If the Sox want a 6M/yr pitcher, than why don't they go after LHernandez instead of Ortiz. Here is a statistical comparison of the two over the last two seasons.

 

LHernandez(2003) 15-10 3.20 ERA 233.1 IP 225 H 57 BB 178 SO 1.25 WHIP

Ortiz(2003) 21-7 3.82 ERA 212.1 IP 177 H 102 BB 149 SO 1.33 WHIP

 

LHernandez(2004) 4-7 3.37 ERA 117.2 IP 109 H 36 BB 88 SO 1.23 WHIP

Ortiz(2004) 6-6 4.18 ERA 88.1 IP 84 H 47 BB 73 SO 1.48 WHIP

 

LHernandez is better across the board, has been consistant, and is signed long-term. He has a lower ERA, pitches more innings(good thing since the Sox pen is suspect), walks fewer, strikesout more, and has a lower WHIP. This is a good example of why wins are a poor measure of a pitchers effectiveness. LHernandez is clearly the better pitcher, but he pitches for the worst team with the worst run support. I don't see why the Sox don't go after LHernandez. He is turning into a Colon clone(the Colon before this season) and for far less(6M/yr is a pretty reasonable price for LHernandez). I guess that this would make too much sense.

If the Sox want a 6M/yr pitcher, than why don't they go after LHernandez instead of Ortiz. Here is a statistical comparison of the two over the last two seasons.

 

LHernandez(2003) 15-10 3.20 ERA 233.1 IP 225 H 57 BB 178 SO 1.25 WHIP

Ortiz(2003) 21-7 3.82 ERA 212.1 IP 177 H 102 BB 149 SO 1.33 WHIP

 

LHernandez(2004) 4-7 3.37 ERA 117.2 IP 109 H 36 BB 88 SO 1.23 WHIP

Ortiz(2004) 6-6 4.18 ERA 88.1 IP 84 H 47 BB 73 SO 1.48 WHIP

 

LHernandez is better across the board, has been consistant, and is signed long-term. He has a lower ERA, pitches more innings(good thing since the Sox pen is suspect), walks fewer, strikesout more, and has a lower WHIP. This is a good example of why wins are a poor measure of a pitchers effectiveness. LHernandez is clearly the better pitcher, but he pitches for the worst team with the worst run support. I don't see why the Sox don't go after LHernandez. He is turning into a Colon clone(the Colon before this season) and for far less(6M/yr is a pretty reasonable price for LHernandez). I guess that this would make too much sense.

I'm pretty sure he's not available. If he was, you'd hear much more about him.

i thought he was... if he is, i'd take him in a heartbeat

I'm pretty sure he's not available.  If he was, you'd hear much more about him.

He is available. There have been numerous articles written about him being available. It is a classic case of the Expos trying to get rid of salary for prospects.

He is available. There have been numerous articles written about him being available. It is a classic case of the Expos trying to get rid of salary for prospects.

I agree, I like Ortiz but Hernandez even more.

 

You can be assured if a guy is available, KW has made an inquiry. It might be a situation where they don't match up well in terms of personnel with the Expos.

 

Another factor to consider, since Hernandez is signed for a couple more years, the Expos are perhaps less likely to deal him. The franchise is almost certain to move after this year, and MLB wants them to be competitive in their new market. MLB has to sign off on all Expos trades, other than low level minor league transactions.

 

So it is very likely Minaya is asking for a ton for Hernandez. That would be my theory.

I think this is a pretty good post and I've never been a huge fan of Livan, but I think you bring up a very good piont and I do think Livan could be had.

Livan is a good idea.

 

Then again, with Garland as #3, Show #4 and Diaz/Rauch - #5, just about ANY quality ML pitcher is an improvement.

 

It all depends on whether or not JR is really serious about GOING FOR IT -- as opposed to 2003 half-assed version of "going for it" on a 50 Mill budget.

 

If JR is willing to spend (read: pay remaining salary), then you can get somebody better than Ortiz. Sox need a pitcher and a BP arm, true, but a letigimate #1 is a must if they're to have a chance in ALDS against either East Coast teams.

Livan's a good idea, but there's no way he's available.

 

when he signed a three year deal that starts next season in April he took his name off the market. The Major league operated team would not have signed him @ 8MIL,8MIL, &7MIL over the next three years for him to me moved.

 

They want him as the centerpiece of the new franchinse in NOrther Virgina, Portland, Whereever.

I agree, I like Ortiz but Hernandez even more.

 

You can be assured if a guy is available, KW has made an inquiry.  It might be a situation where they don't match up well in terms of personnel with the Expos.

 

Another factor to consider, since Hernandez is signed for a couple more years, the Expos are perhaps less likely to deal him.  The franchise is almost certain to move after this year, and MLB wants them to be competitive in their new market.  MLB has to sign off on all Expos trades, other than low level minor league transactions.

 

So it is very likely Minaya is asking for a ton for Hernandez.  That would be my theory.

Agreed. I bet Kenny has inquired about every pitcher that even has a slight chance of being dealt...

FYI, ortiz shut out the orioles today 5-0, he pitched 7 innings.

He is available. There have been numerous articles written about him being available. It is a classic case of the Expos trying to get rid of salary for prospects.

.........And continue their role in MLB as a farm system for every other team out there.

I thought his arm and bat were Mickey Mantle-esque.

You sound like Hawk Harrelson. I hate it when analysts compare guys to the all time greats.

 

Todd Van Poppel is NOT the next Nolan Ryan.

I don't know how I'm the first to report this, but I guess they're saying on the Score that the rumor is now....

 

Mags for Andruw Jones and Russ Ortiz

lol

 

Or they read my posts this morning.

 

If its that deal straight up, the Sox have to seriously consider it. (I would say take it if you can get Jones signed to a deal of a little less than we were going to offer Magglio.)

 

SB

I don't know how I'm the first to report this, but I guess they're saying on the Score that the rumor is now....

 

Mags for Andruw Jones and Russ Ortiz

That seems like a lot to give up for a rent-a-player, unless they save some money on that deal and plan to slash payroll drastically for next season.

Looks like a fantastic deal from the Sox perspective, but would JR allow KW to take on that amount of payroll?

It would be about +4mil for th White Sox.

 

Jones makes 12 mil, Ortiz $6mil.

 

Ordonez makes 14mil.

 

Wed add some salary, but it would be a pretty huge reward.

 

SB

It would be about +4mil for th White Sox.

 

Jones makes 12 mil, Ortiz $6mil.

 

Ordonez makes 14mil.

 

Wed add some salary, but it would be a pretty huge reward.

 

SB

That's not bad at all, considering the 2 mil the Sox stand to save from getting rid of Koch.

That would be a really nice deal for the Sox, let's hope it's more than just dumbass Score bulls***.

A. Jones is awesome defensively but is the Valentin of the Braves (and I'm sure you know what I mean.) But my god what an upgrade. Ortiz is ok too, even though I'm not that high on him.

Of course.....just speculation.... but interesting.

Ortiz, Andruw to Sox for Mags and John Rauch

heres the link and how the deal could be done.

www.ajc.com/braves/content/sports/braves/0604/27notes.html

 

Thats from the Atlanta County Journal, I dont feel like subscribing but a Brave's fan posted the link.

 

I kind of expected that we would have to throw them a prospect, but whatever the case both Brave and Sox fans are talking about it.

 

Probably means that we never will see it happen.

 

SB

I just don't see Jones being involved considering the White Sox won't spend "Jones" money on Maggs. Just doesn't seem right.

Thats from the Atlanta County Journal, I dont feel like subscribing but a Brave's fan posted the link.

 

I kind of expected that we would have to throw them a prospect, but whatever the case both Brave and Sox fans are talking about it.

 

Probably means that we never will see it happen.

 

SB

Hell, the Braves would love to get rid of those contracts, don't you think?

Doesn't Jones hav about 5 to 6 years left on his contract? Can't see us doin that deal.

Well thats why on a basic level it makes sense.

 

We know that Williams liked Beltran, and has always been looking for a CF upgrade. We also know Williams once tried to trade for Ortiz, so he probably still has aspirations of acquiring him.

 

The Braves are struggling and need a big time bat, they have the money and probably think if they trade for Maggs, and start working on him now, they can prevent him from getting to free agency.

 

I mean with talents like this, some times the grass looks greener on the other side of the fence.

 

I hope it happens, but after watching the Nomar A Rod trade saga, Ill say Im not optimistic.

 

(Last I can see he signed a 6 year 75 mil contract in 2002, which means he has 4 more years after this. Its probably about 4 years 48 mil, which is less than Maggs wanted. Also of note, he is a Boras client. So extra suspicious.

 

SB

I dont really like this one. We have to put up with Jones' contract until 2009. I'd much rather just go get Ortiz for some prospects. I've been talking to alot of Braves fans tonight and they dont like it much either. They think they could get a lot more for Ortiz and Jones than just Mags and John.

KW said Maggs would not be traded guys and Atlanta is under .500 this makes no sense for Atlanta at all.