1 hour ago, chitownsportsfan said:

well so far he's shown neither control nor elite changeups. 4.4 walk rate in MLB per 9 and -.4 runs on his changeup. I root for the guy, hope he can succeed, but his profile has a sliver of an opening to success.

he's definitely the first pitcher with elite command to struggle in his first 9 games

1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

and now show the two starts after that.

you mean the two starts right before his elbow injury?😂

20 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I'm getting used to Ray Ray arguments now. He always leaves some key fact out.

Yeah, I have a tendency not to ignore the bad stuff

49 minutes ago, Jake said:

And just to be clear, back in 2024 when he was not yet scheduled for any kind of surgery, Thorpe said when he went on the IL that his elbow was hurting him in his last two starts and he had tried to pitch through it. Nobody is required to look at that and crown him the next Cy Young as there was plenty to nitpick during his healthy run of starts. But his numbers really got killed by those last two starts when, by his own admission, he was pitching through elbow pain that ultimately stole 2 seasons from him. Maybe he'll never recapture his old self, maybe his old self was always going to run into a buzzsaw even if healthy, who knows. But I wouldn't rule out that the one-time widely acclaimed prospect might actually be good.

So did his arm just start hurting at the start of the 2nd start? Only went 2/3 an inning. Was it 100% healthy for the start 3 before the IL?

Selection bias is always ripe at soxtalk!

If we exclude the starts that Soxtalk decided shouldn't count, he had a 4.97 FIP, 5.23 K/9 and 4.13 BB/9. Abysmal.

Edited 4 hours ago4 hr by Look at Ray Ray Run

54 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I'm getting used to Ray Ray arguments now. He always leaves some key fact out.

Cherry-picking out the bad starts is literally leaving out key facts haha

I'm surprised they called up Quero, they really hate Lee. I just hope Quero gets most the starts, he needs the PA. Romo can be the twice a week guy.

3 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I'm surprised they called up Quero, they really hate Lee. I just hope Quero gets most the starts, he needs the PA. Romo can be the twice a week guy.

And any other team could have had him for free in March. Guess everyone hates him haha

15 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

And any other team could have had him for free in March. Guess everyone hates him haha

It's kinda hard to add a Lee type on March when you've got so much roster flux, but yea. He stinks. He's not good. Probably one of the worst defensive catchers in AAA.

1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Yeah, I have a tendency not to ignore the bad stuff

So did his arm just start hurting at the start of the 2nd start? Only went 2/3 an inning. Was it 100% healthy for the start 3 before the IL?

Selection bias is always ripe at soxtalk!

If we exclude the starts that Soxtalk decided shouldn't count, he had a 4.97 FIP, 5.23 K/9 and 4.13 BB/9. Abysmal.

You'll have to ask Drew. His statement at that time indicated that his elbow was very sore after that excellent third-to-last start. Tried pitching through it the next two times through and it didn't work. Then bone spur surgery, then TJS coming back from the bone spur surgery. The bone spur was surely there to some extent before, but I don't know how much he felt it in the time that he was pitching adequately because I can't ask him. I doubt he faked the whole thing just to try to get Soxtalk off his back about two bad starts though.

As for what we saw from Thorpe's arsenal in MLB, the changeup was basically as advertised. Generated a nearly 40% whiff rate which is fantastic for any pitch, but especially a changeup and especially a changeup being thrown as often as it was. That's basically Devin Williams level of whiff-on-changeup and he was having to face batters multiple times a game. The rest of the mix was pretty suspect with the other offerings generating really, really low whiff rates and getting hit hard too often. Some of that was command and sequencing, some of it was surely inherent to the pitches he was throwing. He had started using his slider more right before the injury and that pitch was looking pretty useful for him.

But that would be the big question mark for him — what does he use around the changeup, how much does he use his fastball, whether to use slider/cutter/sweeper as the glove side breaker, etc. Many guys never figure those things out, so it's tough to say whether he will or would have. Not to mention that many guys lose the shape on some of their pitches post-TJS so I'm very curious to get Statcast data on what he's throwing in 2026.

This is great news for Teel. I thought it was an Achilles injury or even a strained calf. The fact that its an ankle, even if it is a high ankle, is much better news. I hope they are conservative with the timetable. Lower body injuries compound on themselves without significant rest.

You all are acting like Teel was tearing it up since he has come back. He was barely hitting a lick, .190. I would love to see the Sox go out and get a Catcher before the deadline as long as they don't give up too much.

1 hour ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I'm surprised they called up Quero, they really hate Lee. I just hope Quero gets most the starts, he needs the PA. Romo can be the twice a week guy.

1 hour ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I'm surprised they called up Quero, they really hate Lee. I just hope Quero gets most the starts, he needs the PA. Romo can be the twice a week guy.

Lee isn't on the 40 man. They don't like him as a catcher. He was DFA'd at the beginning of the year. 29 other teams didn't want him on their roster. He's hitting .239. Supposedly, the pitchers don't like throwing to him. The organization has made quite clear that he is not in their current or future plans. I'm not sure why people keep asking for him.

3 minutes ago, CBJ03 said:

Lee isn't on the 40 man. They don't like him as a catcher. He was DFA'd at the beginning of the year. 29 other teams didn't want him on their roster. He's hitting .239. Supposedly, the pitchers don't like throwing to him. The organization has made quite clear that he is not in their current or future plans. I'm not sure why people keep asking for him.

The people clamoring for Lee really need to pivot to Turner at this point. At least he's hitting.

10 minutes ago, Quin said:

Does he have have Numenorean blood?

4 minutes ago, DirtySox said:

The people clamoring for Lee really need to pivot to Turner at this point. At least he's hitting.

Bergolla being hurt really messes things up. We need a shortstop to play catcher.

9 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

Does he have have Numenorean blood?

More likely than Teel.

1 hour ago, Bob Sacamano said:

Cherry-picking out the bad starts is literally leaving out key facts haha

There was a good reason for it which they pointed out. Some people dig a little deeper when considering the player as a human being , not a machine.

Edited 2 hours ago2 hr by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

3 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

That's the problem with Thorpe though. He was advertised as a 65-70 command guy and came to the big leagues and had 40 grade command.

Add in the fact that command is the last thing to come back after surgery, and I think he's better off sitting in the minor leagues all year.

I mean, why not just wait and see what he looks like when he comes back. No one is suggesting he’s going to immediately join the major league team. But if a ton of s%*# hits the fan, he went from a guy who looked like had no chance of helping this year to someone who might be able to help.

Don’t get me wrong, we need to go out and add a legit SP, but suddenly he might become part of the depth equation when that seemed far fetched just two weeks ago.

1 hour ago, Jake said:

You'll have to ask Drew. His statement at that time indicated that his elbow was very sore after that excellent third-to-last start. Tried pitching through it the next two times through and it didn't work. Then bone spur surgery, then TJS coming back from the bone spur surgery. The bone spur was surely there to some extent before, but I don't know how much he felt it in the time that he was pitching adequately because I can't ask him. I doubt he faked the whole thing just to try to get Soxtalk off his back about two bad starts though.

So his arm was bothering him during the 3rd to last start but he had good results so we dont throw that one out. Interesting!

3 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

So his arm was bothering him during the 3rd to last start but he had good results so we dont throw that one out. Interesting!

Are these real arguments? If not, nice troll job. You have a gift.

4 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I mean, why not just wait and see what he looks like when he comes back. No one is suggesting he’s going to immediately join the major league team. But if a ton of s%*# hits the fan, he went from a guy who looked like had no chance of helping this year to someone who might be able to help.

Don’t get me wrong, we need to go out and add a legit SP, but suddenly he might become part of the depth equation when that seemed far fetched just two weeks ago.

Only way I'll be intrigued is if it comes out he's sitting 93 now. As long as he has the slowest fastball among mlb starters he won't have much of a chance imo. People just squat on that change and react to the fastball since it cant beat you.

2 hours ago, SoCalChiSox said:

He will need more than just a return of low 90s velocity. He needs another tick or two on the radar gun otherwise his margin for error is slim. It also remains to be seen if his command and the elite changeup remain intact.

Sometimes after TJS, some pitchers gain a bit of velocity. If he can get up to 92-95 instead of 89-92, it would be very helpful.

His velocity was a tick or two higher with the Yankees than it was with us. If that velocity returns, then I think he can be a really good SP. Obviously all caveats apply to a pitcher coming back from major arm surgery.