James Fegan prompted this:

Quote

Would you trade him for Wander Franco? Do you want the best prospect — or the player who’s ready now?

https://theathletic.com/1731318/2020/04/14/who-would-you-rather-have-luis-robert-or-wander-franco?source=shared-article

 

Oh boy. Yes, probably.

11 minutes ago, bmags said:

Oh boy. Yes, probably.

I would take franco because his k to bb ratio makes him less risky plus he is a shortstop.

Robert with his k to bb is more risky albeit acuna and tatis also had bad k to bb in the minors and raked (by slightly improving k to bb and tons of power and speed).

Also talents like franco with great tools, advanced hit and great plate discipline often take very little time in the upper minors (like soto) so franco could be ready some time in late 2020 too albeit the Rays are not a team bringing up prospects early.

That is an interesting question, and one I think requires more specifics.  IF I AM THE 2020 WHITE SOX, no. 

Reason #1:  We have a starting SS in Tim Anderson, a starting 3B in Yoan Moncada, and Nick Madrigal on the way.  What do we have in CF?  Adam Engel?  Leury Garcia?  The marginal gain of replacing a successful Franco versus Anderson or Moncada is WAY less, than Robert replacing our current CF's.

Reason #2:  We are trying to edge our way into competition, and Franco is probably a late 20 or 2021 addition.  So not only do you lose your best CF prospect, and that output for 2020, but you don't gain Franco's output for some period of time that is still TBD.

Reason #3:  We already have a long term deal worked out with Robert that gives us cost and service security going forward.

 

Franco could well end up being better than Robert in the long run, but that doesn't mean he is the best fit for the team and for today.

I honestly prefer Robert to Franco straight up by a decent amount.  Franco obviously is great but I am still baffled that he is a FULL GRADE above everyone else..  Robert has done it against better competition.  Give me Robert.

56 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

That is an interesting question, and one I think requires more specifics.  IF I AM THE 2020 WHITE SOX, no. 

Reason #1:  We have a starting SS in Tim Anderson, a starting 3B in Yoan Moncada, and Nick Madrigal on the way.  What do we have in CF?  Adam Engel?  Leury Garcia?  The marginal gain of replacing a successful Franco versus Anderson or Moncada is WAY less, than Robert replacing our current CF's.

Reason #2:  We are trying to edge our way into competition, and Franco is probably a late 20 or 2021 addition.  So not only do you lose your best CF prospect, and that output for 2020, but you don't gain Franco's output for some period of time that is still TBD.

Reason #3:  We already have a long term deal worked out with Robert that gives us cost and service security going forward.

 

Franco could well end up being better than Robert in the long run, but that doesn't mean he is the best fit for the team and for today.

Great answer.  Robert fits us better in spite of Franco being perhaps the slightly better player.  They both play premium positions so you can't really go wrong.

Here's one more for you.

If Luis Robert had stayed healthy in 2018...would this be a different question?

2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

That is an interesting question, and one I think requires more specifics.  IF I AM THE 2020 WHITE SOX, no. 

Reason #1:  We have a starting SS in Tim Anderson, a starting 3B in Yoan Moncada, and Nick Madrigal on the way.  What do we have in CF?  Adam Engel?  Leury Garcia?  The marginal gain of replacing a successful Franco versus Anderson or Moncada is WAY less, than Robert replacing our current CF's.

Reason #2:  We are trying to edge our way into competition, and Franco is probably a late 20 or 2021 addition.  So not only do you lose your best CF prospect, and that output for 2020, but you don't gain Franco's output for some period of time that is still TBD.

Reason #3:  We already have a long term deal worked out with Robert that gives us cost and service security going forward.

 

Franco could well end up being better than Robert in the long run, but that doesn't mean he is the best fit for the team and for today.

Reason #2 assumes there is baseball in 2020.

4 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Here's one more for you.

If Luis Robert had stayed healthy in 2018...would this be a different question?

Let's not add more hypotheticals here. He did get injured quite frequently, and you need to factor that into the equation. 

5 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Reason #2 assumes there is baseball in 2020.

That seems pretty obvious. 

14 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Reason #2 assumes there is baseball in 2020.

A possible wrinkle to this: If MLB comes back, but the minors don't, how does that affect Franco's development compared to Robert?

I probably would (then you can trade Anderson for a CF later on or see if TA can play CF adequately). I usually don't risk trading ML ready guys for A ball prospects but Franco is lone exception. Kid is that good. If Tatis Jr. were still here though, this wouldn't even be a question but alas...

47 minutes ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

Let's not add more hypotheticals here. He did get injured quite frequently, and you need to factor that into the equation. 

for a different way of saying it - if Robert had 2 straight seasons of putting up 1.000+ OPS numbers in the minors and had spent more of last year at Charlotte doing so, would he be the consensus top prospect above Franco?

39 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

I probably would (then you can trade Anderson for a CF later on or see if TA can play CF adequately). I usually don't risk trading ML ready guys for A ball prospects but Franco is lone exception. Kid is that good. If Tatis Jr. were still here though, this wouldn't even be a question but alas...

Damn you! Damn you to hell!

It's official: COVID-19 has impacted the Forum

I wouldn't trade Robert for all the tea in China if I were the Sox.

Franco is the only guy I think I'd even consider.  But in the end, I'm keeping Robert, for a few reasons. 

First, honestly, a bit of emotional attachment (this is for me, not saying how a franchise should operate).  I have been very heavily invested in following the path of Robert ever since the Sox were rumored to be interested.  I'd hate to throw all that emotional attachment away.  And for the record, no I am not John Paxon.

Secondly, he fits perfectly.  Robert is basically the perfect addition to this team right now.  He fits positionally.  He fits the window.  He fits the lineup.  He even fits the White Sox legacy of great Cuban players.  He just fits.

Third, is the contract.  The Sox have already extended their control for 2 more prime years on Robert.  

Their ceilings are pretty darn close.  The both have great potential to be star players with the bat and the glove in premium positions.  They both have physical tools that are off the charts.  They have both obliterated minor league pitching.  Could Wander be better? Sure.  Could Luis?  Sure.  And right now, quite simply, Robert is safer.  When the season starts, he'll be in the bigs.  He has arrived.  He also signed an extension, which removes some uncertainty.  His contract includes options, so that safeguards the team.  Franco carries a little more risk, in that he is further away and in terms of contract status when he arrives.  To me, even emotional attachment aside, I'm taking Robert.

22 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

Franco is the only guy I think I'd even consider.  But in the end, I'm keeping Robert, for a few reasons. 

First, honestly, a bit of emotional attachment (this is for me, not saying how a franchise should operate).  I have been very heavily invested in following the path of Robert ever since the Sox were rumored to be interested.  I'd hate to throw all that emotional attachment away.  And for the record, no I am not John Paxon.

Secondly, he fits perfectly.  Robert is basically the perfect addition to this team right now.  He fits positionally.  He fits the window.  He fits the lineup.  He even fits the White Sox legacy of great Cuban players.  He just fits.

Third, is the contract.  The Sox have already extended their control for 2 more prime years on Robert.  

Their ceilings are pretty darn close.  The both have great potential to be star players with the bat and the glove in premium positions.  They both have physical tools that are off the charts.  They have both obliterated minor league pitching.  Could Wander be better? Sure.  Could Luis?  Sure.  And right now, quite simply, Robert is safer.  When the season starts, he'll be in the bigs.  He has arrived.  He also signed an extension, which removes some uncertainty.  His contract includes options, so that safeguards the team.  Franco carries a little more risk, in that he is further away and in terms of contract status when he arrives.  To me, even emotional attachment aside, I'm taking Robert.

Minor nitpick, but it's just one additional year as they would have held him down early this year for the 7th year of control.

18 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

for a different way of saying it - if Robert had 2 straight seasons of putting up 1.000+ OPS numbers in the minors and had spent more of last year at Charlotte doing so, would he be the consensus top prospect above Franco?

Man, no doubt right?  Centerfielders with his tools aren’t really out there outside of a couple of super elite guys.  
 

There seems to be enough really good young shortstops in the league right now though to the point that the shine has worn a bit on the insane value associated with them.  Having a premier shortstop is something half (guessing) the league has now?

 

 

16 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

Minor nitpick, but it's just one additional year as they would have held him down early this year for the 7th year of control.

Sure, but then they don't a full year of usage out of him.

32 minutes ago, Jerksticks said:

Man, no doubt right?  Centerfielders with his tools aren’t really out there outside of a couple of super elite guys.  
 

There seems to be enough really good young shortstops in the league right now though to the point that the shine has worn a bit on the insane value associated with them.  Having a premier shortstop is something half (guessing) the league has now?

 

 

We already have a shortstop with the tools to become elite.  I'm sticking with Robert.

47 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Sure, but then they don't a full year of usage out of him.

More like, a year and 2 week add really. 

17 minutes ago, poppysox said:

We already have a shortstop with the tools to become elite.  I'm sticking with Robert.

Exactly

1 hour ago, soxfan2014 said:

More like, a year and 2 week add really. 

Doesn't exactly change the point though.  Seven years of Robert, starting now, is still better than 6 years of Franco, starting, next year?  2 years?  it is still a check mark in the certainty column for Robert vs uncertainty for Franco.

Edited April 15, 20206 yr by turnin' two

The contract puts it over the top. I'd love to see Robert play twenty years for the Sox but on the other hand we have already seen what a high value contract can do for the organization as well.

Edited April 15, 20206 yr by Vulture