Update: Luis Robert has been cleared according to Rosenthal

[bmags]

So to summarize:

 

Sox would be a likely destination if he is cleared after 6/15

 

Sox would be an unlikely destination before 6/15.

 

Optimistically we have 1.1 million left for 2016. The braves among others could offer, what, 10x that since they are already over cap?

[harfman77]

Can anyone explain to me how Kevin Maitan who some claim to be a "Once in a Generation Talent" signed for 4.25 million while Moncada signed for 31.5 million the year before?

 

Furthermore, highly hyped Cuban prospects such as Yadier Alvarez signed for (16 million) and Lazarito (3 Million)

 

I would be very surprised to see Luis Robert sign for over 3 million due to the fact that I assume teams have already spent a good portion of there allocated money for international free agents.

 

I may be in the minority and having no inside information I could certainly be horribly off base, but my initial observation is that the White Sox can offer a competitive amount of money without going over the spending limit and incurring penalties.

 

For one, its because "generational talent" is the new buzz phrase for prospects.

 

Secondly, Maitan was 16 when he signed with no professional experience. Moncada was 19 and had already had two years of experience in Cubas top professional league. The bust rate of the two players is exponentially different given their distance from the majors and comparable experiences.

 

One thing working against Robert in either class would be that whoever signs him is taking themselves out of the running for Otani, with the exception of a few clubs that have space left in this class like the White Sox, Orioles, and Marlins.

 

The favorites are probably one of the Astros, Athletics, Braves, Cardinals, Nationals, Padres and Reds since they are already over this year, but they will have a 100% penalty on whatever they give him as a bonus which can help keep his cost in a range that the Sox could afford. If I were to guess I would say the favorites are probably the Padres followed by the A's. The Sox are a dark horse and would need to make some moves to get the budget to sign him without affecting next years class.

[harfman77]

So to summarize:

 

Sox would be a likely destination if he is cleared after 6/15

 

Sox would be an unlikely destination before 6/15.

 

Optimistically we have 1.1 million left for 2016. The braves among others could offer, what, 10x that since they are already over cap?

 

Yes, and if the Braves offer 11 million they end up paying another 11 million in taxes.

[Bob Sacamano]

No it doesn't. Sox still have some space under this years limit and can trade for more. With the Sox facing a 40 man roster crunch when Q is traded, they could move some guys off to get additional international slots for the current signing period.

 

We could but I don't see why a team that is already over (like the Padres) wouldn't just continue to spend.

[harfman77]

We could but I don't see why a team that is already over (like the Padres) wouldn't just continue to spend.

 

Thats why I think the Padres or A's would be the favorites, they both have a hard time acquiring ML talent and getting six years of control of a quality player can be worth the upfront expense. The problem they both have is that they operate under budget constraints and may not have the room left in their budgets.

[bmags]

Thats why I think the Padres or A's would be the favorites, they both have a hard time acquiring ML talent and getting six years of control of a quality player can be worth the upfront expense. The problem they both have is that they operate under budget constraints and may not have the room left in their budgets.

 

Padres major league expenses have to be so low right now that they should have room.

[harfman77]

Padres major league expenses have to be so low right now that they should have room.

 

Agree.

[southsider2k5]

Can anyone explain to me how Kevin Maitan who some claim to be a "Once in a Generation Talent" signed for 4.25 million while Moncada signed for 31.5 million the year before?

 

Furthermore, highly hyped Cuban prospects such as Yadier Alvarez signed for (16 million) and Lazarito (3 Million)

 

I would be very surprised to see Luis Robert sign for over 3 million due to the fact that I assume teams have already spent a good portion of there allocated money for international free agents.

 

I may be in the minority and having no inside information I could certainly be horribly off base, but my initial observation is that the White Sox can offer a competitive amount of money without going over the spending limit and incurring penalties.

 

There is a difference between the Cubans and Latin Americans in general when it comes to international signings. Typically the Cuban players are better exposed and have much actual playing experience, while the LA kids are essentially kept on lockdown and pretty much just taught to show off for their trainers showcases. The Cuban kids are a clearer commodity, which allows them to be a better bet than their LA counterparts, even at a similar age.

[Boopa1219]

There is a difference between the Cubans and Latin Americans in general when it comes to international signings. Typically the Cuban players are better exposed and have much actual playing experience, while the LA kids are essentially kept on lockdown and pretty much just taught to show off for their trainers showcases. The Cuban kids are a clearer commodity, which allows them to be a better bet than their LA counterparts, even at a similar age.

 

And a lot of deals in the DR and Venezuela are made in advance of the kid's cycle when they're 14 years old.

[tray]

If the Sox really believe in this player they can go over the international signing bonus and suffer the consequences:

 

All overages are taxed at 100 percent.

Exceed bonus pool by 5 to 10 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $500K in the following international signing period.

Exceed by 10 to 15 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $300K in the following international signing period.

Exceed by more than 15 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $300K in the following two international signing periods.

 

The Sox need All Stars at almost every position to compete for a World Series championship. that is also why Hahn will not trade Q for a bunch of prospects who might make it to the big leagues as average players. Q is the only player left on the roster that might bring back a A+ position player prospect. So the best way to get additional potential All Star type players is from he Draft or from the International signing pool. I say go for it. Try to get this player.

Edited January 15, 2017 by miracleon35th

[steveno89]

If the Sox really believe in this player they can go over the international signing bonus and suffer the consequences:

 

All overages are taxed at 100 percent.

Exceed bonus pool by 5 to 10 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $500K in the following international signing period.

Exceed by 10 to 15 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $300K in the following international signing period.

Exceed by more than 15 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $300K in the following two international signing periods.

 

The Sox need All Stars at almost every position to compete for a World Series championship. that is also why Hahn will not trade Q for a bunch of prospects who might make it to the big leagues as average players. Q is the only player left on the roster that might bring back a A+ position player prospect. So the best way to get additional potential All Star type players is from he Draft or from the International signing pool. I say go for it. Try to get this player.

 

Sox will be active in trying to acquire whatever difference making players they can in the coming years.

 

They will have a ton of payroll flexibility as well.

[BlackSox13]

I don't know enough about the kid to say go for it or not but if the Sox do, having a good history with past cuban Sox players as well as current players Abreu and Moncada could help. Well, that and a substantial contract offer won't hurt either.

Edited January 15, 2017 by BlackSox13

[witesoxfan]

Since it hasn't been addressed in this thread, let me just point out how absolutely ludicrous and overly complicated the international free agency rules are.

[Whitesoxa6]

I remember being hyped when Moncada came over and thought the WhiteSox had a chance to sign him. I highly doubt we take the financial risk on this kid even if we are in a serious rebuild with little financial obligations. Prove me wrong RH

[bmags]

I remember being hyped when Moncada came over and thought the WhiteSox had a chance to sign him. I highly doubt we take the financial risk on this kid even if we are in a serious rebuild with little financial obligations. Prove me wrong RH

 

The difference is this kid if cleared after June 15 is subject to a cap.

[southsider2k5]

If the Sox really believe in this player they can go over the international signing bonus and suffer the consequences:

 

All overages are taxed at 100 percent.

Exceed bonus pool by 5 to 10 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $500K in the following international signing period.

Exceed by 10 to 15 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $300K in the following international signing period.

Exceed by more than 15 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $300K in the following two international signing periods.

 

The Sox need All Stars at almost every position to compete for a World Series championship. that is also why Hahn will not trade Q for a bunch of prospects who might make it to the big leagues as average players. Q is the only player left on the roster that might bring back a A+ position player prospect. So the best way to get additional potential All Star type players is from he Draft or from the International signing pool. I say go for it. Try to get this player.

 

Those rules will only be in effect until the middle of June. Starting July 2, it is a hard cap.

[Y2Jimmy0]

If the Sox really believe in this player they can go over the international signing bonus and suffer the consequences:

 

All overages are taxed at 100 percent.

Exceed bonus pool by 5 to 10 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $500K in the following international signing period.

Exceed by 10 to 15 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $300K in the following international signing period.

Exceed by more than 15 percent: Team is not allowed to sign a player for more than $300K in the following two international signing periods.

 

The Sox need All Stars at almost every position to compete for a World Series championship. that is also why Hahn will not trade Q for a bunch of prospects who might make it to the big leagues as average players. Q is the only player left on the roster that might bring back a A+ position player prospect. So the best way to get additional potential All Star type players is from he Draft or from the International signing pool. I say go for it. Try to get this player.

 

 

They can't though. Sox are rumored to be on guys for this July 2nd period. If they have deals made with those players then they can't over the previous year without reneging on those deals.

[Y2Jimmy0]

Since it hasn't been addressed in this thread, let me just point out how absolutely ludicrous and overly complicated the international free agency rules are.

 

 

I posted this on the FutureSox board awhile ago:

 

Here's the Baseball America (paywall) explanation from Ben Badler: http://www.baseballamerica.com/internation...hyAyO7IBYWtT.97

 

Clubs either get $5.75, $5.25, or $4.75 million to spend on international prospects under 25 per year. Teams can trade all of their bonus amounts but can only acquire 75% of their bonus pool in trade. Here are the amounts.

 

$5.75 million

 

Arizona

Baltimore

Cleveland

Colorado

Kansas City

Pittsburgh

St. Louis

San Diego

 

$5.25 million

 

Cincinnati

Miami

Milwaukee

Minnesota

Oakland

Tampa Bay

 

$4.75 million

 

Atlanta

Boston

Chicago Cubs

Chicago White Sox

Detroit

Houston

LA Angels

LA Dodgers

NYM

NYY

Philly

San Francisco

Seattle

Texas

Toronto

Washington

 

Players that cost $10,000 or less don't count against the pool. The following teams can't spend over $300,000 on a player because they are in the penalty from previous years: Cubs, Dodgers, Giants, Royals, Athletics, Astros, Braves, Cardinals, Nationals, Padres, and Reds. All of those teams can trade their full amounts however. The White Sox can trade for up to $3.5 million more in international money. This is absolutely something that they should be doing. White Sox can spend $8.3 million internationally if they trade for the maximum that they can. I'll be very curious to see if they do this.

[southsider2k5]

They can't though. Sox are rumored to be on guys for this July 2nd period. If they have deals made with those players then they can't over the previous year without reneging on those deals.

 

The one thing that might actually be working for the White Sox right now is the $4.75 million allotment they get from the new CBA is actually way more than they got in this year. Being 10th got them 2.973 million. If they had been working off of the assumption that they were going to have around the same or less, they actually ended up with about $1.8 million more. Figuring that most teams already have their deals for July 2 done, this might give them a chance at someone they didn't have a chance at before. Could it be Robert? Who knows, just a thought.

 

These new caps could have also destroyed plans for any team that had already planned on blowing away the old cap numbers.

[bmags]

From FG Eric Longenhagen chat:

JH

12:46 What kind of draft range would you put on L. Robert? Is he a first-round type talent?

Eric A Longenhagen

12:46 Oh yes. Top 10.

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/eric-longen...ies-to-removal/

[Whitesoxa6]

Really hope the White Sox grab this guy. Don't care if we go way over pool if he is as advertised by the scouts

[Bob Sacamano]

Really hope the White Sox grab this guy. Don't care if we go way over pool if he is as advertised by the scouts

 

Can't go over in new CBA.

[BamaDoc]

So Hou and Wash are both under penalty and can't spend over 300k on any one player? So we send money with Robertson and get players and international pool money. Same for Q to Hou and presto we could have a winning bid for Robert?????

[bmags]

So Hou and Wash are both under penalty and can't spend over 300k on any one player? So we send money with Robertson and get players and international pool money. Same for Q to Hou and presto we could have a winning bid for Robert?????

 

Only if he does not get cleared until 6/15.

[southsider2k5]

Only if he does not get cleared until 6/15.

 

Even if he is cleared this year, he could wait until next signing period. Though with the change in rules, teams that are already over spending pools have way more incentive to bid now if he is cleared before the deadline.