Jon Garland signs a 3 year extension

[Steff]

It was for 1 year, or year 1?

 

 

Didn't hear Garland say anything about it.. the dopes on AM100 are reporting year 1 NT clause, but as I said, the CBA prevents that... unless like Mike said something else was worked out.. but that makes no sense.

[Steff]

My bad, his first appearance was in 2000. No CBA violation.

[JUGGERNAUT]

If by long term you mean 3 yrs then yes I think Kenny is trying to lock up Contreras for another 3 yrs. The guy is at the top of his game right now & if he continues to pitch the way he did for the 2nd 1/2 of 2005 there are few that can measure up to him.

 

BMac wasn't traded up til now because the rotation was not solidified for 2 yrs like it is now. If Jose signs an extension then applying your logic that both Freddy & Mark are near locks to be re-signed then only Javier drops out of the equation in 2008. By 2008 you don't believe the White Sox will have another young pitcher ready to crack the rotation?

[beck72]

If by long term you mean 3 yrs then yes I think Kenny is trying to lock up Contreras for another 3 yrs.  The guy is at the top of his game right now & if he continues to pitch the way he did for the 2nd 1/2 of 2005 there are few that can measure up to him.

 

BMac wasn't traded up til now because the rotation was not solidified for 2 yrs like it is now.  If Jose signs an extension then applying your logic that both Freddy & Mark are near locks to be re-signed then only Javier drops out of the equation in 2008.  By 2008 you don't believe the White Sox will have another young pitcher ready to crack the rotation?

BMac won't be traded. The sox can't have a NYY like salary for their starting rotation. With Garland locked up, Jose or Vazquez are likely to be traded

[JUGGERNAUT]

With respect to the Garland camp which players on the White Sox have the best opportunity for endorsements both locally & nationally? Is it unreasonable to suggest that Jon can make between $5-6M a yr in endorsments by staying with the CWS over the next 3 yrs?

 

The White Sox would like nothing better than to strike a dagger in the heart of Cubbydom by promoting Garland as the poster child for the team.

[RockRaines]

BMac won't be traded. The sox can't have a NYY like salary for their starting rotation. With Garland locked up, Jose or Vazquez are likely to be traded

I would rather trade Freddy.

[southsideirish71]

If by long term you mean 3 yrs then yes I think Kenny is trying to lock up Contreras for another 3 yrs.  The guy is at the top of his game right now & if he continues to pitch the way he did for the 2nd 1/2 of 2005 there are few that can measure up to him.

 

BMac wasn't traded up til now because the rotation was not solidified for 2 yrs like it is now.  If Jose signs an extension then applying your logic that both Freddy & Mark are near locks to be re-signed then only Javier drops out of the equation in 2008.  By 2008 you don't believe the White Sox will have another young pitcher ready to crack the rotation?

 

I think it makes more sense that Conteras will be the one to go.

 

Vasquez is a stuff type pitcher like Conteras. However Vasquez is under control for a few years. Conteras's value has never been so high. He can be a number 1 type pitcher. The Dodgers would love a guy like this that can immediately go to the front of their rotation.

 

If they can trade Conteras who is a bit older, they will have a nice young core locked up for a long time in the rotation.

 

KW keeps pulling the wool over our eyes so who knows. Everyone pretty much had Garland gone after this year. Who knows whats next.

 

 

 

Bmac is ready to be our 5th starter. He is cheap, his arbitration clock is now ticking, and gives us financial flexibility to resign a Buerhle

[beck72]

I would rather trade Freddy.

Unless he's cheating on Ozzie's neice, I don't see it

[RockRaines]

Unless he's cheating on Ozzie's neice, I don't see it

I didnt say THEY would rather trade Freddy. I said I would. He makes the most sense to me, and frankly I think that down the road he may be the least effective arm we have.

[Steff]

I didnt say THEY would rather trade Freddy.  I said I would.  He makes the most sense to me, and frankly I think that down the road he may be the least effective arm we have.

 

I agree. I don't see Jose going anywhere until, at the earliest, the break.

[Milkman delivers]

I seriously doubt we sign Contreras to an extension at this point. We can't really afford to have 5 pitchers signed to sizeable deals, and I seriously doubt we'd let Mark and/or Freddy walk after 2007. This is especially true because McCarthy can probably give us similar, or at least credible, production for a much lower price. I gotta believe that the answer right now is that we see if someone will bowl us over with an offer for Jose or Jon, and if that doesn't happen we keep them both and put McCarthy in the pen. If Jose pitches poorly this year, maybe we try to deal him to a pitching desperate team at the deadline, if not, we let him walk and get the draft picks. We're going to need at least one cheap starter for the future, otherwise our payroll is going to get ridiculous. McCarthy isn't likely to get traded because he's way too valuable. He's a good, cheap, young pitcher, something that everyone is looking for. We'd have to get a big-time player back for him that doesn't have a ridiculous contract, something that probably won't happen.

 

Out of a lot of possible scenarios/ideas in this thread, this post really seems to explain this signing the best.

 

I am still pretty confused by this, though.

[beck72]

I think it makes more sense that Conteras will be the one to go. 

 

Vasquez is a stuff type pitcher like Conteras.  However Vasquez is under control for a few years.  Conteras's value has never been so high. 

 

It might have come down to who re-signed first. With Jon re-signing first, the sox don't have the money to pay position players and pay a starting rotation $50 mill

 

Someone has to go.

[ZoomSlowik]

If by long term you mean 3 yrs then yes I think Kenny is trying to lock up Contreras for another 3 yrs.  The guy is at the top of his game right now & if he continues to pitch the way he did for the 2nd 1/2 of 2005 there are few that can measure up to him.

 

BMac wasn't traded up til now because the rotation was not solidified for 2 yrs like it is now.  If Jose signs an extension then applying your logic that both Freddy & Mark are near locks to be re-signed then only Javier drops out of the equation in 2008.  By 2008 you don't believe the White Sox will have another young pitcher ready to crack the rotation?

 

I'm sorry, I don't see there being any chance that we sign Contreras for 3 years. He'd be 38 by the end of that (maybe more, you know the ages on Latin players is iffy), and it would probably cost us the same as Jon. That's not going to happen.

 

BMac wasn't traded because you can't deal good young pitchers unless you get top talent back. We had 5 starters last year with all of them signed for 06, so nothing has changed on that front.

 

You're missing the point on rotation spots on your last comment. You're assuming Jose signs an extension, which seems like a longshot. In all likelyhood Jose is either going now, or at the end of the year and netting us two prospects. That would leave us with Jon through 08, Javier through 08, BMac for a while, and extensions needed for Mark and Freddy after 07.

 

Right now it doesn't look like there are any starters in the minors that are going to be ready for a while. Gio was probably the closest after BMac, and he's gone. Most if not all of our better pitchers now are at AA or lower, meaning they are probably at least 2 years off, maybe more. Even then they might not be ready to be a full time starter. Someone would really have to step it up to be ready to take a rotation spot by 2008 the way it looks right now. If someone does come out of nowhere to be as polished and ready for the majors, we could consider letting Mark or Freddy go.

 

The Jose/Bmac situation is a lot different right now because Jose is our oldest starter by several years, he's the only one who's contract is up right now, and a guy who appears to be the best pitching prospect we've had since at least Garland is getting close to being ready to contribute. It would take a drastic reversal of philosophy and a major contradiction of past actions to sign an older starter to an expensive deal while dealing a promising young starter at the same time. I don't see any chance of it happening, and if by some miracle it does one of our other 4 current starters is probably gone. BMac seems about as untouchable as you can get.

[JUGGERNAUT]

It's true were not the NYY's. We do not sign pitchers to $10M+ a year for 5-6 yrs. We are more like NYY-lite. We will sign pitchers to $10M+ a year for 2-3 yrs.

 

Are we capable of supporting a $50M rotation for the next 5 yrs? Yes. The White Sox have a much better TV contract now that should double the revenue of the old one. They have quickly moved to the top of the list in national merchandise sales. Sure the World Series has something to do with that but only Boston outsold them in comparison to previous champions. They are far outperforming what the Marlins, Angels, & D-Backs did. They should see at least a $30M boost in gate revenue next year.

 

So yes I think Kenny is planning for the future with the intent of stretching the payroll to the $100 million mark.

[Milkman delivers]

Really, there's probably only two ways this will go. They might trade Contreras for bullpen/prospects or they'll keep Contreras and use McCarthy in the bullpen.

 

But, it's KW so we'll never know until something happens.

[Steff]

BMac seems about as untouchable as you can get.

 

 

For the right piece to the puzzle, no one is untouchable.

[WCSox]

Am I the only one who thinks that Kenny should wait until July before considering more trades? Why trade one of your accomplished, seasoned vets and throw the relatively inexperienced McCarthy in the #5 spot? Can't we wait until next winter (or at least July) before dumping Contreras?

 

While an experienced CF would be nice, I don't really want a high-priced player like Tejada sucking up a ton of payroll. Sure, his bat would be nice, but it would be at the expense of pitching... and you can never have enough quality starting pitchers. We'll do fine offensively with our current group.

[JUGGERNAUT]

Some of you are COMPLETELY ignoring what Kenny has done & what he was rumored to be doing with young, cheap, starters. Perhaps the Garland for Eckstein trade rumor rings a bell? Kenny has shown no hesitancy at all to trading young cheap pitchers if he can get the PLAYER he wants.

 

Is Crawford that player? Time will tell. Ozzie made a proclamation before the confetti has been swept away from the celebration: I want a new #2 hitter to take the pressure off Pods & to move up to #1 when Pods can't play. Uribe is not a proven player to fill that role.

[ZoomSlowik]

It's true were not the NYY's.  We do not sign pitchers to $10M+ a year for 5-6 yrs.   We are more like NYY-lite.  We will sign pitchers to $10M+ a year for 2-3 yrs.

 

Are we capable of supporting a $50M rotation for the next 5 yrs?  Yes.  The White Sox have a much better TV contract now that should double the revenue of the old one.  They have quickly moved to the top of the list in national merchandise sales.  Sure the World Series has something to do with that but only Boston outsold them in comparison to previous champions.  They are far outperforming what the Marlins, Angels, & D-Backs did.  They should see at least a $30M boost in gate revenue next year. 

 

So yes I think Kenny is planning for the future with the intent of stretching the payroll to the $100 million mark.

 

We're not going to have a $50 mil in the long run because we also have Paulie and Thome signed to rather large contacts for a while. That puts us around $70 mil for 7 players, which isn't going to work for us. That leaves us about $30 mil for the other 18 players, some of which is already committed or will have to be committed for guys like AJ, Dye, and Uribe. That means we're either laden with young players or cheap castoffs from elsewhere unless we kick the payroll well past $100 mil. It's also probably not going to be a $50 mil rotation when we extent Freddy and Mark, it'll be closer to $60. There's no telling right now if the enormously high ticket sales and merchandise sales stay put. At least some of those season ticket sales came from the World Series ticket offer, and some of them probably won't stick (it seems like a lot of them are Cubs' fans that cashed in, check E-bay or stubhub for people selling the whole season. There are several), and a lot of that merchandise money comes from playoff related stuff. One injury plagued or underachieving season where we come up short can cost us a lot of that, or possibly even a first round loss. Our future revenue is far from a sure thing, so I seriously doubt they are going to put us past $100 mil in the long run. It makes a lot more sense financially to give a talented young guy a shot than to spend $9 mil more on a starter that we probably don't need.

Edited December 28, 2005 by ZoomSlowik

[Chisoxrd5]

For the right piece to the puzzle, no one is untouchable.

 

Cue emphatic da, da, daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa music.

 

Hire out Gene Honda to say, "FOR THE RIGHT PIECE TO THE PUZZLE, NO ONE IS UNTOUCHABLE"

 

[ZoomSlowik]

For the right piece to the puzzle, no one is untouchable.

 

I didn't say he was untouchable, I said he was about as close as you could get.

[Steff]

Cue emphatic da, da, daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa music.

 

Hire out Gene Honda to say, "FOR THE RIGHT PIECE TO THE PUZZLE, NO ONE IS UNTOUCHABLE"

 

 

 

Yuk, yuk, yuk...

[beck72]

I didnt say THEY would rather trade Freddy.  I said I would.  He makes the most sense to me, and frankly I think that down the road he may be the least effective arm we have.

Vazquez could be another option. He also seems the biggest project.

[Steve Bartman's my idol]

Am I the only one who thinks that Kenny should wait until July before considering more trades?  Why trade one of your accomplished, seasoned vets and throw the relatively inexperienced McCarthy in the #5 spot?  Can't we wait until next winter (or at least July) before dumping Contreras?

 

While an experienced CF would be nice, I don't really want a high-priced player like Tejada sucking up a ton of payroll.  Sure, his bat would be nice, but it would be at the expense of pitching... and you can never have enough quality starting pitchers.  We'll do fine offensively with our current group.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In general, "You are correct sir!"

 

But, players like Tejada don't come along too often...you gotta get them if/when you get a chance.

[Steff]

I didn't say he was untouchable, I said he was about as close as you could get.

 

OK..

 

TomAAAtoe, tomahhhtoe.

 

I think the board understand what you meant and my follow up.