Ishbia taking control by 2029?

[nrockway]

51 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

You may not like what they have done, but that stuff is making money hand over fist.  Again, terrible people, but the stuff they are doing as owners for the success of the team is undeniable.  Having that money to spend because of what they have done with their investment is not a bad thing, and I think all of us would be pretty fucking pleased if Jerry did 1/5th of the stuff around the park that the Ricketts have done 

Yup, been posting about it in the 78 thread. There's a real opportunity for it. Not sure the opportunity existed in 1991. Seems like Jerry and Wirtz are doing it around the UC. Hopeful that Ishbia sees the opportunity. Both for the team and it also could be pretty good for the region.

I do hate it though, you're right. There's probably a way of doing it without the Ricketts creating their own little fief and interfering with the democratic processes. But also, their payroll is high, but are they willing to truly spend to get over the hump? Do they balk at Tucker and run with Alcantara and Caissie? I think they could impress their fans by trading Alcantara for Luis. Seems like a W for both teams. Or any proper 'ready now' outfielder on a big contract.

54 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

There are absolutely good owners in that some do what it takes to win. That's not the White Sox.  Pointing out one in 45 year occurrences as some sort of "see it can happen!", just let me point to the other 44 and say the same thing.

Fair enough. I understand the perspective. I also think there's good reason to be optimistic about the direction of the team. Especially considering Jerry is on his way out and seems to have already taken a backseat. Can't be so sure about the last part, just my impression. Best thing Ishbia can do is spend money and not interfere with baseball ops.

Edited September 6 by nrockway

[77 Hitmen]

2 hours ago, nrockway said:

Right, but I think they can spend that money because of everything around the neighborhood and the history. They've capitalized on it effectively, but it would be hard not to. I think Cubs fans are wondering if they'll re-sign Tucker and then continue to fill holes. The Sox spent more than the Cubs as recent as 2022.

I wouldn't call the changes around the neighborhood 'upgrades' though. More like awful. Corporatized everything once cool about Wrigleyville. I used to live in Lakeview and the team would send mailers saying like "if you don't bother the alderman about this stuff we want, we're moving". Completely ruined the Wrigley Rooftops. Even the people who work at some of those longtime bars hate it (maybe not the owners of them).

On the stadium upgrades, is it still 100 bucks to sit behind a pole? 😃 The bleachers are ruined.

It is indeed true that the Sox MLB payroll was higher than the Cubs in 2022, but there needs to be some context to go with those numbers: 

First, even when JR puts money into the major league payroll, he doesn't invest elsewhere in the organization.  Scouting, player development, major league coaching/conditioning/analytics, getting international talent have been terrible for many years.  Successful teams invest in both the MLB payroll and the rest of the organization.   The Sox always seem to skimp on the latter.

Second, 2022 was the result of the common ebb and flow of payrolls as multiyear contracts get more expensive in the later years resulting in bloated payrolls and then teams need to retool as their previous core of talent leaves.  Of course, in the case of the Sox, it wasn't that the players they signed to multiyear deals got old, they just totally fizzled out.  Perhaps that's part of how Jerry's bargain hunting backfired - sign all this emerging talent to extensions before they get too expensive but before they've proved themselves.  It worked splendidly for the Chris Sale extension, so therefore it became their template going forward.  

Edited September 6 by 77 Hitmen

[77 Hitmen]

3 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

You may not like what they have done, but that stuff is making money hand over fist.  Again, terrible people, but the stuff they are doing as owners for the success of the team is undeniable.  Having that money to spend because of what they have done with their investment is not a bad thing, and I think all of us would be pretty fucking pleased if Jerry did 1/5th of the stuff around the park that the Ricketts have done 

If the Ricketts, even with owning a team that always draws well, has a huge fan base, and plays at a popular location that already had a lot of things around it, decided that they needed to spend a ton of money to develop the land around Wrigley to generate more money, what are the Ishbias intending to do with the White Sox who have NONE of those things?  Whether they stay at the current park or move to the 78, I can't imagine the new owners intend to keep the status quo of current ballpark surrounded by acres of parking lots.  

Those fans who think that the Ishbias will spend their fortune on $300M payrolls forever more once they own the Sox without enough money coming in to sustain that kind of expenditure are in for disappointment.  With a change in ownership (eventually) coming, don't expect the new guys, rich as they are, to go into this planning to operate at a loss indefinitely.

And for those fans who think all they need to do is win and fans will come, the real world is not that simple or easy.  Over the last 30 years, even when the Sox were fielding competitive teams, the only time they've been higher than 15th in attendance is the year after they won the World Series.  And winning pennants are easier said that done.  Teams like the Mets and Padres have been spending a ton of money on their payroll for years now and how many pennants have they won in the last 20 years?  

Edited September 6 by 77 Hitmen

[Lip Man 1]

2 hours ago, 77 Hitmen said:

If the Ricketts, even with owning a team that always draws well, has a huge fan base, and plays at a popular location that already had a lot of things around it, decided that they needed to spend a ton of money to develop the land around Wrigley to generate more money, what are the Ishbias intending to do with the White Sox who have NONE of those things?  Whether they stay at the current park or move to the 78, I can't imagine the new owners intend to keep the status quo of current ballpark surrounded by acres of parking lots.  

Those fans who think that the Ishbias will spend their fortune on $300M payrolls forever more once they own the Sox without enough money coming in to sustain that kind of expenditure are in for disappointment.  With a change in ownership (eventually) coming, don't expect the new guys, rich as they are, to go into this planning to operate at a loss indefinitely.

And for those fans who think all they need to do is win and fans will come, the real world is not that simple or easy.  Over the last 30 years, even when the Sox were fielding competitive teams, the only time they've been higher than 15th in attendance is the year after they won the World Series.  And winning pennants are easier said that done.  Teams like the Mets and Padres have been spending a ton of money on their payroll for years now and how many pennants have they won in the last 20 years?  

Part of the issue which is often overlooked is that in the last 40+ years how often have the Sox pot together streaks of consecutive winning seasons?

When they have two-three-four winning seasons in a row that generates fan interest. Check the figures from 1981-1985, from 1990-1994 and from 2000-2006.

Coming out of nowhere to be competitive after multiple losing years does little to immediate move the attendance figures. Since 2007 this franchise only has back to back winning years in 2020-2021. All we all know what was going on at that time.

This of course also doesn't factor in the backlash over things like the 94-95 labor impasse which JR helped initiate and the infamous White Flag Trade which helped hammer attendance to say nothing of the threat to move the franchise in the late 1980's.

The Sox consistently shoot themselves in the foot, White Sox fans have long memories and that absolutely impacts attendance. 

 

 

[77 Hitmen]

On 9/6/2025 at 2:22 PM, Lip Man 1 said:

Part of the issue which is often overlooked is that in the last 40+ years how often have the Sox pot together streaks of consecutive winning seasons?

When they have two-three-four winning seasons in a row that generates fan interest. Check the figures from 1981-1985, from 1990-1994 and from 2000-2006.

Coming out of nowhere to be competitive after multiple losing years does little to immediate move the attendance figures. Since 2007 this franchise only has back to back winning years in 2020-2021. All we all know what was going on at that time.

This of course also doesn't factor in the backlash over things like the 94-95 labor impasse which JR helped initiate and the infamous White Flag Trade which helped hammer attendance to say nothing of the threat to move the franchise in the late 1980's.

The Sox consistently shoot themselves in the foot, White Sox fans have long memories and that absolutely impacts attendance. 

 

 

Your first four words are key - PART of the issue.   We can all agree that JR has made misstep after misstep in his 44 years of ownership that has left the White Sox franchise reeling.   

At least it looks like he's doing one right thing at the end by lining up a local billionaire to be the next Sox owner after he's gone.  But it's going to take a lot of work on the Ishbias part to right this ship.  It won't be as simple as just cranking out checks for free agents.  They've probably already learned that with their first few years of owning the Suns.  Yes, this team needs to eventually start spending on premium free agents just like the big boys but there's a lot of leg work that needs to be done before we get to that point such as rebuilding all the scouting, player development, coaching, etc. that has been a failure over the last 2 decades.

IMO, while the on the field stuff is of primary importance, there's other work that needs to be done to win back fans.  That includes the ballpark experience and yes, even down to jettisoning that incompetent clown in the broadcast booth.  

It's not just that White Sox fans are angry.  Worse than that - many are just indifferent and really don't care anymore.  That's what the new owners need to overcome.  Also note that the people who remember the White Flag trade, the 1994 strike, SportsVision, etc. aren't the future.  The youngest of us are pushing 40 or 50.   What have they done to attract any younger fans in the last 15 years who don't even remember the 2005 WS win let alone all the pre-2005 missteps?  

Edited September 7 by 77 Hitmen

[soxrwhite]

1 hour ago, 77 Hitmen said:

Your first four words are key - PART of the issue.   We can all agree that JR has made misstep after misstep in his 44 years of ownership that has left the White Sox franchise reeling.   

At least it looks like he's doing one right thing at the end by lining up a local billionaire to be the next Sox owner after he's gone.  But it's going to take a lot of work on the Ishbias part to right this ship.  It won't be as simple as just cranking out checks for free agents.  They've probably already learned that with their first few years of owning the Suns.  Yes, this team needs to eventually start spending on premium free agents just like the big boys but there's a lot of leg work that needs to be done before we get to that point such as rebuilding all the scouting, player development, coaching, etc. that has been a failure over the last 2 decades.

IMO, while the on the field stuff is of primary importance, there's other work that needs to be done to win back fans.  That includes the ballpark experience and yes, even down to jettisoning that incompetent clown in the broadcast booth.  

It's not just that White Sox fans are angry.  Worse than that - many are just indifferent and really don't care anymore.  That's what the new owners need to overcome.  Also note that the people who remember the White Flag trade, the 1994 strike, SportsVision, etc. aren't the future.  The youngest of us are pushing 40 or 50.   What have they done to attract any younger fans in the last 15 years who don't even remember the 2005 WS win let alone all the pre-2005 missteps?  

Just win baby

[chitownsportsfan]

1 hour ago, soxrwhite said:

Just win baby

You are my spirit animal. I was literally lining up to condense that down into the exact same thing. Just win baby, and the fans will come.

Edited September 8 by chitownsportsfan

[ewokpelts]

On 9/6/2025 at 8:54 AM, nrockway said:

Right, but I think they can spend that money because of everything around the neighborhood and the history. They've capitalized on it effectively, but it would be hard not to. I think Cubs fans are wondering if they'll re-sign Tucker and then continue to fill holes. The Sox spent more than the Cubs as recent as 2022.

I wouldn't call the changes around the neighborhood 'upgrades' though. More like awful. Corporatized everything once cool about Wrigleyville. I used to live in Lakeview and the team would send mailers saying like "if you don't bother the alderman about this stuff we want, we're moving". Completely ruined the Wrigley Rooftops. Even the people who work at some of those longtime bars hate it (maybe not the owners of them).

On the stadium upgrades, is it still 100 bucks to sit behind a pole? 😃 The bleachers are ruined.

All the Joe rickets trust fund has done is buy out everyone who invested in the area. 

[ewokpelts]

On 9/7/2025 at 5:12 PM, 77 Hitmen said:

Your first four words are key - PART of the issue.   We can all agree that JR has made misstep after misstep in his 44 years of ownership that has left the White Sox franchise reeling.   

At least it looks like he's doing one right thing at the end by lining up a local billionaire to be the next Sox owner after he's gone.  But it's going to take a lot of work on the Ishbias part to right this ship.  It won't be as simple as just cranking out checks for free agents.  They've probably already learned that with their first few years of owning the Suns.  Yes, this team needs to eventually start spending on premium free agents just like the big boys but there's a lot of leg work that needs to be done before we get to that point such as rebuilding all the scouting, player development, coaching, etc. that has been a failure over the last 2 decades.

IMO, while the on the field stuff is of primary importance, there's other work that needs to be done to win back fans.  That includes the ballpark experience and yes, even down to jettisoning that incompetent clown in the broadcast booth.  

It's not just that White Sox fans are angry.  Worse than that - many are just indifferent and really don't care anymore.  That's what the new owners need to overcome.  Also note that the people who remember the White Flag trade, the 1994 strike, SportsVision, etc. aren't the future.  The youngest of us are pushing 40 or 50.   What have they done to attract any younger fans in the last 15 years who don't even remember the 2005 WS win let alone all the pre-2005 missteps?  

I agree. Gotta get rid of McKnight . 

[fathom]

100 losses in 2026, here we come!

 

[southsider2k5]

15 minutes ago, fathom said:

100 losses in 2026, here we come!

 

No really, let's hear more about how the offers were too low...

[WhiteSox2023]

1 hour ago, fathom said:

100 losses in 2026, here we come!

 

Expected.  I still can’t believe there were some posters that thought they would spend money just because the payroll is so low.  It’s like people forgot who the owner still is.  He has no incentive to spend any money until he sells.

[southsider2k5]

12 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Expected.  I still can’t believe there were some posters that thought they would spend money just because the payroll is so low.  It’s like people forgot who the owner still is.  He has no incentive to spend any money until he sells.

I think people really don't understand how much money this franchise lost since Covid.

[Buehrle>Wood]

1 hour ago, fathom said:

100 losses in 2026, here we come!

 

It may be true regardless but Bruce Levine has no idea.

[WhiteSox2023]

5 minutes ago, Buehrle>Wood said:

It may be true regardless but Bruce Levine has no idea.

True.  Levine is usually out of touch with reality.  🤣   But the Doobster also said the same thing…

 

Edited September 20 by WhiteSox2023

[southsider2k5]

28 minutes ago, Buehrle>Wood said:

It may be true regardless but Bruce Levine has no idea.

He's probably not wrong for all of the same reasons we have been talking about since they didn't trade Robert.

[WhiteSox2023]

1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said:

He's probably not wrong for all of the same reasons we have been talking about since they didn't trade Robert.

The money that was going to be spent this offseason is basically going to Robert’s option, in a futile attempt at saving some fleeting trade value on the Sox last remaining asset since the Cease trade was a bust.

Edited September 21 by WhiteSox2023

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

I think people really don't understand how much money this franchise lost since Covid.

I think you've been pushing this narrative way too hard. TV deal issue past 18+ months been tough, but theres no chance this team lost money in playoff years. Jerry wouldnt continue to increase payroll if he was losing money badly.

It also makes zero sense that the team would be bleeding money badly yet Jerry has no interest in getting out from under it.

Has this team taken on debt the past few years? Absolutely. Does that mean they're bleeding cash and have to act like the cheapest org in professional baseball? Obviously not in my opinion. 

[Ducksnort]

2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I think you've been pushing this narrative way too hard. TV deal issue past 18+ months been tough, but theres no chance this team lost money in playoff years. Jerry wouldnt continue to increase payroll if he was losing money badly.

It also makes zero sense that the team would be bleeding money badly yet Jerry has no interest in getting out from under it.

Has this team taken on debt the past few years? Absolutely. Does that mean they're bleeding cash and have to act like the cheapest org in professional baseball? Obviously not in my opinion. 

What playoff years? 2021?

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

8 minutes ago, Ducksnort said:

What playoff years? 2021?

Yeah, and 2022 while they stated they lost 53 million, the investors themselves saw a 13% gain YoY in valuation (after operating loss) which came in north of 240ish million in total gains. 

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I think you've been pushing this narrative way too hard. TV deal issue past 18+ months been tough, but theres no chance this team lost money in playoff years. Jerry wouldnt continue to increase payroll if he was losing money badly.

It also makes zero sense that the team would be bleeding money badly yet Jerry has no interest in getting out from under it.

Has this team taken on debt the past few years? Absolutely. Does that mean they're bleeding cash and have to act like the cheapest org in professional baseball? Obviously not in my opinion. 

If they took on so much operations debt they had to bring in the buyer early, that's enough of a red flag to me.  I didn't really buy it before hand, but seeing this plus what happened with the Twins, it checks out.  They have been bleeding cash for years now.

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Yeah, and 2022 while they stated they lost 53 million, the investors themselves saw a 13% gain YoY in valuation (after operating loss) which came in north of 240ish million in total gains. 

Don't confuse operations with valuation. 

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

16 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

Don't confuse operations with valuation. 

When theyre actively selling their shares in the company, it's absolutely a part of the equation.

[southsider2k5]

7 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

When theyre actively selling their shares in the company, it's absolutely a part of the equation.

People buying shares of a money losing company happens literally millions of times every day.

[tray]

Maybe purchasing more minority shares is just part and parcel of a typical private equity investment strategy.

It's hard to guess what is going on though when so little has been disclosed.

Nashville is still hoping to get an mlb team down there and maybe Ish-bye-a does as well. In addition to a minority stake in the WSox he already has a similar minority stake in the Nashville SC soccer franchise. 

 

Edited September 21 by tray