Just now, Jack Parkman said:

If the Sox could get Frazier that would be great, I'm not sure I want to give up on Lopez yet though. 

We would have so much position player cost certainty though, and we are developing so many pitchers at once.

6 minutes ago, bmags said:

We would have so much position player cost certainty though, and we are developing so many pitchers at once.

I understand the argument completely, but if you're punting on Lopez I'd rather it be for someone like Conforto, who has a track record and is a LH bat that this lineup needs. 

Edited June 14, 20196 yr by Jack Parkman

 

1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said:

I understand the argument completely, but if you're punting on Lopez I'd rather it be for someone like Conforto, who has a track record and is a LH bat that this lineup needs. 

But the yankees may actually trade Frazier. And would like SP. Would they want one of the worst pitchers this year if he's young and cost controlled? I hope so!

4 hours ago, mqr said:

 

Patrice... my man

A lot of hype surrounding tonight. Feels like the biggest stage for a White Sox starter in years. I don't like it... lol

I don’t think it’s been mentioned, but Lucas is going for win 10 tonight and we aren’t even at the 70 game mark!  That’s wild as fuck!!

4 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I don’t think it’s been mentioned, but Lucas is going for win 10 tonight and we aren’t even at the 70 game mark!  That’s wild as fuck!!

James Baldwin 2000 territory.

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I don’t think it’s been mentioned, but Lucas is going for win 10 tonight and we aren’t even at the 70 game mark!  That’s wild as fuck!!

And he’s been on the Injured List this season too.

Should be a good one tonight!

1 hour ago, bmags said:

James Baldwin 2000 territory.

 

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I don’t think it’s been mentioned, but Lucas is going for win 10 tonight and we aren’t even at the 70 game mark!  That’s wild as fuck!!

Sale had 14 beginning July in 2016 just barely past the halfway point.

He finished the season with only 17 wins. 

Now... that is wild as fuck. 

 

 

40 minutes ago, Richie said:

 

Sale had 14 beginning July in 2016 just barely past the halfway point.

He finished the season with only 17 wins. 

Now... that is wild as fuck. 

 

 

I predict that one of the WAR guys is going to tell you wins don't matter.  I know...I think that's a load of crap too.

I am actually nervous for a game, that is a weird feeling I haven't had in a long time

5 minutes ago, poppysox said:

I predict that one of the WAR guys is going to tell you wins don't matter.  I know...I think that's a load of crap too.

Wins are important to the team as a whole and probably mean a lot to each pitcher because they want to have a W next to their name, but evaluating pitchers based on a W/L record is ridiculous.  

1 minute ago, Sleepy Harold said:

Wins are important to the team as a whole and probably mean a lot to each pitcher because they want to have a W next to their name, but evaluating pitchers based on a W/L record is ridiculous.  

Told you so.

4 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Told you so.

Where am I wrong?  Jacob DeGrom was a very pedestrian 10-9 last season.  Evaluating him based on W/L record would indicate that he had a mediocre season (which we all know couldn't be further from the truth). 

6 minutes ago, Sleepy Harold said:

Where am I wrong?  Jacob DeGrom was a very pedestrian 10-9 last season.  Evaluating him based on W/L record would indicate that he had a mediocre season (which we all know couldn't be further from the truth). 

Wins will always and should be one of the statistics that have value in evaluating a starting pitcher.  Many pitchers have had the ability to do what needs to be done in order to win.  They knew that in order to pitch 200+ innings they didn't try to strike everyone out.  They knew how to pace themselves for the long haul.  

14 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Told you so.

He's absolutely correct. This isn't some crazy stat-geek thing, it's common sense. A pitcher has no control over the offense that backs him. Pitching masterfully with a horse-shit offense can still quite often result in a loss or a no decision. Judging a pitcher on a wins/loss record is antiquated thinking, and thankfully most people have accepted that nowadays.

1 minute ago, poppysox said:

Wins will always and should be one of the statistics that have value in evaluating a starting pitcher.  Many pitchers have had the ability to do what needs to be done in order to win.  They knew that in order to pitch 200+ innings they didn't try to strike everyone out.  They knew how to pace themselves for the long haul.  

Can’t win a game if your offense doesn’t score runs or the bullpen blows a lead.  That right there proves wins are more or less meaningless for evaluating starters (although still a fun stat to cheer for).

Just now, DirtySox said:

He's absolutely correct. This isn't some crazy stat-geek thing, it's common sense. A pitcher has no control over the offense that backs him. Pitching masterfully with a horse-shit offense can still quite often result in a loss or a no decision. Judging a pitcher on a wins/loss record is antiquated thinking, and thankfully most people have accepted that nowadays.

Didn't say it was a crazy stat-geek thing.  I make the point Wins are a meaningful stat.  Can you name some 20 game winners who were horse-shit pitchers?

10 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Didn't say it was a crazy stat-geek thing.  I make the point Wins are a meaningful stat.  Can you name some 20 game winners who were horse-shit pitchers?

Dogshit no but mediocre?  Sure.  J.A Happ.  Definition of "mediocre starter".  Career 4.14 FIP, ERA+ of 105: won 20 games with the 2016 Blue Jays.

If any mediocre starter like Happ plays on a good team (Blue Jays won 89 games that year) and pitches around 200 innings he'll have a shot.

Edited June 14, 20196 yr by chitownsportsfan

34 minutes ago, Sleepy Harold said:

Wins are important to the team as a whole and probably mean a lot to each pitcher because they want to have a W next to their name, but evaluating pitchers based on a W/L record is ridiculous.  

Wins aren't everything but if a pitcher wins a lot of games he is good. At the very least he gives his team a chance to win more often than not. I still want Gio to be our number 3 next season in terms of career accomplishments. I want two veteran pitchers to round out our staff, push Rodon to the bullpen, and to protect us against injury. 

17 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Didn't say it was a crazy stat-geek thing.  I make the point Wins are a meaningful stat.  Can you name some 20 game winners who were horse-shit pitchers?

It's meaningful, just not as meaningful as it used to be (and rightfully so) since the baseball community has evolved and learned of better and more efficient ways to evaluate pitchers. It's not that hard, you may not like it but it's much better this way IMO.

Edited June 14, 20196 yr by Sleepy Harold

2 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said:

Wins aren't everything but if a pitcher wins a lot of games he is good. At the very least he gives his team a chance to win more often than not. I still want Gio to be our number 3 next season in terms of career accomplishments. I want two veteran pitchers to round out our staff, push Rodon to the bullpen, and to protect us against injury. 

Yeah 100%, I could get behind that plan for next season.

1 minute ago, Sleepy Harold said:

It's meaningful, just not as meaningful as it used to be (and rightfully so) since the baseball community has evolved and learned of better and more efficient ways to evaluate pitchers. It's not that hard, you may not like it but it's the better this way IMO.

Again...I didn't say I didn't like some of the new stats.  I just think there is a reason the Official White Sox site shows who has the highest batting average, who has hit the most HR's and who has the most RBI's.  The box score give running totals on those traditional statistics.  No mention on what the individual WHIP or WAR stats are.  I have yet to see an individual WAR stat and registering shock at how good or bad that player is.  Without looking it up I know Alonso isn't playing for shit...I don't need to see his WAR to know that.  I'll bet Giolito looks great weather I look at his 10-1 W/L record or his ERA or his WHIP.  I actually think that WAR has more value in evaluating some middle of pack sort of players.

9 minutes ago, Sleepy Harold said:

Yeah 100%, I could get behind that plan for next season.

As could I.

From Twitter is appears Yoan took BP this evening and is still eyeing a return this weekend.