Russia v Georgia

[NorthSideSox72]

This is ugly. Here is a main story about the situation in South Ossetia.

 

Here is an update - the Russians have started bombing the Georgian capital, Tblisi. Things are already spilling over.

[bmags]

I hate Russia.

[mr_genius]

I don't see what the US can even do about this, except condemn Russia's actions. What if Russia decides to just take Georgia back?

[Jake]

My initial reaction was that Florida, Alabama, South Carolina, North Carolina, and Tennessee would not stand for this.

[mr_genius]

My initial reaction was that Florida, Alabama, South Carolina, North Carolina, and Tennessee would not stand for this.

 

i knew this post was coming

[WilliamTell]

My initial reaction was that Florida, Alabama, South Carolina, North Carolina, and Tennessee would not stand for this.

 

haha Georiga can't even give away the Falcons and Thrashers.

[WilliamTell]

I heard on I think it was NBC that Russia blames the United States and other Western countries for supposively supplying Georgia with weapons. I know it's much easier said than done, but if I lived in Georgia and wanted to be part of Russia, I'd move to Russia.

 

 

[HuskyCaucasian]

We should ALL be very worried about Russia.

[DrunkBomber]

We should quit trying to appease the rest of the world and tell them all to f*** off

[mr_genius]

We should quit trying to appease the rest of the world and tell them all to f*** off

 

I'm pretty much with you on this one drunkbomber. Let the Europeans deal with this. They hate America? fine. take care of your own stuff. No US troops in Europe to deal with this.

[HuskyCaucasian]

I'm pretty much with you on this one drunkbomber. Let the Europeans deal with this. They hate America? fine. take care of your own stuff. No US troops in Europe to deal with this.

I've been a big proponent of what i call "America First". Many try to brand it as "isolationism".

My basic a belief is you let locals deal with their issues. Only go over if it gets out of control. One of the things people forget is that 9/11 and the current "terrorist hate" for America is rooted deeply in our constant pocking around in the middle east. Obviously hindsight is 20/20 and at the time many of out 60s and 70s middle east operations seemed like a good idea. But it clearly blow up in our face... literally.

 

We didnt get involved in WW2 until we were drawn in. We could debate for days if we had gone in sooner maybe the war could have been minimized.

[Gregory Pratt]

I've been a big proponent of what i call "America First". Many try to brand it as "isolationism".

My basic a belief is you let locals deal with their issues. Only go over if it gets out of control. One of the things people forget is that 9/11 and the current "terrorist hate" for America is rooted deeply in our constant pocking around in the middle east. Obviously hindsight is 20/20 and at the time many of out 60s and 70s middle east operations seemed like a good idea. But it clearly blow up in our face... literally.

 

We didnt get involved in WW2 until we were drawn in. We could debate for days if we had gone in sooner maybe the war could have been minimized.

 

No it's not. It's about the Caliphate. It's about establishing a world-over Islamic government.

[HuskyCaucasian]

No it's not. It's about the Caliphate. It's about establishing a world-over Islamic government.

Osama Bin Laden hate for America is rooted in the wars in the 70s and 80s. He is the defacto "death to america" leader.

 

EDIT:

Well, we are both kind of right.

From Wikipedia-

"However, during this time Iraq invaded Kuwait and Laden met the Crown Prince Sultan of Saudi Arabia, and told him not to depend on non-Muslim troops and offered to help defend Saudi Arabia. Bin Laden was rebuffed and publicly denounced Saudi Arabia's dependence on the US military. Bin Laden's criticism of the Saudi monarchy led that government to attempt to silence him."

Edited August 9, 2008 by Athomeboy_2000

[mr_genius]

I've been a big proponent of what i call "America First". Many try to brand it as "isolationism".

My basic a belief is you let locals deal with their issues. Only go over if it gets out of control. One of the things people forget is that 9/11 and the current "terrorist hate" for America is rooted deeply in our constant pocking around in the middle east. Obviously hindsight is 20/20 and at the time many of out 60s and 70s middle east operations seemed like a good idea. But it clearly blow up in our face... literally.

 

We didnt get involved in WW2 until we were drawn in. We could debate for days if we had gone in sooner maybe the war could have been minimized.

 

I agree. If Obama came out with a platform like that he would see a nice boost. I know a lot of Americans are fed up with the United States fitting the bill for world protection. The truth is we can't afford it anymore.

Edited August 9, 2008 by mr_genius

[Balta1701]

I agree. If Obama came out with a platform like that he would see a nice boost. I know a lot of Americans are fed up with the United States fitting the bill for world protection. The truth is we can't afford it anymore.

Once again I have to disagree with you here. The problem is not that the U.S. can't afford to foot the bill to take care of parts of the world that fall apart. The problem is that the U.S. can't afford to do that while at the same time running 2 other full scale wars and turning its back and scoffing at everyone else in whatever area of the world doesn't agree with us.

 

I'll give you a great example. Liberia. Perhaps the best foreign policy bit of the entire Bush Administration. The country was in crisis back in 2003, former U.S. colony, the U.S. committed a limited stabilization force for a limited time under fairly strict rules of engagement, and for a limited cost helped stop a brewing civil war and gave the country a chance to start getting back on its feet with the help of the U.N. troops we escorted in. The former dicator/President is now going before the international court. The U.S. leadership actually helped there and did a good job.

[Balta1701]

From the "Why should I care about this conflict" category...

Georgia has no significant oil or gas reserves of its own but it is a key transit point for oil from the Caspian and central Asia destined for Europe and the US.

 

Crucially, it is the only practical route from this increasingly important producer region that avoids both Russia and Iran.

 

The 1,770km (1,100 miles) Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan pipeline, which entered service only last year, pumps up to 1 million barrels of oil per day from Baku in Azerbaijan to Yumurtalik, Turkey, where it is loaded on to supertankers for delivery to Europe and the US. Around 249km of the route passes through Georgia, with parts running only 55km from South Ossetia.

 

...

The latest eruption of violence could easily spur fresh attacks. The BTC pipeline, which is buried throughout most of its length to make sabotage more difficult, was a politically highly charged project. It was firmly opposed by Russia, which views the Caucasus as its own sphere of influence and wants central Asian oil to be exported via its own territory.

 

Russia also backs the South Ossetian and Abkhazian separatists in Georgia and relations between Moscow and Tbilisi have curdled into outright hostility in recent months.

 

The BTC pipeline, which cost $3 billion to build, is a key plank of US foreign policy because it reduces Western reliance on oil from both the Middle East and Russia.

Report, Russia targets pipeline

[mr_genius]

Once again I have to disagree with you here. The problem is not that the U.S. can't afford to foot the bill to take care of parts of the world that fall apart. The problem is that the U.S. can't afford to do that while at the same time running 2 other full scale wars and turning its back and scoffing at everyone else in whatever area of the world doesn't agree with us.

 

I'll give you a great example. Liberia. Perhaps the best foreign policy bit of the entire Bush Administration. The country was in crisis back in 2003, former U.S. colony, the U.S. committed a limited stabilization force for a limited time under fairly strict rules of engagement, and for a limited cost helped stop a brewing civil war and gave the country a chance to start getting back on its feet with the help of the U.N. troops we escorted in. The former dicator/President is now going before the international court. The U.S. leadership actually helped there and did a good job.

 

The Liberia situation seems like something the UN could have handled on it's own. Seems like none of our business really. I'm fine with the US participating in UN missions, but only to an equal extent to other countries.

[mr_genius]

I've decided to flip flop on this. We need to help this country out. They are a pretty good ally and have even sent 2,000 troops to help in iraq.

[lostfan]

No it's not. It's about the Caliphate. It's about establishing a world-over Islamic government.

That's oversimplifying it.

[HuskyCaucasian]

The Russian Deputy Prime Minster was just on CNN and accused Georgia of Ethnic Cleansing like that of Kosovo.

[southsider2k5]

The Russian Deputy Prime Minster was just on CNN and accused Georgia of Ethnic Cleansing like that of Kosovo.

 

Project much?

[HuskyCaucasian]

Ok, so my sister isnt exactly the brightest bulb in the box...

apparently on Saturday my sister came into my parents family room all concerned as to why Russia was invading Georgia... the state.

 

Ok, to be fair to here, she IS smart, just doesnt know jack squat about international affairs.

Edited August 11, 2008 by Athomeboy_2000

[kapkomet]

They like peanuts. And Atlanta.

 

[HuskyCaucasian]

They like peanuts. And Atlanta.

LOL! My sister was like "you can take the peaches... just go away" lol

Her first thought as "how did they get all those tanks here?" lol

[Steve9347]

What we have here is Russia, having rebuilt it's economy after becoming insignificant for quite a period of time, is putting itself back on the map. They are targeting the oil pipeline to gain power in the world.

 

Now, it either ends there, and they get some oil money, or they slowly try to grow their territory, start putting nukes in Cuba, and we all feel like the Cold War is back and better than ever.

 

I just feel like these actions are the gateway to a scarier Russia. A Russia that used to be feared, big time.