Don't break it ALL down. Go for 63!!!!!

[vilehoopster]

I have thought this since before the all-star break when the White Sox were already playing better: I don't think the Sox should just completely dismantle what they have right now. Especially, especially for a bunch of lottery picks. And lottery picks is an apt metaphor for what they would get back. The odds are low that they would get anything of value back, so why make trades just to make trades?

I understand that Robert and Houser have to go; it get that completely. Trade both of them while their value is high; I get it. 

But as far as I'm concerned that's it; don't trade anyone else. 

Don't trade Tauchman. He is clearly the best RF they have had in what??  8 or 9 years? All the people who say we should trade him, what are the Sox going to get back?? Be honest, a minor leaguer who has what? A 1-in-5 chance of every playing in the majors, at best? Probably more like a  1-in-10 chance. Keep him this year and keep him next year. He really helps the team win; he's important to this young improving team. . 

Keep Sosa. Again: he's the best 2nd baseman the Sox have had in, again, 8 or 9 years, at least. Yes, he makes bad decisions, but he hits. He hits. The Sox don't win 2 out of 3 games in this series and some other series since the break is Sosa isn't on the team. Keep him, the return won't be worth it. He's young too. He's going to improve just like all the others. Somehow, everyone seems to forget that about him. 

Keep Benintendi. I would argue that he is the Sox's best bat. He is important to this team and a vital cog in the lineup. His defense isn't anywhere near as bad as all the people on here complain that it is. We kinda saw a good example of that tonight. Plus everybody talks about how expensive he is? What?  17 million is not that expensive at all. And Jerry and the Sox management can afford 17 million. My God, if you eat Ramen noodles everyday for lunch and dinner, you can afford to go to Olive Garden once a month. He's not too expensive with what the Sox are paying everyone else. Keep him and let's keep this momentum going on through September and on into 2026. 

A know a lot, A LOT, of people argue on here that wins this year don't matter. Wins next year don't matter. I will never, never understand that thinking. When the White Sox win, it matters. I and a whole lot of people are happy. We're happy with the 9 -3 win over Philly and every time the Sox win. When they lose, we are decidedly not happy. Keep winning this year. That's why we should keep Tauchman; keep him for now instead of trading him for a chance, probably a slim chance, that the Sox might be better in the future. Keep Benintendi for the same reason. 

I have had more fun watching the White Sox this past month, even before the all-star break, then I have at any time in the last five years. Why would anyone willing want it to stop? I don't get it. 

[Tnetennba]

 

[vilehoopster]

14 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

 

A lot of well-argued counter points in that statement. You're right; I have been put in my place.

Believe me this is exactly the type of replies I expected to get. The only argument that can be made against what I've said is the "wins this year don't matter" thing. So, poster will resort to this type of thing. 

Edited July 31 by vilehoopster

[Lip Man 1]

2 hours ago, vilehoopster said:

I have thought this since before the all-star break when the White Sox were already playing better: I don't think the Sox should just completely dismantle what they have right now. Especially, especially for a bunch of lottery picks. And lottery picks is an apt metaphor for what they would get back. The odds are low that they would get anything of value back, so why make trades just to make trades?

I understand that Robert and Houser have to go; it get that completely. Trade both of them while their value is high; I get it. 

But as far as I'm concerned that's it; don't trade anyone else. 

Don't trade Tauchman. He is clearly the best RF they have had in what??  8 or 9 years? All the people who say we should trade him, what are the Sox going to get back?? Be honest, a minor leaguer who has what? A 1-in-5 chance of every playing in the majors, at best? Probably more like a  1-in-10 chance. Keep him this year and keep him next year. He really helps the team win; he's important to this young improving team. . 

Keep Sosa. Again: he's the best 2nd baseman the Sox have had in, again, 8 or 9 years, at least. Yes, he makes bad decisions, but he hits. He hits. The Sox don't win 2 out of 3 games in this series and some other series since the break is Sosa isn't on the team. Keep him, the return won't be worth it. He's young too. He's going to improve just like all the others. Somehow, everyone seems to forget that about him. 

Keep Benintendi. I would argue that he is the Sox's best bat. He is important to this team and a vital cog in the lineup. His defense isn't anywhere near as bad as all the people on here complain that it is. We kinda saw a good example of that tonight. Plus everybody talks about how expensive he is? What?  17 million is not that expensive at all. And Jerry and the Sox management can afford 17 million. My God, if you eat Ramen noodles everyday for lunch and dinner, you can afford to go to Olive Garden once a month. He's not too expensive with what the Sox are paying everyone else. Keep him and let's keep this momentum going on through September and on into 2026. 

A know a lot, A LOT, of people argue on here that wins this year don't matter. Wins next year don't matter. I will never, never understand that thinking. When the White Sox win, it matters. I and a whole lot of people are happy. We're happy with the 9 -3 win over Philly and every time the Sox win. When they lose, we are decidedly not happy. Keep winning this year. That's why we should keep Tauchman; keep him for now instead of trading him for a chance, probably a slim chance, that the Sox might be better in the future. Keep Benintendi for the same reason. 

I have had more fun watching the White Sox this past month, even before the all-star break, then I have at any time in the last five years. Why would anyone willing want it to stop? I don't get it. 

Wins always matter at least to the fan base. Unfortunately the same can't be said of ownership based on their actions for a very long time and with the lockout/labor impasse coming JR isn't going to allow Getz to do anything drastic to improve the teams chances to be respectable. 

Maybe in 2028 when Ishbia I think takes over. 

And by the way they actually won 93 games in 2021 so that at least was an exciting year.

Edited July 31 by Lip Man 1

[ptatc]

3 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Wins always matter at least to the fan base. Unfortunately the same can't be said of ownership based on their actions for a very long time and with the lockout/labor impasse coming JR isn't going to allow Getz to do anything drastic to improve the teams chances to be respectable. 

Maybe in 2028 when Ishbia I think takes over. 

And by the way they actually won 93 games in 2021 so that at least was an exciting year.

I would disagree with the wins ALWAYS matter to fans. Some understand the concept of rebuilding. Winning is always the goal long term. But unless teams have the resources  of the truly major markets of NY and LA, in today's game, rebuilding is a reality.

[caulfield12]

Getting the highest possible draft pick next year is critical…

Even with a 63-99 finish, they’re still far and away in last place in the Central.

If you want them to jump into contention for next year, it’s going to require spending at least $100 million like the 2023 Royals, who also happened to have one of the five best young players in the entire game in Witt, Jr.

Tauchman can certainly return for 2026 as a FA if he so desires.  He’s not going to be the starting RF in 2028 (first potential Sox playoff team), after the Tigers have lost Skubal to FA.  Certainly not at his age.  Benintendi will be long gone then, too, and aged out of LF.

There’s also no reason at all to believe JR will spend big going the expected labor impasse offseason after next year.

 

Sosa and Vargas and Meidroth may or may not to be long term starters…most likely, they’re complementary pieces.

The future leaders for now look to be Montgomery, Teel and Quero, with Braden, Carlson and Bonemer the heart of the next wave (hopefully).  They’re still at least 2-3 middle of the order bats away, and the future rotation is just as far away unless Shane Smith/Vasil don’t take the next step and one of Schultz/H.Smith has to mature into a true frontline starter.

Lots to be excited about due to their play after the break…but lots of reasons to pump the brakes on getting carried away too much, as well.

If Montgomery, Teel and Quero all finish with 750-800 ops numbers, then maybe they’ve finally started to turn the corner.

 

 

 

Edited July 31 by caulfield12

[Falstaff]

9 hours ago, vilehoopster said:

I have thought this since before the all-star break when the White Sox were already playing better: I don't think the Sox should just completely dismantle what they have right now. Especially, especially for a bunch of lottery picks. And lottery picks is an apt metaphor for what they would get back. The odds are low that they would get anything of value back, so why make trades just to make trades?

I understand that Robert and Houser have to go; it get that completely. Trade both of them while their value is high; I get it. 

But as far as I'm concerned that's it; don't trade anyone else. 

Don't trade Tauchman. He is clearly the best RF they have had in what??  8 or 9 years? All the people who say we should trade him, what are the Sox going to get back?? Be honest, a minor leaguer who has what? A 1-in-5 chance of every playing in the majors, at best? Probably more like a  1-in-10 chance. Keep him this year and keep him next year. He really helps the team win; he's important to this young improving team. . 

Keep Sosa. Again: he's the best 2nd baseman the Sox have had in, again, 8 or 9 years, at least. Yes, he makes bad decisions, but he hits. He hits. The Sox don't win 2 out of 3 games in this series and some other series since the break is Sosa isn't on the team. Keep him, the return won't be worth it. He's young too. He's going to improve just like all the others. Somehow, everyone seems to forget that about him. 

Keep Benintendi. I would argue that he is the Sox's best bat. He is important to this team and a vital cog in the lineup. His defense isn't anywhere near as bad as all the people on here complain that it is. We kinda saw a good example of that tonight. Plus everybody talks about how expensive he is? What?  17 million is not that expensive at all. And Jerry and the Sox management can afford 17 million. My God, if you eat Ramen noodles everyday for lunch and dinner, you can afford to go to Olive Garden once a month. He's not too expensive with what the Sox are paying everyone else. Keep him and let's keep this momentum going on through September and on into 2026. 

A know a lot, A LOT, of people argue on here that wins this year don't matter. Wins next year don't matter. I will never, never understand that thinking. When the White Sox win, it matters. I and a whole lot of people are happy. We're happy with the 9 -3 win over Philly and every time the Sox win. When they lose, we are decidedly not happy. Keep winning this year. That's why we should keep Tauchman; keep him for now instead of trading him for a chance, probably a slim chance, that the Sox might be better in the future. Keep Benintendi for the same reason. 

I have had more fun watching the White Sox this past month, even before the all-star break, then I have at any time in the last five years. Why would anyone willing want it to stop? I don't get it. 

I think 2 of the guys you want to keep, Benny & Tauchman, probably have no interest from other teams. Benny's contract and Tauchman's age and wheels are in question, so I don't see them going anywhere.

Houser will get traded but so far, it's quiet on Robert.

I think Getz's game plan is to draft, development, work the scrap heap and flip. Stock up the minors and be a buyer in the next couple of years. 

Enjoy this team now for what they are doing with the youngster's development.  Look at Montgomery's stats since the All-Star break, but also work with Sosa and Vargas on fielding. 

Edited July 31 by Falstaff

[Chimpton]

9 hours ago, vilehoopster said:

I have thought this since before the all-star break when the White Sox were already playing better: I don't think the Sox should just completely dismantle what they have right now. Especially, especially for a bunch of lottery picks. And lottery picks is an apt metaphor for what they would get back. The odds are low that they would get anything of value back, so why make trades just to make trades?

I understand that Robert and Houser have to go; it get that completely. Trade both of them while their value is high; I get it. 

But as far as I'm concerned that's it; don't trade anyone else. 

Don't trade Tauchman. He is clearly the best RF they have had in what??  8 or 9 years? All the people who say we should trade him, what are the Sox going to get back?? Be honest, a minor leaguer who has what? A 1-in-5 chance of every playing in the majors, at best? Probably more like a  1-in-10 chance. Keep him this year and keep him next year. He really helps the team win; he's important to this young improving team. . 

Keep Sosa. Again: he's the best 2nd baseman the Sox have had in, again, 8 or 9 years, at least. Yes, he makes bad decisions, but he hits. He hits. The Sox don't win 2 out of 3 games in this series and some other series since the break is Sosa isn't on the team. Keep him, the return won't be worth it. He's young too. He's going to improve just like all the others. Somehow, everyone seems to forget that about him. 

Keep Benintendi. I would argue that he is the Sox's best bat. He is important to this team and a vital cog in the lineup. His defense isn't anywhere near as bad as all the people on here complain that it is. We kinda saw a good example of that tonight. Plus everybody talks about how expensive he is? What?  17 million is not that expensive at all. And Jerry and the Sox management can afford 17 million. My God, if you eat Ramen noodles everyday for lunch and dinner, you can afford to go to Olive Garden once a month. He's not too expensive with what the Sox are paying everyone else. Keep him and let's keep this momentum going on through September and on into 2026. 

A know a lot, A LOT, of people argue on here that wins this year don't matter. Wins next year don't matter. I will never, never understand that thinking. When the White Sox win, it matters. I and a whole lot of people are happy. We're happy with the 9 -3 win over Philly and every time the Sox win. When they lose, we are decidedly not happy. Keep winning this year. That's why we should keep Tauchman; keep him for now instead of trading him for a chance, probably a slim chance, that the Sox might be better in the future. Keep Benintendi for the same reason. 

I have had more fun watching the White Sox this past month, even before the all-star break, then I have at any time in the last five years. Why would anyone willing want it to stop? I don't get it. 

Things are certainly more positive since the all star break than last year, but if they get a half decent offer for Tauchman they should take it as they are still in rebuild mode and he is probably at peak worth at the moment. Keeping Benintendi will be more a question of no one else wanting him. I agree about keeping Sosa at least until next year to see if he can improve some more, I know he has weaknesses but give him a chance to improve.

[Timmy U]

Unless the Sox close like the 2024 Tigers, they are definitely gonna have one of the three worst records, therefore they could win as many games as possible and still have good odds. It’s all gonna come down to lottery luck. So far, the bad teams have not gotten lucky.

i do think there is value to a young team learning to win and gelling as a group. We can only speculate as to how much the constant losing affected Vaughn’s development. Showing up to lose every day wears on guys and you’d like some momentum headed into 2026. I wouldn’t rush into trading guys just to save JR cash and then getting MiLB roster filler.

[WhiteSox2023]

Yeah, you don’t have to worry about Benintendi going anywhere.  No one wants him but you.

[T R U]

Wins don't matter right now, the only thing that matters is the development of the kids on this team. 

 

[vilehoopster]

1 hour ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Yeah, you don’t have to worry about Benintendi going anywhere.  No one wants him but you.

Again, I would argue that Benintendi is their best bat, certainly one of their best bats. 

It seems that the people who are most worried about his contract and/ or just want him gone are posters whose number one agenda on this board is to bad mouth and complain about management and Getz. You know, people like you. 

Edited July 31 by vilehoopster

[vilehoopster]

1 hour ago, T R U said:

Wins don't matter right now, the only thing that matters is the development of the kids on this team. 

 

So when do wins matter? Do the Sox have to be Wild Card contenders for wins to matter. Or is that not good enough? Do wins only matter when the Sox are one of the top five or so teams in baseball and then serious World Series contenders? Will that be the only time wins matter?  Is that what you're saying that Sox fans have to wait for? That the Sox will just keep trading off assets for lottery pieces until they are a legit World Series contender?  Well, how will they ever become a Wild Card or World Series contender if they keep trading away every decent trading chip?

When fans buy tickets, this year, right now if the Sox win, it matters. When we all tune in to watch the game. If the Sox win, it matters; it matters this year. 

Plus I don't understand your point that kids developing matters but wins don't. I don't understand why they are exclusive. Can't the kids develop as the team continues to win and develops a winning attitude, and expectation of winning. Isn't expecting positive results and winning, isn't that super important to "the development of the kids"?

I just listened to a podcast and the guys speculated that maybe the reason that Vaughn is hitting so well is that he has escaped the malaise of the White Sox under achievement, that he's at a place that expects results and a place where they're (here it is again) "winning". 

 

Edited July 31 by vilehoopster

[Kyyle23]

agendas?  Come on man, the last big post you made a spectacle of demanding board apologies.  GMAB.  This season is a rebuilding season, it is what it is

[WhiteSox2023]

22 minutes ago, vilehoopster said:

Again, I would argue that Benintendi is their best bat, certainly one of their best bats. 

It seems that the people who are most worried about his contract and/ or just want him gone are posters whose number one agenda on this board is to to bad mouth and complain about management and Getz. You know, people like you. 

Benintendi was a Hahn signing so Getz is off the hook for that one.  I was just laughing that you literally had to post “Keep Benintendi” as if the Sox have any choice in the matter.  Once again, no one wants him but you.  🤣

[T R U]

14 minutes ago, vilehoopster said:

So when do wins matter? Do the Sox have to be Wild Card contenders for wins to matter. Or is that not good enough? Do wins only matter when the Sox are one of the top five or so teams in baseball and then serious World Series contenders? Will that be the only time wins matter?  Is that what you're saying that Sox fans have to wait for? That the Sox will just keep trading off assets for lottery pieces until they are a legit World Series contender?  Well, how will they ever become a Wild Card or World Series contender if they keep trading away every decent trading chip?

When fans buy tickets, this year, right now if the Sox win, it matters. When we all tune in to watch the game. If the Sox win, it matters; it matters this year. 

Plus I don't understand your point that kids developing matters but wins don't. I don't understand why they are exclusive. Can't the kids develop as the team continues to win and develops a winning attitude, and expectation of winning. Isn't expecting positive results and winning, isn't that super important to "the development of the kids"?

I just listened to a podcast and the guys speculated that maybe the reason that Vaughn is hitting so well is that he has escaped the malaise of the White Sox under achievement, that he's at a place that expects results and a place where they're (here it is again) "winning". 

Buddy this team is 29 games under .500 and the second worst team in baseball, I don't understand how else to explain to you that the only thing that matters right now is developing the talent that is going to make this team competitive again, in the future, because it isn't going to be this season or even next season.

Wins will matter when this team is competitive again, try to see the big picture here.

[Chicago White Sox]

41 minutes ago, vilehoopster said:

Again, I would argue that Benintendi is their best bat, certainly one of their best bats. 

It seems that the people who are most worried about his contract and/ or just want him gone are posters whose number one agenda on this board is to bad mouth and complain about management and Getz. You know, people like you. 

His defense is terrible.  You can close your eyes and pretend not to see it, but it kills pretty much all of his value.  And his bat is decent but not great, so DHing him is probably not a viable option even if you ignore the Quero / Teel situation.

[vilehoopster]

17 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

agendas?  Come on man, the last big post you made a spectacle of demanding board apologies.  GMAB.  This season is a rebuilding season, it is what it is

Thanks for bringing this up. In my post that Kyyle is talking about, this is my opening few lines: 

"First of all, you who have been making these statements know who you are,and it's time to admit that you were wrong. 

Statement 1)  This year's Sox are not any better or are not significantly/ noticeably better than last year's Sox. I don't think I need to even put for reasons for this; it is now clearly obvious. 

Statement 2)  Getz should never have signed Slater and Tauchman."

 

So, in my original post, Kyyle also use the words that I "demanded apologies".  Does any reasonable person see or hear in my intro to that post that I was "demanding apologies"? What is going on there? Well really, you can understand it if you try. 

It's pretty common tactic of people who are unable to intelligently counter your points, that they will instead change or manipulate your words and then use that manipulation of what was said to now complain or argue against your point. 

It's really ironic that this past post has been brought up. Because now, 45 or 60 days later, my two points 1) that the Sox are significantly better and 2) getting Tauchman and Stater were good moves by Getz; both those points are even more evident now than when I originally posted this thread. 

[southsider2k5]

10 hours ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Wins always matter at least to the fan base. Unfortunately the same can't be said of ownership based on their actions for a very long time and with the lockout/labor impasse coming JR isn't going to allow Getz to do anything drastic to improve the teams chances to be respectable. 

Maybe in 2028 when Ishbia I think takes over. 

And by the way they actually won 93 games in 2021 so that at least was an exciting year.

The contract that was made public literally said it couldn't happen before 2029, right?

[T R U]

37 minutes ago, vilehoopster said:

Again, I would argue that Benintendi is their best bat, certainly one of their best bats. 

It seems that the people who are most worried about his contract and/ or just want him gone are posters whose number one agenda on this board is to bad mouth and complain about management and Getz. You know, people like you. 

Andrew Benintendi is one of the reason why this team is bad. He has been worth negative value in his Sox career, which means he is hurting this team or preventing them from winning more games.

As someone who cares so deeply about winning games, you should want him off this team as well.

[Kyyle23]

17 minutes ago, vilehoopster said:

Thanks for bringing this up. In my post that Kyyle is talking about, this is my opening few lines: 

"First of all, you who have been making these statements know who you are,and it's time to admit that you were wrong. 

Statement 1)  This year's Sox are not any better or are not significantly/ noticeably better than last year's Sox. I don't think I need to even put for reasons for this; it is now clearly obvious. 

Statement 2)  Getz should never have signed Slater and Tauchman."

 

So, in my original post, Kyyle also use the words that I "demanded apologies".  Does any reasonable person see or hear in my intro to that post that I was "demanding apologies"? What is going on there? Well really, you can understand it if you try. 

It's pretty common tactic of people who are unable to intelligently counter your points, that they will instead change or manipulate your words and then use that manipulation of what was said to now complain or argue against your point. 

It's really ironic that this past post has been brought up. Because now, 45 or 60 days later, my two points 1) that the Sox are significantly better and 2) getting Tauchman and Stater were good moves by Getz; both those points are even more evident now than when I originally posted this thread. 

Lmao such a huge difference in demanding everyone with board agendas admit they are wrong and demanding apologies.  
 

I know you like to fancy yourself as some board intelligence and clearly you believe i am not of your caliber.  In respect to that entire thought, please go on.  I’m bewildered by your brilliance and just stunned.  I’m just gonna sit back and watch now because it’s so hard to understand everything and you have shown me the light 😂

 

[WhiteSox2023]

vileposter — this one could make the SoxTalk Hall of Shame.

Edited July 31 by WhiteSox2023

[Quin]

Go for 63 wins maybe the worst rallying cry in the history of sports.

[southsider2k5]

12 minutes ago, Quin said:

Go for 63 wins maybe the worst rallying cry in the history of sports.

I just can't imagine how you look at this steaming pile of dog water and think, yes, more of that!  Are there Sox fans who are that desperate for something to grab on to?  

[Lip Man 1]

1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said:

The contract that was made public literally said it couldn't happen before 2029, right?

Correct. Assuming JR is still with us. If he isn't all bets are off.