October 3, 20178 yr I have minimal interest Stanton SHOULD fetch a megapackage but has an awful deal so we'll see I'd rather pay Machado $256M over 8 years than trade away all of our riches for Stanton
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 03:07 PM) There is no way in hell I'd even think about trading Collins. I'm not sure I'd be very happy about trading Fulmer after his callup performance, but I would probably do Fulmer for Stanton. Fulmer +? Yeah this is where I hit my wall.
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 03:07 PM) There is no way in hell I'd even think about trading Collins. No one wanted Fulmer 1 month ago and Collins had a bad year. I think that's fair. Remember I did say I'd like money back too. I think that's about what it would take to land Stanton and I'd be willing to do it for those two. I think Fulmer at BEST CASE SCENARIO is a 7th inning guy. Collins had a bad year but still has some projection so he's harder to peg but his terrible K% is extremely serious since he was supposed to dominate the minors with the bat.. He couldn't even handle A+ ball.. This is a fun topic!
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (cjgalloway @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 04:02 PM) No one wanted Fulmer 1 month ago and Collins had a bad year. I think that's fair. Remember I did say I'd like money back too. I think that's about what it would take to land Stanton and I'd be willing to do it for those two. I think Fulmer at BEST CASE SCENARIO is a 7th inning guy. Collins had a bad year but still has some projection so he's harder to peg but his terrible K% is extremely serious since he was supposed to dominate the minors with the bat.. He couldn't even handle A+ ball.. This is a fun topic! I don't think Collins had a bad year by any stretch of the imagination. He's been in the system for one full season, and showed good power and plate discipline. A small tweak here or there and he's a .230 or .250 hitter, and he provides plenty of value to the MLB club as such. Fulmer has been with the Sox for a while now and it seems we know what we have with him, so I understand that. Collins doesn't make any sense.
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 02:07 PM) There is no way in hell I'd even think about trading Collins. Why not?
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (oldsox @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 04:11 PM) Why not? Not for Giancarlo Stanton. And it's because he's a viable catcher who can hit for power and draw walks. As I said, a slight tweak and he can improve his hitting. If I knew what the tweak was, I wouldn't be here. And if he's hitting .230, he's probably a 2-3 WAR player as long as he isn't absolutely terrible behind the plate, because his power and eye will play at the big league level. Zack Collins is a valuable prospect for the White Sox despite a down season with regards to his batting average.
October 3, 20178 yr Author QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 04:09 PM) I don't think Collins had a bad year by any stretch of the imagination. He's been in the system for one full season, and showed good power and plate discipline. A small tweak here or there and he's a .230 or .250 hitter, and he provides plenty of value to the MLB club as such. Fulmer has been with the Sox for a while now and it seems we know what we have with him, so I understand that. Collins doesn't make any sense. I too don't understand where the "Collins had a bad year" agenda-pushers came from. I'll take an .816 OPS with his defensive improvements any day.
October 3, 20178 yr Rutherford is the name that I think could make the most sense on both sides to kind of start a package. Once again, I really have no clue what kind of trade value Stanton has as he's such a unique case but Blake is the name that keeps popping up in my head for some reason.
October 3, 20178 yr I was intrigued by this idea on an Avi swap, but I'm out. This guy could easily turn into an Albert Pujols in his 30s situation.
October 3, 20178 yr Would rather keep the prospects, the $250M+, try to extend Avi and stay the course of the rebuild.
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (bmags @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 04:21 PM) I was intrigued by this idea on an Avi swap, but I'm out. This guy could easily turn into an Albert Pujols in his 30s situation. Not that you're wrong to be skeptical, but Pujols didn't really hit a wall until he was 33, which would give the Sox a theoretical 5 years of plus production. Also, until this year, Pujols was still a good hitter, so that would be 8 years of production. And, not that I have any definitive proof, but despite the old player skills, I have a feeling Stanton will age better than that, but that's mere gut feeling.
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 04:14 PM) I too don't understand where the "Collins had a bad year" agenda-pushers came from. I'll take an .816 OPS with his defensive improvements any day. I think a lot of people think his walk rate will dry up in the high minors and MLB. I'm not really so sure. Look at a guy like Narvaez, he's hardly a slugger, and yet he has great strike zone judgement and in general isn't afraid to go deep into counts. It's not like pitchers are afraid to throw him strikes he just has a good eye. We'll see what happens with Collins but if he's a decent defensive catcher just hitting 230/300/400 puts him around 2 WAR.
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 04:35 PM) I think a lot of people think his walk rate will dry up in the high minors and MLB. I'm not really so sure. Look at a guy like Narvaez, he's hardly a slugger, and yet he has great strike zone judgement and in general isn't afraid to go deep into counts. It's not like pitchers are afraid to throw him strikes he just has a good eye. We'll see what happens with Collins but if he's a decent defensive catcher just hitting 230/300/400 puts him around 2 WAR. Exactly, and if the pristine walk rate and solid power translate to the majors, he's an incredibly valuable, if unsexy, catcher at the MLB level. He ran an 18.5% BB rate this year. Even with a strikeout rate of 27.4%, that's great plate discipline. I think he's a guy who could explode next year and possibly make his debut if they're comfortable enough with his development behind the plate.
October 3, 20178 yr I would want this to happen purely because Stanton is my favorite player to watch highlights of. Some of the bombs he hits dear lord... Rationally, it's not worth doing unless we give up A) no prospects or B) give up minor prospects or guys on down years and get Miami to take on some of that contract. I doubt either will happen (no matter what they say I doubt Miami lets him go for nothing) so I think this is a pipe dream.
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 04:27 PM) Would rather keep the prospects, the $250M+, try to extend Avi and stay the course of the rebuild. this is where I'm at. No thanks. Enjoy Yankee pinstripes Giancario.....
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (Wanne @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 05:09 PM) this is where I'm at. No thanks. Enjoy Yankee pinstripes Giancario..... Getting 100+ dingers out of your corner outfielders would be decent...
October 3, 20178 yr While I’d most definitely pass on Stanton, the projected 2020 lineup is tantalizing: 1. Robert, CF 2. Moncada, 3. Stanton, RF 4. Abreu, DH 5. Jimenez, LF 6. Collins, C 7. Burger, 3B 8. Sheets/FA, 1B 9. Anderson, SS
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 06:43 PM) See,I just don't agree that his contract sucks. I think if you can get him without giving up your a-level contracts, you do it. He's going to ba very good player during the window we compete. I understand your position but I just don't see that happening. Basically what your expecting Miami to do is a salary dump. Plus Stanton is certainly the Marlins big name draw to the ballpark so trading him might not be in their best interests
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 04:20 PM) Getting 100+ dingers out of your corner outfielders would be decent... As intriguing as that sounds...I just don't like the cost.
October 3, 20178 yr After reading most of this thread, I was watching PTI and there was a comment by Derek Jeter to the effect that there will be some very unpopular decisions to be made. Nothing specific, however, unless I missed it.
October 3, 20178 yr Author QUOTE (oldsox @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 05:53 PM) After reading most of this thread, I was watching PTI and there was a comment by Derek Jeter to the effect that there will be some very unpopular decisions to be made. Nothing specific, however, unless I missed it. Yelich?
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (Wanne @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 05:42 PM) As intriguing as that sounds...I just don't like the cost. I meant for the Yankees with Judge. If adding Stanton gave the Sox 100+ dingers that means Eloy or Roberts are awesome which I also am not opposed to.
October 3, 20178 yr If Stanton was a FA in 2019 with Bryce/Machado class, would you want the Sox to give 10/285m to a 29 year old corner outfielder? I'd rather offer that same deal to a 25 year old Machado
October 3, 20178 yr QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 06:17 PM) If Stanton was a FA in 2019 with Bryce/Machado class, would you want the Sox to give 10/285m to a 29 year old corner outfielder? I'd rather offer that same deal to a 25 year old Machado Machado is probably going to get a good deal more than that.
October 3, 20178 yr Author QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Oct 3, 2017 -> 06:17 PM) If Stanton was a FA in 2019 with Bryce/Machado class, would you want the Sox to give 10/285m to a 29 year old corner outfielder? I'd rather offer that same deal to a 25 year old Machado He'd likely decline. And there's no way the Sox (or any team acquiring Stanton) would be paying all of that $285m.
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