1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:

That's Lawyer speak for Go F@$$ Yourself. 

Yep.

Players also making it clear that they're done negotiating in public.

21 minutes ago, Quin said:

Players also making it clear that they're done negotiating in public.

Until the CBA negotiations.

According to Andrew Marchard of the New York Post, MLB and Turner Sports have reached a new billion-dollar agreement to continue broadcasting postseason games on TBS and TNT.

Exact terms of the deal have not been revealed. However, it is known that Turner Sports will retain rights to one league championship series.

In 2012, Turner Sports committed to pay $325 million a year for a package that includes one league championship series, two division series and extensive digital rights, according to Sports Business Journal. That contract, which included 13 regular-season Sunday afternoon games, is set to expire following the 2021 season.

During that contract, Turner Sports alternated broadcasting the ALCS and NLCS with FOX Sports.

The report notes that ESPN/ABC was making a move to acquire more postseason broadcasts before the Turner deal was reached. If and when MLB expands its postseason, that would open up another opportunity for ESPN to jump in. That decision seems inevitable at this point given the money Turner Sports and FOX Sports have been willing to spend. In 2018, FOX agreed to pay $525 million annually for regular-season games, the All-Star game and postseason games through 2021.

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/report-mlb-turner-sports-reach-billiondollar-agreement-to-broadcast-playoff-games-202757382.html

When you start talking about additional contracts in the billions, a loss of $15-25 million on the season per team is nothing.  If the operating margins are that thin, then just sell to another owner who can actually afford to run a competitive team.  There’s always going to be interested parties out there with so many new billionaires in this tech/venture capital/hedge fund economy.

Edited June 14, 20205 yr by caulfield12

4 hours ago, Rowand44 said:

This.

The owners are just full of shit.  Always have been.  

^^^^^

47 minutes ago, ptatc said:

Maybe but now they have a negotiating specifically directed at the union for not bargaining.  If they players give in some the players could come back and say that we gave what you wanted. The rhetoric for the next CBA will be fun to watch.

No it won't. The owners and players aren't even in the same galaxy cluster. There's virtually zero chance of baseball in 2022 and that sucks. 

Edited June 14, 20205 yr by Jack Parkman

Well 2020 season has became a sham. The MLBPA lost all their leverage in this back in March, when for some dumb reason they gave MLB the power to set any schedule without negotiating. Whoever allowed that in the contract should be fired. 

2 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

No it won't. The owners and players aren't even in the same galaxy cluster. 

That's what will make it fun. 

https://mlb.nbcsports.com/2019/01/07/a-warning-about-major-league-baseballs-record-revenues/

This article reminded me that if baseball had just taken the players offer of 114 games at the onset, they'd probably have made enough money to not operate at a loss this season and build goodwill towards the future.

But instead of not only can the owners not see the forest through the trees, they're just deciding to burn the forest to the ground.

 

54 minutes ago, Quin said:

https://mlb.nbcsports.com/2019/01/07/a-warning-about-major-league-baseballs-record-revenues/

This article reminded me that if baseball had just taken the players offer of 114 games at the onset, they'd probably have made enough money to not operate at a loss this season and build goodwill towards the future.

But instead of not only can the owners not see the forest through the trees, they're just deciding to burn the forest to the ground.

Anything less than 70-78 games seems crazy...and 100-114 was never going to feasible with the current Covid trajectory, even without any fans.

This is a bleeping sham.

1 hour ago, DirtySox said:

 

Rob Manfred has to lead, he doesn't know how to do that.

12 minutes ago, Quin said:

Rob Manfred has to lead, he doesn't know how to do that.

Clearly. Totally botched just about every important decision he’s been faced with that I can recall.

The Astros dealings were a thing of disgrace.

Could still get 80 games in. Give players 80-85% of full pay and play ball. I hate the owners, but they will lose 20-30% of revenue with out fans present.

Players should be able to see that. Just compromise and get on with it.

Could we just turn this into a soap opera and we could tune in each day? Forget about ever playing. But at least make it entertaining. 

I have been a fan for a long time, but guess what MLB? My life has gone on without baseball. And the longer this stuff goes, the more we will get used to it. You will still have fans rushing back to the park when play finally resumes, but some others will still stay away. They still have not learned from history. 

2 hours ago, zisk said:

Could still get 80 games in. Give players 80-85% of full pay and play ball. I hate the owners, but they will lose 20-30% of revenue with out fans present.

Players should be able to see that. Just compromise and get on with it.

Every time the players negotiated fewer games, they negotiated less pay. They started at 114, then 89. Each time that's a paycut for the players, they just want prorated pay for each game.

MLB makes hand over fist money, irregardless of fans (see the above link), and KBO getting fans shows just how starved for content people were.

Instead, the owners made the exact same offer every single time. They wanted as few as games as possible, or if they wanted more games, to pay the same amount.

MLB has a legal monopoly, they strong arm cities into giving them taxpayer funded stadiums, pay minor leaguers poverty wages, and won't even prove that they'll lose money this season. They agreed to a deal with the players and are upset that they have to honor that deal.

 

2 hours ago, zisk said:

Could still get 80 games in. Give players 80-85% of full pay and play ball. I hate the owners, but they will lose 20-30% of revenue with out fans present.

Players should be able to see that. Just compromise and get on with it.

You could but more likely in fantasy baseball. Just an estimate, but f you are going to have expanded playoffs, then you would have to still finish regular season 1st week of October. In 2019, playoffs started 10/1 and ended 10/30. You  would also have to play 7 days a week for 12 weeks starting 1st week of July resulting in 3 weeks spring training beginning tomorrow.  Maybe expand rosters to accommodate individual players getting time off while teams play every day as well as covering disabled list problems. I am assuming no AAA play. That would get you to 80 games w a couple of rain days included. 

My gut says 55-60 games max seems more likely. 

50 games is not baseball, I hope the players strike against this foolish bs that the owners paraded these past few months.

In the end, it doesn't even matter because covid will strike it all downeth again, but fuck the owners. 

44 minutes ago, Quin said:

Every time the players negotiated fewer games, they negotiated less pay. They started at 114, then 89. Each time that's a paycut for the players, they just want prorated pay for each game.

MLB makes hand over fist money, irregardless of fans (see the above link), and KBO getting fans shows just how starved for content people were.

Instead, the owners made the exact same offer every single time. They wanted as few as games as possible, or if they wanted more games, to pay the same amount.

MLB has a legal monopoly, they strong arm cities into giving them taxpayer funded stadiums, pay minor leaguers poverty wages, and won't even prove that they'll lose money this season. They agreed to a deal with the players and are upset that they have to honor that deal.

 

The deal both parties agreed to also said that the players had to negotiate the prorated salary if it was determined that fans would not be allowed in stadiums to generate revenue. I saw absolutely no willingness by the players to negotiate off of their full prorated salary.

This isn't just on the owners, the union isn't innocent in not playing already either.

1 minute ago, iWiN4PreP said:

50 games is not baseball, I hope the players strike against this foolish bs that the owners paraded these past few months.

In the end, it doesn't even matter because covid will strike it all downeth again, but fuck the owners. 

Striking would be the worst thing the players could do. Currently the have public opinion on their side. There is an agreement to not strike/lockout. If they strike, legally they will be found  breaking the agreement and they will lose some of that public opinion. 

39 minutes ago, ptatc said:

The deal both parties agreed to also said that the players had to negotiate the prorated salary if it was determined that fans would not be allowed in stadiums to generate revenue. I saw absolutely no willingness by the players to negotiate off of their full prorated salary.

This isn't just on the owners, the union isn't innocent in not playing already either.

Players: We know were going to make $20, but we'll take $10.

Owners: How about $5?

Players: No

Owners: 50% of $10?

Players: No

Owners: 50% of $20, but that percentage only comes out of half of the $20.

Players: No

Owners: Why are you negotiating in bad faith???

8 minutes ago, iWiN4PreP said:

50 games is not baseball, I hope the players strike against this foolish bs that the owners paraded these past few months.

In the end, it doesn't even matter because covid will strike it all downeth again, but fuck the owners. 

If the owners say tomorrow that the players should go to camp by Saturday  and the do a shortened 3 week "spring training" they could probably start games by July 6th maybe. If that were the case, in the Sox regular season they would have had 69 games left in the season. Take away a few off days and the absolute maximum games is probably 73 or so.

Just now, Quin said:

Players: We know were going to make $20, but we'll take $10.

Owners: How about $5?

Players: No

Owners: 50% of $10?

Players: No

Owners: 25% of two installments of $20.

Players: No

Owners: Why are you negotiating in bad faith???

Could be the  case but ets look at facts. Everything that came out of the union was "we are only going to play at full prorated salary, we are not taking further paycuts. " at one point one of the owners proposal was for 80% of prorated with playoffs and 70% without playoffs. So there was an off of a 20% cut. Obviously the players didnt think that was worth having a discussion.