RockRaines Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 QUOTE (Tex @ Mar 26, 2012 -> 01:58 PM) Again, coming from a retired D1 AD at a school that has only made two NCAA men's basketball tournaments. Each time the guy moves up he has a tougher time evaluating talent. There are noticable differences between the 300 and 325 best players in the country, far fewer between the 23rd and 25th. It starts getting into intangibles. He was the lead recruiter for Mike Conley, Greg Oden and Dequan Cook. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmteam Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Mar 26, 2012 -> 01:48 PM) He was rivals recruiter of the year in 2006. The guy brought in really good talent at OU as well. Getting Walter Offut to transfer in was a HUGE coup. He will recruit very hard, especially in indiana (surprise!). Also his teams play a much more uptempo attacking style than Weber has been using of late so that will be a welcome addition for UI fans. I know Armon Bassett also transferred there. He was a stud as a sophomore at IU, but then left in the post-Sampson exodus. Heavy rumors he was also one of the dudes dealing, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 If John Groce is indeed even in remote consideration, just LOL. What a complete disaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Mar 26, 2012 -> 06:43 PM) But this "as good" stuff is kind of ridiculous. Go look at Bo Ryan's D1 record before taking over for Wisky. Crean was like 50% at getting to the tournament at Marquette, had a final four run with D-Wade, but was blown out of the gym once he got there. Except for this last year Beilen hasn't done much at Michigan. It's just not a slam dunk that a big name hire will do anything for you. Ask Minnesota fans how Tubby has worked out. Heck, the best coach in the Big Ten had ZERO head coaching experience, and look what MSU's been the last decade. Bo Ryan at least came from Wisconsin. Crean came from a major program. Illinois is on the verge of hiring a guy who is barely above .500 in a conference that is essentially a low-major and has no connections to the state of Illinois. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Just hire Steve Bardo...hey, if the White Sox can do it with Ventura, why not? Kenny Battle can be on the bench with him. Even though I am an Iowa alum, I enjoyed watching the energy that guy brought to the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (farmteam @ Mar 26, 2012 -> 06:01 PM) I know Armon Bassett also transferred there. He was a stud as a sophomore at IU, but then left in the post-Sampson exodus. Heavy rumors he was also one of the dudes dealing, though. Yeah, he transferred to UAB and got kicked off the team there before his transfer year was up. Tex, there is zero doubt Groce knows top talent. He was a top level recruiter for Ohio State for several years. Recruiting should be his strength. When I heard Illinois was looking at him, I thought it seemed like a pretty good fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Mar 26, 2012 -> 11:49 AM) Exactly. I like getting guys that can recruit in second or third tier conferences and have shown the ability to win tournaments and tournament games. I think those guys are the types of hires that stay and are successful. Groce basically recruited a national title contender for Matta, and then went to OU in a football state and won some tourney games. I wonder if Mike Davis is still on his Christmas card list. He should be for those gifts!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 26, 2012 -> 07:47 PM) If John Groce is indeed even in remote consideration, just LOL. What a complete disaster. As opposed to all the other amazing options out there right now? It's responses like this that give Illini fans they rep they have, and puts any coach behind the 8 ball to begin with. None of us know how it will turn out. Cherry picking a stat doesn't prove it one way or another. Edited March 27, 2012 by IlliniKrush Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (IlliniKrush @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 12:29 AM) As opposed to all the other amazing options out there right now? It's responses like this that give Illini fans they rep they have, and puts any coach behind the 8 ball to begin with. None of us know how it will turn out. Cherry picking a stat doesn't prove it one way or another. Have to admit I was really on the Shaka Smart bandwagon, didn't really expect Brad Stevens and not sure if he really wouldn't just be Weber 2.0, Losing on Smart hurts, but yeah after him I don't know enough of the potential candidates to be overly judgemental, I just hope the next coach knows how to run an offense that isn't pass around the 3 point line and shoot last second possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 John Groce...I feel like this is a bad dream. Hopefully I wake up tomorrow and he is old news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (IlliniKrush @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 05:29 AM) As opposed to all the other amazing options out there right now? It's responses like this that give Illini fans they rep they have, and puts any coach behind the 8 ball to begin with. None of us know how it will turn out. Cherry picking a stat doesn't prove it one way or another. Cherry picking a stat? The only stat (3 and 2 tournament record) that even puts him in the conversation has to be cherry picked. He is awful in every other regard outside of a selective three game sample size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 (edited) Well, Iowa certainly learned the lessons of going with the "hot" coaches in Steve Alford (coming off a Sweet 16 at SW Missouri State) and Todd Lickliter. Looks at all the names from the past, like Bruce Pearl, Tommy Amaker, Quin Snyder, Jeff Lebo, Stan Heath, Billy Gillespie, Matt Doherty, Mike Davis...all "coaches of the moment" at different points, but usually coming off strong NCAA appearances. The George Mason coach, for another example. The list goes on and on. For every Mark Few, Billy Donovan or Brad Stephens, there's 5 who flamed out completely. Edited March 27, 2012 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 01:29 AM) John Groce...I feel like this is a bad dream. Hopefully I wake up tomorrow and he is old news. I thought I was the only one here who hadn't joined the John Groce fan club already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Mar 26, 2012 -> 12:32 PM) I can see the frustration of Illinois fans in that it's not as good of a hire as other schools in the conference have made like Michigan, Indiana, OSU, Iowa (somehow), but you have to look at it without orange and blue glasses on, Groce is a pretty decent hire with a good pedigree. Kind of exactly like the football hire. If you want someone who has a chance to recruit extremely well and stick around even if he's successful that he's your guy. If you want a stepping stone guy then guys like Martin, etc would be just that. Haugh made a good point today. If Akron makes an open shot Ohio doesn't make the tournament and this guy is never considered. He may turn out to be the greatest coach in Illinois history he may be awful. It will all come down to recruiting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 02:43 AM) Well, Iowa certainly learned the lessons of going with the "hot" coaches in Steve Alford (coming off a Sweet 16 at SW Missouri State) and Todd Lickliter. Looks at all the names from the past, like Bruce Pearl, Tommy Amaker, Quin Snyder, Jeff Lebo, Stan Heath, Billy Gillespie, Matt Doherty, Mike Davis...all "coaches of the moment" at different points, but usually coming off strong NCAA appearances. The George Mason coach, for another example. The list goes on and on. For every Mark Few, Billy Donovan or Brad Stephens, there's 5 who flamed out completely. Don't forget Keno Davis.Unless they were selling their souls and bringing in a Calapari I think tbis guy from Ohio is probably just as likely to succeed as Smart or Stevens in Champaign at a fraction of the cost. Edited March 27, 2012 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 08:03 AM) Haugh made a good point today. If Akron makes an open shot Ohio doesn't make the tournament and this guy is never considered. He may turn out to be the greatest coach in Illinois history he may be awful. It will all come down to recruiting And in 2010, he needed OT games over the 3rd & 8th place teams in the MAC just to make the tournament. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 02:03 PM) Haugh made a good point today. If Akron makes an open shot Ohio doesn't make the tournament and this guy is never considered. He may turn out to be the greatest coach in Illinois history he may be awful. It will all come down to recruiting Yep, if Akron makes that shot, Tim Jankovich looks like the far superior candidate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 If, if, if. I'm starting to believe that most Illinois fans don't deserve a successful coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Brian @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 01:35 PM) If, if, if. I'm starting to believe that most Illinois fans don't deserve a successful coach. We don't appear to be getting one either way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Brian @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 08:35 AM) If, if, if. I'm starting to believe that most Illinois fans don't deserve a successful coach. Well then neither do Sox fans, considering how many b****ed about the Ventura hire and wanted a bigger name. I'm not gonna root for Groce to fail by any means, but it doesn't mean I have to applaud the hire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted March 27, 2012 Author Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 08:03 AM) Haugh made a good point today. If Akron makes an open shot Ohio doesn't make the tournament and this guy is never considered. He may turn out to be the greatest coach in Illinois history he may be awful. It will all come down to recruiting Which everyone agrees he's very good at. For those against the Groce hire, I agree, it's not exciting. But what the hell is the alternative? Reggie Theus? . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 09:49 AM) Well then neither do Sox fans, considering how many b****ed about the Ventura hire and wanted a bigger name. I'm not gonna root for Groce to fail by any means, but it doesn't mean I have to applaud the hire. Let me be clear though...a "bigger name" wasn't what I was after...it was the "experience" at stabilizing a locker room and dealing with the youngsters the Sox needed to develop that I was interested in. I could have been content with a surprise name if it met those standards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 02:52 PM) Which everyone agrees he's very good at. For those against the Groce hire, I agree, it's not exciting. But what the hell is the alternative? Reggie Theus? . Anyone? This guy is very low. Decent Big Ten schools should not be considering coaches from the god awful MAC, let alone coaches who can't even win the conference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenksismyhero Posted March 27, 2012 Author Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 09:01 AM) Anyone? This guy is very low. Decent Big Ten schools should not be considering coaches from the god awful MAC, let alone coaches who can't even win the conference. Name someone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Mar 27, 2012 -> 02:02 PM) Name someone Ben Jacobson. This is a guy who would be a terrible hire, but still has a much better resume than Groce. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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