Hahn that Glasnow is not a fit unless he's on the back end of the deal he will listen to them, not the general consensus from Baseball America.

Love the last sentence. My thoughts exactly.

Just like no GM in baseball would have given any thought to Phil Rogers' top ten picks for the White Sox when he was involved in compiling it.

I'm guessing this starts to heat up again tomorrow, right? Or are we still in the holidays?

I'm guessing this starts to heat up again tomorrow, right? Or are we still in the holidays?

 

Guess it depends on what you mean by heat up. Do you mean negotiations just start to continue?

I'm guessing this starts to heat up again tomorrow, right? Or are we still in the holidays?

I think the week between Christmas & New Years is probably the one week of the year most GMs take off (or at least as much as they can). So yeah, I think rumors start heating up again in the coming week. I still don't think Quintana is on our roster come SoxFest.

If JR is paying attention, the Rondo situation is yet another prime argument for not pretending to go for it by signing washed up name players...

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/rajon-rondo-s...-215845333.html

Caul field how is that remotely relevant to a Quintana trade rumor thread

The only way the Q situation heats up is if a team steps up and gives the Sox exactly what we want. I personally don't have a problem keeping Quintana as our ace

Hopefully we hear a new rumor about Quintana tomorrow or the next couple days. I know it's been the holidays, but the baseball hot stove has been extremely slow the last couple weeks and really the whole off season.

 

To my knowledge, only the Sox have made the trades so far this off season. Just a weird off season with the CBA, lack of movement, slow free agency signings, and barely any trades.

Edited January 2, 20179 yr by SoxPride18

Forget the rumors, forget the tweets. The only thing that happens now is deals. It either happens or it doesn't. These days, my friends, are the dog days of the offseason. Sure, things will still happen, but it will be when you least expect them. I'm done feeding off of rumors. I've heard enough Q rumors. The next thing for me that will be even remotely interesting involving Q is a Q trade. If it happens, great it will mean the Sox felt that they got a fair price. If not, oh well that sucks I'd prefer if some team had offered enough for the Sox to deal him but they didn't, so consolation prize is having an awesome pitcher on your team.

Forget the rumors, forget the tweets. The only thing that happens now is deals. It either happens or it doesn't. These days, my friends, are the dog days of the offseason. Sure, things will still happen, but it will be when you least expect them. I'm done feeding off of rumors. I've heard enough Q rumors. The next thing for me that will be even remotely interesting involving Q is a Q trade. If it happens, great it will mean the Sox felt that they got a fair price. If not, oh well that sucks I'd prefer if some team had offered enough for the Sox to deal him but they didn't, so consolation prize is having an awesome pitcher on your team.

 

Agreed 100%.

I think it'll be like the Frazier deal.

 

We'll hear some weird thing like a prospect is getting traded then suddenly boom, Q is dealt.

If JR is paying attention, the Rondo situation is yet another prime argument for not pretending to go for it by signing washed up name players...

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/rajon-rondo-s...-215845333.html

 

does ronda rousey's loss affect it?

I think it'll be like the Frazier deal.

 

We'll hear some weird thing like a prospect is getting traded then suddenly boom, Q is dealt.

 

hopefully in John Madden's voice.

Caul field how is that remotely relevant to a Quintana trade rumor thread

 

One fourth of SoxTalk is not yet convinced a full rebuild is going on.

 

Until Q is dealt, that will still be the case. One would think that JR, if he wasn't closely paying attention the last four years to the White Sox, would have realized with the start of the current Bulls' season that both franchises need to be completely rebooted.

 

They hit with most of their young pitchers, they're not far away from a .500 team in 2018. They would have a potentially dominant bullpen.

 

If Moncada and Collins are studs, they keep Frazier at a reasonable price, Abreu's got 2018 and 2019...you've suddenly got at least five average or above average players at 2b, C or DH, 3b, SS (Anderson) and 1b. You can definitely see the argument for holding onto Q at least. Corner outfield and DH bats are always more affordable...so let's say you sign Lorenzo Cain for 2018 and 2019, you have a Top Five college bat in the 2018 draft, Saladino possibly as a supersub and the proceeds of Robertson, Nate Jones and Jennings as well.

 

With how bad Detroit, KC, and Minnesota should be...tanking again in 2018 becomes more challenging with Moncada, Collins and the young pitchers.

 

CF and Collins sticking at catcher would be the biggest sticking points. But it's definitely possible to imagine pushing up the timeline to 2018/19 instead of 2019/20 by not trading Q.

 

 

Edited January 2, 20179 yr by caulfield12

I couldn't take it any longer in my MLB The Show franchise, so I just dealt Q for Meadows, Bell, and Newman.

 

Book that s***.

One fourth of SoxTalk is not yet convinced a full rebuild is going on.

 

Until Q is dealt, that will still be the case. One would think that JR, if he wasn't closely paying attention the last four years to the White Sox, would have realized with the start of the current Bulls' season that both franchises need to be completely rebooted.

 

They hit with most of their young pitchers, they're not far away from a .500 team in 2018. They would have a potentially dominant bullpen.

 

If Moncada and Collins are studs, they keep Frazier at a reasonable price, Abreu's got 2018 and 2019...you've suddenly got at least five average or above average players at 2b, C or DH, 3b, SS (Anderson) and 1b. You can definitely see the argument for holding onto Q at least. Corner outfield and DH bats are always more affordable...so let's say you sign Lorenzo Cain for 2018 and 2019, you have a Top Five college bat in the 2018 draft, Saladino possibly as a supersub and the proceeds of Robertson, Nate Jones and Jennings as well.

That's the "if everything goes perfectly" scenario; it's the same thinking the Sox counted on in 2016 with Navarro, Jackson, Rollins and Latos, except that they were vets instead of prospects. They need to move Q. That said, they may be interesting in 2018 and certainly in 2019. Sox have a good place from which to rebuild.

With how bad Detroit, KC, and Minnesota should be...tanking again in 2018 becomes more challenging with Moncada, Collins and the young pitchers.

On the other hand, Cleveland is not only good on the major league level, but they still have a top farm; the Yankees win 84 or so and have a top farm. The Astros and RedSox may have depleted the farm some, but it's still average and they are full of young talent on the major league level.

 

I would look at a guy like Saladino to see if he can become an average 2b or 3B. That could happen with further improvement with the bat.

L Garcia can play IF and OF, and would preclude keeping both a no-hit IF and OF on the roster and save space for a real bat. If he could get the bat above, say, .650 OPS, he could be the super utility player.

Edited January 2, 20179 yr by GreenSox

With how bad Detroit, KC, and Minnesota should be...tanking again in 2018 becomes more challenging with Moncada, Collins and the young pitchers.

I don't think tanking in 2018 is even part of the plan. 2018 is the start of the turnaround. It may be unrealistic to play .500 ball, I dunno, but 2018 is the time to give young talent the chance to succeed and fail in the big leagues. Tanking is what we're doing this year.

That's the "if everything goes perfectly" scenario; it's the same thinking the Sox counted on in 2016 with Navarro, Jackson, Rollins and Latos, except that they were vets instead of prospects. They need to move Q. That said, they may be interesting in 2018 and certainly in 2019. Sox have a good place from which to rebuild.

 

On the other hand, Cleveland is not only good on the major league level, but they still have a top farm; the Yankees win 84 or so and have a top farm. The Astros and RedSox may have depleted the farm some, but it's still average and they are full of young talent on the major league level.

 

I would look at a guy like Saladino to see if he can become an average 2b or 3B. That could happen with further improvement with the bat.

L Garcia can play IF and OF, and would preclude keeping both a no-hit IF and OF on the roster and save space for a real bat. If he could get the bat above, say, .650 OPS, he could be the super utility player.

 

I'll be honest.

 

The odds of Leury being that 25th man on our next playoff team are about the same as discovering that extraterrestrial brain-eating worms (shout out to Mary Elizabeth Winstead's BrainDead) have infiltrated the minds of all our key front office people.

 

Q

Rodon

Kopech

Giolito

Lopez

Fulmer

Hansen

Dunning

Adams

 

That gives us the framework for one of the top 3-5 rotations in baseball and a dominant bullpen centered around Burdi and whatever's left when all the chips like Robertson and Jones are cashed in (and the starters sort themselves out.) If we don't get what we need for Q, Jones, Frazier and Abreu...it doesn't make any sense to dump the last two for 75 cents on the dollar.

 

Cleveland's budget was stretched to the limit with Encarnacion...to the point where they can't afford Rajai Davis. If they lose Carlos Santana after 2017 to free agency, Encarnacion ages quickly and Brantley never is the same (see Sizemore), they'll be vulnerable more quickly than anyone imagined.

 

 

I don't think tanking in 2018 is even part of the plan. 2018 is the start of the turnaround. It may be unrealistic to play .500 ball, I dunno, but 2018 is the time to give young talent the chance to succeed and fail in the big leagues. Tanking is what we're doing this year.

 

And that's the typical rebuild plan. Get 2-3 years worth of top five draft picks.

 

We'll be one year short (not tanking 2018 as well), but we do have Rodon, Anderson, Fulmer, Collins/Burdi/Hansen and 2018's Top 5 pick.

 

Bringing in someone like Lorenzo Cain in 2018 on a two or three year deal makes them closer to respectable without breaking the bank. If Collins makes it as at least a slightly below average defensive catcher who at least frames well, they'll be close.

Edited January 2, 20179 yr by caulfield12