April 26, 20196 yr 4 hours ago, turnin' two said: It still doesn't make sense. They wanted to save 50 million on the last 2 years of his deal, so they basically waste 40 million this season ( I know guys like Colome and Herrera aren't wastes in terms of their on field quality, but they are a waste in terms of having a good set up man and closer on a 100 loss team doesn't really do much for you -- now maybe they are traded for solid assets, but who knows.). Great post. This is exactly the point. Colome and Herrera are good acquisitions... for a team in contention the next two years, not this one. And we shall see what type of prospects they actually bring back.
April 29, 20196 yr Does Ervin Santana's agent realize there are no more rick hahn's in the league to sign him?
April 29, 20196 yr 1 minute ago, bmags said: Does Ervin Santana's agent realize there are no more rick hahn's in the league to sign him? I get not wanting to play in the minors, but I can't fathom showing your ass too the world the way he did and expecting to not lose a ton of money in turning that down.
April 29, 20196 yr 4 minutes ago, mqr said: Dammit, why is he bailing these morons out. Wow, I didn't know they could send him down. Must have been the minor league contract. That saves some cash. So not nearly as dopey as thought.
April 29, 20196 yr Wow - so basically the Sox only owe him the pro-rated amount of $4.3M, which should be about $425-450k. Not nearly as bad as $4.3M. Also, that was really dumb of Santana.
April 29, 20196 yr 8 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: Wow, I didn't know they could send him down. Must have been the minor league contract. That saves some cash. So not nearly as dopey as thought. It was a minor league contract but it became a fully guaranteed major league deal when they called him up. You can send any player down but once they reach a certain service time plateau they have the right to deny the assignment and become a free agent.
April 29, 20196 yr 4 minutes ago, Kalapse said: It was a minor league contract but it became a fully guaranteed major league deal when they called him up. You can send any player down but once they reach a certain service time plateau they have the right to deny the assignment and become a free agent. That is what we all thought, but it turns out the Sox made Santana sign a 45-day advance consent clause. Basically what that means is that a team can release a player within the first 45 days of the season without any future obligations. So basically the Sox owe him the pro-rated about of $4.3M, which based on his amount of time on the roster, should be less $450k.
April 29, 20196 yr 5 minutes ago, Kalapse said: It was a minor league contract but it became a fully guaranteed major league deal when they called him up. You can send any player down but once they reach a certain service time plateau they have the right to deny the assignment and become a free agent. Feels like there was a handshake deal, between the rushing to get him up for the deadline to turning down the assignment despite it being very unlikely there would be a comparable second deal (but perhaps he is going to retire rather than actually live life as a minor leaguer). But strange that they would do a handshake deal, probably just idea that he's made a lot and doesn't want to go through that at this point.
April 29, 20196 yr 1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said: That is what we all thought, but it turns out the Sox made Santana sign a 45-day advance consent clause. Basically what that means is that a team can release a player within the first 45 days of the season without any future obligations. So basically the Sox owe him the pro-rated about of $4.3M, which based on his amount of time on the roster, should be less $450k. Oh, where did you read this? I thought we heard on Friday it was guaranteed.
April 29, 20196 yr 4 minutes ago, bmags said: Oh, where did you read this? I thought we heard on Friday it was guaranteed. That is what everyone thought. Turns out he signed the 45 day consent form. Probably why Hahn was somewhat coy when asked about dropping $4.3M on Santana. Basically he said (paraphrasing) that's not for sure. Everyone thought that meant Hahn was saying someone else could pick up Santana, but (obviously) Hahn knew about the advance consent. FWIW - it is not 100% clear to me if Santana accepted his assignment, if the $4.3M would have still been due to him. https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/04/white-sox-designate-ervin-santana-for-assignment.html Edited April 29, 20196 yr by ChiSox59
April 29, 20196 yr 2 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: That is what everyone thought. Turns out he signed the 45 day consent form. Probably why Hahn was somewhat coy when asked about dropping $4.3M on Santana. Basically said that's not sure. Everyone thought that meant Hahn was saying someone else could pick up Santana, but (obviously) Hahn knew about the advance consent. FWIW - it is not 100% clear to me if Santana accepted his assignment, if the $4.3M would have still been due to him. https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/04/white-sox-designate-ervin-santana-for-assignment.html Maybe the plan was/ is to have Cease up by that 45 day deadline and launch Santana? It makes sense under the guise of he was never going to make it past 45 days anyway. Edited April 29, 20196 yr by mqr
April 29, 20196 yr 1 minute ago, mqr said: Maybe the plan was/ is to have Cease up by that 45 day deadline and launch Santana? It makes sense under the guise of he was never going to make it past 45 days anyway. Doubt Cease had anything to do with it. I'm guessing Santana preferred to bet on himself and make $4.3M if he pitched well and hung in the big leagues as opposed to taking some other much lower deal that may have been fully guaranteed.
April 29, 20196 yr Welp now it turns out that signing Santana wasn't very dumb at all. Rolled the dice, he didn't work out, hardly any money wasted especially given the potential upside of the deal when it was signed.
April 29, 20196 yr 1 minute ago, Jake said: Welp now it turns out that signing Santana wasn't very dumb at all. Rolled the dice, he didn't work out, hardly any money wasted especially given the potential upside of the deal when it was signed. Yah. The Sox did something right here. Credit where credit is due, and such. I imagine this was part of the negotiation. So Ervin, your best offer is currently $2.15M, we'll double that, but if we DFA you within the first 45 days of the season and you reject the assignment, you're only due the pro-rated amount of $4.3M. A man who has made over $110M in his career probably went for the upside at a place he felt he had a good opportunity.
April 29, 20196 yr 5 minutes ago, Jake said: Welp now it turns out that signing Santana wasn't very dumb at all. Rolled the dice, he didn't work out, hardly any money wasted especially given the potential upside of the deal when it was signed. I wouldn't go this far. Let's remember he was very bad last year and bad this year, and the purpose was to get a stabile, consistent vet that wouldn't get us into short inning blow outs. Brett Anderson, Martin Perez or Buchholz are not great but have provided some decent starts this year.
April 29, 20196 yr 1 minute ago, bmags said: I wouldn't go this far. Let's remember he was very bad last year and bad this year, and the purpose was to get a stabile, consistent vet that wouldn't get us into short inning blow outs. Brett Anderson, Martin Perez or Buchholz are not great but have provided some decent starts this year. They paid him less than the league min. At this point, its a complete non issue.
April 29, 20196 yr 4 minutes ago, bmags said: I wouldn't go this far. Let's remember he was very bad last year and bad this year, and the purpose was to get a stabile, consistent vet that wouldn't get us into short inning blow outs. Brett Anderson, Martin Perez or Buchholz are not great but have provided some decent starts this year. I'm sticking by it as "not dumb," which isn't meant to be a huge compliment. The deal had upside — maybe you get something like the old Ervin Santana for just $4 million — but not a lot of downside since we had the right to cut him loose right away with no strings attached. Considering Santana refused his assignment and the continued pro-rated payments that would go with it, I wonder if his plan now is to retire. I don't see any way he gets another MLB shot without going through the minors first and nobody is going to pay him as much as we were to pitch in AAA.
April 29, 20196 yr 1 minute ago, Jake said: I'm sticking by it as "not dumb," which isn't meant to be a huge compliment. The deal had upside — maybe you get something like the old Ervin Santana for just $4 million — but not a lot of downside since we had the right to cut him loose right away with no strings attached. Considering Santana refused his assignment and the continued pro-rated payments that would go with it, I wonder if his plan now is to retire. I don't see any way he gets another MLB shot without going through the minors first and nobody is going to pay him as much as we were to pitch in AAA. The White Sox have been very bad at free agency and I would like to see even low stakes signings like this accomplish the job they set out to accomplish which was get below average, but consistent innings and production while being nice clubhouse guys. There was several guys they could go after, and once again, their scouts identified a player that could not come close to accomplishing that. That they didn't sign Lance Lynn to also be bad isn't something I'm prepared to congratulate them for yet. I want to see just some baseline competency of "we signed this guy to a deal, will give him opportunity, and while not good, was an mlb player, not aggressively bad."
April 29, 20196 yr Considering how short of a leash they had on him, I figured they had to have had some type of out clause on the $4.3M. Especially when they don’t have many good options behind him.
April 29, 20196 yr On 4/26/2019 at 12:09 PM, Harper2Sox said: My god, what did Santana get paid? $4.3 million total which ultimately equates to $1.4 million a start? Did he ever even throw above 91 mph? Hahn is an absolute joke. I’d love to be his friend though. Maybe he would just give me some money if I asked nicely since he has no problem wasting millions. I agree with calling trolls out and asking posters who aren't trolls to apologize for premature, un-researched, off-the-cuff. thoughtless, provocative remarks, I'm waiting...
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