So what needs to happen in order for this to get the green light

14 minutes ago, BigHurt3515 said:

So what needs to happen in order for this to get the green light

Lots of money.

So I’ve been told Reinsdorf wants one billion dollars PLUS the motel tax thing and I’ve also been told that the billion dollars is the motel tax thing. I’ve also been told he now wants two billion. What’s the correct dope?

19 minutes ago, Lightly Folded said:

So I’ve been told Reinsdorf wants one billion dollars PLUS the motel tax thing and I’ve also been told that the billion dollars is the motel tax thing. I’ve also been told he now wants two billion. What’s the correct dope?

Hard to tell right now with all the conflicting stories, won't know for sure until a definite proposal is put down on paper but you can rest assured of one thing, JR wants as big of a handout as he can possible get and he wants to spend as little or none of his own money.

That's the way he operates. 

Speaking of the Bears stadium efforts:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/bears/2024/02/22/bears-stadium-arlington-heights-property-tax-review

I said this earlier, but I'm assuming he won't get everything he asks for. Even if he gets some of what he is asking for and gets the ball rolling, that will likely be VERY attractive for a prospective buyer. I hope this is all a play to increase the sale price of the team and add to his legacy. Sell the team off right when it gets the green light. There are much richer people put there that can cover more.thsb what Jerry is willing to cover. 

2 minutes ago, ron883 said:

I said this earlier, but I'm assuming he won't get everything he asks for. Even if he gets some of what he is asking for and gets the ball rolling, that will likely be VERY attractive for a prospective buyer. I hope this is all a play to increase the sale price of the team and add to his legacy. Sell the team off right when it gets the green light. There are much richer people put there that can cover more.thsb what Jerry is willing to cover. 

The issue with JR selling while he is alive, as he has stated himself, is the gigantic tax hit he'd take from capital gains (roughly 200 million on a sale worth two billion) and the Illinois state tax. 

15 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Hard to tell right now with all the conflicting stories, won't know for sure until a definite proposal is put down on paper but you can rest assured of one thing, JR wants as big of a handout as he can possible get and he wants to spend as little or none of his own money.

That's the way he operates. 

It's really not if you read up on it.  About a billion is related to infrastructure.  The other is related to the stadium.  There are different parts of a project which are covered by different legal entities, funds, and taxing bodies.  Some authors like to add the other things into the "stadium" bucket.  No matter what happens there the infrastructure and other pieces of the district will be done and funded by tax and private sources. The actual stadium project itself seems to come in at somewhere between a billion and 1.2 billion depending on who is writing it up.

1 hour ago, ptatc said:

Lots of money.

More specifically,  lots of other people's money.

45 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Speaking of the Bears stadium efforts:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/bears/2024/02/22/bears-stadium-arlington-heights-property-tax-review

Here you have a $6.3B company throwing a hissy fit and "considering other options" over an $11M property tax bill.

 

Edited February 23, 20242 yr by South Side Hit Men

51 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

It's really not if you read up on it.  About a billion is related to infrastructure.  The other is related to the stadium.  There are different parts of a project which are covered by different legal entities, funds, and taxing bodies.  Some authors like to add the other things into the "stadium" bucket.  No matter what happens there the infrastructure and other pieces of the district will be done and funded by tax and private sources. The actual stadium project itself seems to come in at somewhere between a billion and 1.2 billion depending on who is writing it up.

I am finding it interesting that in the past 2 days the TIF estimate looks to have gone from $600 million to $900 million.

44 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Here you have a $6.3B company throwing a hissy fit and "considering other options" over an $11M property tax bill.

 

Yeah that has been confusing me. I'm not sure what their angle is at all, TBH, because it seems like they may genuinely backing out of the Arlington Heights situation over it with no viable plan in sight in Chicago.

1 hour ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Here you have a $6.3B company throwing a hissy fit and "considering other options" over an $11M property tax bill.

 

Do you think this is somehow unusual or odd for a company to contest valuations or property tax bills for a company this size?  Because, for the record,  there are companies with valuations of hundreds of times that market cap which are doing exactly this every single day all over the US.

5 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Do you think this is somehow unusual or odd for a company to contest valuations or property tax bills for a company this size?  Because, for the record,  there are companies with valuations of hundreds of times that market cap which are doing exactly this every single day all over the US.

Contesting a valuation seems a little different from canceling a multi-billion dollar project over it.

Those of you who are in state, especially if you’re opposed to this, have you called your state legislators? They probably don’t get that many constituent calls, a dozen self-identified white Sox fans calling and politely saying they don’t want this kind of money going to Reinsdorf could well make a difference. 

4 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Contesting a valuation seems a little different from canceling a multi-billion dollar project over it.

Not if they don't get what they want to do the project. 

42 minutes ago, Jake said:

Yeah that has been confusing me. I'm not sure what their angle is at all, TBH, because it seems like they may genuinely backing out of the Arlington Heights situation over it with no viable plan in sight in Chicago.

Thinking 4th dimensionality, I wonder if the purchase of the Arlington heights property was the bluff to get the ISFA money but the Sox sudden plans have screwed them.

8 minutes ago, ptatc said:

Thinking 4th dimensionality, I wonder if the purchase of the Arlington heights property was the bluff to get the ISFA money but the Sox sudden plans have screwed them.

I thought everybody was saying there would be no need for public financing for the Bears. If the white Sox don’t deserve public financing, as many are saying, in part, because of Reinsdorf and his horrid ways and because the team consistently blows etc etc then this worthless piece of junk football team  which has been ten times crappier on the field and throughout their organization shouldn’t see the light of day toward a single public dollar. If the Sox are garbage then the Bears are garbage to garbage. But yet everyone wants to treat them like royalty. The Bears have pretty much sucked for the last 40 years. They can take their sorry asses to Mexico City for all I care. Pay for your own damn stadium Bears or get lost. 

1 minute ago, Lightly Folded said:

I thought everybody was saying there would be no need for public financing for the Bears. If the white Sox don’t deserve public financing, as many are saying, in part, because of Reinsdorf and his horrid ways and because the team consistently blows etc etc then this worthless piece of junk football team  which has been ten times crappier on the field and throughout their organization shouldn’t see the light of day toward a single public dollar. If the Sox are garbage then the Bears are garbage to garbage. But yet everyone wants to treat them like royalty. The Bears have pretty much sucked for the last 40 years. They can take their sorry asses to Mexico City for all I care. Pay for your own damn stadium Bears or get lost. 

Certainly one way to simultaneously kill local sports (talk) radio in Chicago…

5 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Certainly one way to simultaneously kill local sports (talk) radio in Chicago…

Now we're cooking with gas...

First time posting in a long time because this drama has been the first time I have given the Sox more than two seconds of thought in years.

JR is asking for lots of money, but the debate is missing the point. I have been mostly negative on his proposal once the ask came out, but with more thought, I think it really depends on how its all structured.

Right now the ISFA has a ton of debt, mostly from Soldier Field. It is being paid off by the hotel tax. Everyone knows that. But the important distinction is that the city pre-pays the payment and then earns back the amount from the tax. In years when the hotel tax is less than the payment, the city government is stuck paying for it. Or, what has often happened, is that the city pays just the interest or refinances the bonds to lower the current payment so the current administration doesn't have to deal with it, leaving it to future city councils to deal with. That is how we end up in a situation where almost none of the principal of the Soldier Field deal has been paid off.

With this new deal, it seems like JR wants to tap into existing TIF money for the area for infrastructure. That, to me, makes complete sense. Its basically what it was made for and makes sense from a common sense point of view. The city is basically paying for the infrastructure up front in exchange for future payments once the infrastructure is paid off. Its a good way to build up an area like the 78.

On top of that, JR wants the city to pay for the stadium. That seems outrageous, but it depends. Technically, it could just be a way to tap into the city's ability to get better rates on debt. If that's all it was, I really don't think people could be upset. But the key point is how it is paid back, and specifically, how much is actually expected to be paid back by the business. Its been said he wants the hotel tax to cover it, but right now, that tax can't even cover the smaller amount of Soldier Field payments. So there would likely be shortfalls.

So the question is, who covers the difference? If its the Sox, then its really not a terrible deal. There are no new taxes, the city pays for infrastructure, and ends up not spending any Chicago taxpayer money on the stadium.

But JR doesn't want to pay the difference that he knows will occur. So he wants to also tap into the sales tax in the 78 and put that towards the stadium payments. That is a new tax as much as he will want to say its not. The city would then be looking at reduced tax revenue for the area that will cost city spending. That is straight up a cost to the city, which is indirectly a tax on city taxpayers.

So really, the question will come down to who is taking the risk in this proposal. If the Sox are responsible for the entirety of the bond payment and are only given the hotel tax and the sales tax in the 78, its probably at worst a slight negative financial impact for the city with a decent chance of being a pretty big positive financial impact. But that assumes the Sox are the thing pushing the 78 development towards completion. However, if the city is the one ultimately responsible for the bond payments or if we think the 78 will get developed anyway, this could be a massive financial boondoggle.

The thing that throws a wrench into all of this is the Bears. It has been stated enough times here: the Bears and Sox are competing for these ISFA funds. As much as that makes it seem like taxpayers are about to get screwed, it could actually be a great thing for the city's negotiating leverage. If we can use that to get a scenario where the financial risk is less on the city, this could actually turn into a good project.

1 hour ago, Balta1701 said:

Those of you who are in state, especially if you’re opposed to this, have you called your state legislators? They probably don’t get that many constituent calls, a dozen self-identified white Sox fans calling and politely saying they don’t want this kind of money going to Reinsdorf could well make a difference. 

Why would people in the state or city not want this? Reinsdorf might not even be here to see the stadium done or for much longer after. This district and stadium I assume would be awesome for the city and make the team even more attractive to buy

2 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

Those of you who are in state, especially if you’re opposed to this, have you called your state legislators? They probably don’t get that many constituent calls, a dozen self-identified white Sox fans calling and politely saying they don’t want this kind of money going to Reinsdorf could well make a difference. 

State legislators are told how to vote by their party leaders who slate most of the election funding, and fund opponents if you don't obey. Perhaps not as top/down stringent as the Madigan decades, but still par for the course here. Then again, it's not much different from Congress in that sense. 

 

7 hours ago, ron883 said:

I said this earlier, but I'm assuming he won't get everything he asks for. Even if he gets some of what he is asking for and gets the ball rolling, that will likely be VERY attractive for a prospective buyer. I hope this is all a play to increase the sale price of the team and add to his legacy. Sell the team off right when it gets the green light. There are much richer people put there that can cover more.thsb what Jerry is willing to cover. 

Describe that for me please.